2016 payroll

[BlackSox13]

Been looking around at players salaries the last few days to see if the Sox have room for one of those big OF bats. Here's what I've been able to dig up.

 

According to Spotrac the Sox currently sit at 107M in salary commitments to 13 players. That 107M includes leftover salaries from Boni, Peavy and Alexei at 1M each.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/chicago-white-sox/payroll/

 

Now factor in projections for arbitration cases for Jones, Avi, Jennings, Lawrie and Putnam that totals 8.6M

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/10/proj...s-for-2016.html

 

So far that's a total of 18 players at 115.6M.

 

Filling out the roster with players making the MLB minimum at 507k each totals just a tick over 3.5M.

 

Now add the 3.5M to the 115.6M and we end up at 119.1M for the '16 payroll. Right around where the Sox were last season.

 

In order for the Sox to sign one of the big FA bats, one of three things must happen.

 

1- JR raises the payroll significantly, 20M+, to cover the additional salary of one of those big bats.

 

2- Sox trade two of Robertson, Melky, Danks or LaRoche ( ya, right ) in order to create the space needed for adding 20M+ in salary for a bat.

 

3- JR raises the payroll moderately and the Sox trade one of the four players listed in #2.

 

Not trying to be a buzz kill, just putting things into perspective. If one of these three things doesn't happen, forget about the dream of signing one of those big bats. As of right now, there isn't enough room for signing Alexei. That's how tight things are as of right now. Let's hope it changes somehow.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think at this point. I've read stuff that says Hahn has last years budget to work with in which case they are already at that limit. I've also read they could raise payroll for the right player and Sox history would back that up.

 

So what does everyone think? Any ideas or predictions as to where the Sox go from here?

Edited December 18, 2015 by BlackSox13

[blackmooncreeping]

Been looking around at players salaries the last few days to see if the Sox have room for one of those big OF bats. Here's what I've been able to dig up.

 

According to Spotrac the Sox currently sit at 107M in salary commitments to 13 players. That 107M includes leftover salaries from Boni, Peavy and Alexei at 1M each.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/chicago-white-sox/payroll/

 

Now factor in projections for arbitration cases for Jones, Avi, Jennings, Lawrie and Putnam that totals 8.6M

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/10/proj...s-for-2016.html

 

So far that's a total of 18 players at 115.6M.

 

Filling out the roster with players making the MLB minimum at 507k each totals just a tick over 3.5M.

 

Now add the 3.5M to the 115.6M and we end up at 119.1M for the '16 payroll. Right around where the Sox were last season.

 

In order for the Sox to sign one of the big FA bats, one of three things must happen.

 

1- JR raises the payroll significantly, 20M+, to cover the additional salary of one of those big bats.

 

2- Sox trade two of Robertson, Melky, Danks or LaRoche ( ya, right ) in order to create the space needed for adding 20M+ in salary for a bat.

 

3- JR raises the payroll moderately and the Sox trade one of the four players listed in #2.

 

Not trying to be a buzz kill, just putting things into perspective. If one of these three things doesn't happen, forget about the dream of signing one of those big bats. As of right now, there isn't enough room for signing Alexei. That's how tight things are as of right now. Let's hope it changes somehow.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think at this point. I've read stuff that says Hahn has last years budget to work with in which case they are already at that limit. I've also read they could raise payroll for the right player and Sox history would back that up.

 

So what does everyone think? Any ideas or predictions as to where the Sox go from here?

 

Why can't they just backload a contract for one of the top FA's? Buck up this year, cover it with the Danks/Laroche money that comes off the books next year. I don't know that I agree that a trade/payer movement from the existing roster is the only way we can bring in one of the big 3...

 

[blackmooncreeping]

Why can't they just backload a contract for one of the top FA's? Buck up this year, cover it with the Danks/Laroche money that comes off the books next year. I don't know that I agree that a trade/payer movement from the existing roster is the only way we can bring in one of the big 3...

Of course nothing can happen without JR signing off...but as you said, history shows he will do it for the right player/situation.

[dpd9189]

Why can't they just backload a contract for one of the top FA's? Buck up this year, cover it with the Danks/Laroche money that comes off the books next year. I don't know that I agree that a trade/payer movement from the existing roster is the only way we can bring in one of the big 3...

 

If they back load a deal for one of the UFA's, then odds are that contract won't have an opt out in it. If you look at Heyward's deal for the Cubs he's getting a major chunk of his $$$ in the first 3-4 years of the deal so if the Sox signed Upton let's say at 6/$120 mil with an opt out after 3 years, there's are real good chance he'd be getting over 50% of the contract in the first few years before the opt out which makes back loading a deal like that difficult.

[BlackSox13]

Why can't they just backload a contract for one of the top FA's? Buck up this year, cover it with the Danks/Laroche money that comes off the books next year. I don't know that I agree that a trade/payer movement from the existing roster is the only way we can bring in one of the big 3...

The conundrum is that the Sox are currently at their limit unless JR raises that limit. If JR does not raise that limit then even a back loaded contract will not work, unless the FA is willing to play for free in '16. No matter what, JR has to raise the limit in order to sign or trade for more salary, period.

[Knackattack]

If they back load a deal for one of the UFA's, then odds are that contract won't have an opt out in it. If you look at Heyward's deal for the Cubs he's getting a major chunk of his $$$ in the first 3-4 years of the deal so if the Sox signed Upton let's say at 6/$120 mil with an opt out after 3 years, there's are real good chance he'd be getting over 50% of the contract in the first few years before the opt out which makes back loading a deal like that difficult.

Well, that's where you gotta sign the guy and say we are going to be good and in playoff contention for the next 2-3 years. You offer him 10M in 2016, then 25M in both 2017/2018.

[GREEDY]

If you can move LaRoche in the deal for a player (Like Cargo), that will eat up a good chunk of the money due in '16 to the returning Outfielder.

 

But I'd hate to see what you'd have to pair with Adam to make a deal like that worthwhile for the other team.

[BlackSox13]

If you can move LaRoche in the deal for a player (Like Cargo), that will eat up a good chunk of the money due in '16 to the returning Outfielder.

 

But I'd hate to see what you'd have to pair with Adam to make a deal like that worthwhile for the other team.

Colorado is smart in that they are waiting until Upton, Cespedes and Gordon sign. The OF market will be rather bare and outfielders salaries will have gone up, already has with the Heyward signing. CarGo is already worth his contract thanks to Heyward's signing and will likely have some surplus value after Cespedes, Upton and Gordon sign. CarGo should bring back a few nice prospects to Colorado.

 

That said, I wouldn't count on Colorado taking on LaRoche's salary. They have no reason to since CarGo is not a salary dump and the Rockies can find a cheaper FA to sign.

[blackmooncreeping]

If they back load a deal for one of the UFA's, then odds are that contract won't have an opt out in it. If you look at Heyward's deal for the Cubs he's getting a major chunk of his $$$ in the first 3-4 years of the deal so if the Sox signed Upton let's say at 6/$120 mil with an opt out after 3 years, there's are real good chance he'd be getting over 50% of the contract in the first few years before the opt out which makes back loading a deal like that difficult.

 

 

The conundrum is that the Sox are currently at their limit unless JR raises that limit. If JR does not raise that limit then even a back loaded contract will not work, unless the FA is willing to play for free in '16. No matter what, JR has to raise the limit in order to sign or trade for more salary, period.

 

 

Well, that's where you gotta sign the guy and say we are going to be good and in playoff contention for the next 2-3 years. You offer him 10M in 2016, then 25M in both 2017/2018.

 

All very good points. I like the scenario of offering 10-12 million for 2016, then jumping up to 20-25 million in the following years before the inevitable opt-out clause after year 3. This way the player would be guaranteed 60+ million over the first 3 years of the deal, with JR only having to really jack up the payroll in 2016.

 

[ChiSox59]

All very good points. I like the scenario of offering 10-12 million for 2016, then jumping up to 20-25 million in the following years before the inevitable opt-out clause after year 3. This way the player would be guaranteed 60+ million over the first 3 years of the deal, with JR only having to really jack up the payroll in 2016.

 

Which is 1 of 2 years we have Frazier and Lawrie under control. It kind of needs to be done. No more of this half-assed stuff. Thankfully, I think the Sox FO is on the same page and will do what needs to be done.

[blackmooncreeping]

Colorado is smart in that they are waiting until Upton, Cespedes and Gordon sign. The OF market will be rather bare and outfielders salaries will have gone up, already has with the Heyward signing. CarGo is already worth his contract thanks to Heyward's signing and will likely have some surplus value after Cespedes, Upton and Gordon sign. CarGo should bring back a few nice prospects to Colorado.

 

That said, I wouldn't count on Colorado taking on LaRoche's salary. They have no reason to since CarGo is not a salary dump and the Rockies can find a cheaper FA to sign.

Agreed, no one is taking on Laroche's contract unless some team's 1b goes down with a spring training/early season injury. Pittsburgh's rejection of the Sox offer to pay $8 mill of his salary this year killed that bird.

[LDF]

Been looking around at players salaries the last few days to see if the Sox have room for one of those big OF bats. Here's what I've been able to dig up.

 

According to Spotrac the Sox currently sit at 107M in salary commitments to 13 players. That 107M includes leftover salaries from Boni, Peavy and Alexei at 1M each.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/chicago-white-sox/payroll/

 

Now factor in projections for arbitration cases for Jones, Avi, Jennings, Lawrie and Putnam that totals 8.6M

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/10/proj...s-for-2016.html

 

So far that's a total of 18 players at 115.6M.

 

Filling out the roster with players making the MLB minimum at 507k each totals just a tick over 3.5M.

 

Now add the 3.5M to the 115.6M and we end up at 119.1M for the '16 payroll. Right around where the Sox were last season.

 

In order for the Sox to sign one of the big FA bats, one of three things must happen.

 

1- JR raises the payroll significantly, 20M+, to cover the additional salary of one of those big bats.

 

2- Sox trade two of Robertson, Melky, Danks or LaRoche ( ya, right ) in order to create the space needed for adding 20M+ in salary for a bat.

 

3- JR raises the payroll moderately and the Sox trade one of the four players listed in #2.

 

Not trying to be a buzz kill, just putting things into perspective. If one of these three things doesn't happen, forget about the dream of signing one of those big bats. As of right now, there isn't enough room for signing Alexei. That's how tight things are as of right now. Let's hope it changes somehow.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think at this point. I've read stuff that says Hahn has last years budget to work with in which case they are already at that limit. I've also read they could raise payroll for the right player and Sox history would back that up.

 

So what does everyone think? Any ideas or predictions as to where the Sox go from here?

 

and that is an excellent break down, and he used a certified know site to get those numbers. i used a guess estimate. i was too lazy.

 

so with the known numbers, what will the team do???

 

[LDF]

Colorado is smart in that they are waiting until Upton, Cespedes and Gordon sign. The OF market will be rather bare and outfielders salaries will have gone up, already has with the Heyward signing. CarGo is already worth his contract thanks to Heyward's signing and will likely have some surplus value after Cespedes, Upton and Gordon sign. CarGo should bring back a few nice prospects to Colorado.

 

That said, I wouldn't count on Colorado taking on LaRoche's salary. They have no reason to since CarGo is not a salary dump and the Rockies can find a cheaper FA to sign.

 

i also think that the marlins and pirates are in that group. funny thing, nothing has come from the stl camp as well.

[LDF]

Been looking around at players salaries the last few days to see if the Sox have room for one of those big OF bats. Here's what I've been able to dig up.

 

According to Spotrac the Sox currently sit at 107M in salary commitments to 13 players. That 107M includes leftover salaries from Boni, Peavy and Alexei at 1M each.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/mlb/chicago-white-sox/payroll/

 

Now factor in projections for arbitration cases for Jones, Avi, Jennings, Lawrie and Putnam that totals 8.6M

 

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/10/proj...s-for-2016.html

 

So far that's a total of 18 players at 115.6M.

 

Filling out the roster with players making the MLB minimum at 507k each totals just a tick over 3.5M.

 

Now add the 3.5M to the 115.6M and we end up at 119.1M for the '16 payroll. Right around where the Sox were last season.

 

In order for the Sox to sign one of the big FA bats, one of three things must happen.

 

1- JR raises the payroll significantly, 20M+, to cover the additional salary of one of those big bats.

 

2- Sox trade two of Robertson, Melky, Danks or LaRoche ( ya, right ) in order to create the space needed for adding 20M+ in salary for a bat.

 

3- JR raises the payroll moderately and the Sox trade one of the four players listed in #2.

 

Not trying to be a buzz kill, just putting things into perspective. If one of these three things doesn't happen, forget about the dream of signing one of those big bats. As of right now, there isn't enough room for signing Alexei. That's how tight things are as of right now. Let's hope it changes somehow.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure what to think at this point. I've read stuff that says Hahn has last years budget to work with in which case they are already at that limit. I've also read they could raise payroll for the right player and Sox history would back that up.

 

So what does everyone think? Any ideas or predictions as to where the Sox go from here?

 

excellent and well played and thought out.

 

i think the only possibility is a trade

 

[Hatchetman]

I was told here that the Laroche/Melky/Duke contracts were insignificant and would not have a bearing on further spending.

[infohawk]

This is where I think the Sox need to make a decision. If they are going to upgrade at three positions (catcher, second, and third) to compete by trading away some young players and taking on salary, then protect your investment/sacrifice by acquiring that one additional player you think might significantly enhance the chance to contend.

 

If the front office has concerns that a weakness at one or two positions might jeopardize contention, yet they can't afford to acquire the player(s) to fill the need and get them over the hump, then it's time to begin a rebuild.

 

What I hope they avoid is making enough moves to only get to the 81-87 win range. Maybe some players have remarkable years and the Sox win 90 or more games. But even so, the next year they could revert back to the 81-87 win range again. I'd like the Sox to become a team that consistently wins 90 plus games just by having their players perform at career norm levels. The team doesn't develop that kind of roster, which is why they have in years past been consistently good enough to finish many seasons at second or, at worst, third in the division. The Indians had an extended run in the late 90s, the Twins through the 2000s, the Tigers over the last several years, and the Royals look to be in the midst of one. The Sox are the only team in the AL Central that hasn't had an extended period of dominance within the division. But they put together a lot of 81-87 win teams. Not gonna cut it.

 

I remember the year, perhaps 2003, when the Sox had a particularly bad hole in the 5th starter slot. They lost a ton of games when the 5th starter was on the mound, yet only lost the division to the Twins by a small number of games. Kenny Rogers was available during spring training and the Sox didn't bother to sign him for the 5th starter slot. Instead, I think the Twins picked him up. Rogers would have likely put them over the top for the division that year (if memory serves). Instead, they left themselves short in the rotation and it cost them.

Edited December 18, 2015 by infohawk

[Dick Allen]

I was told here that the Laroche/Melky/Duke contracts were insignificant and would not have a bearing on further spending.

Why don't you wait until you see how this plays out before you start whining?

[Hatchetman]

Why don't you wait until you see how this plays out before you start whining?

 

I'm not whining, just questioning the board cognoscenti. Either $20 million is a lot or not. Hopefully we'll find out that it isn't.

[LDF]

I'm not whining, just questioning the board cognoscenti. Either $20 million is a lot or not. Hopefully we'll find out that it isn't.

only the owner will answer that

[BlackSox13]

i also think that the marlins and pirates are in that group. funny thing, nothing has come from the stl camp as well.

I think STL ends up signing either Upton or Cespedes. They have the money since they were unable to sign Heyward.

 

I was told here that the Laroche/Melky/Duke contracts were insignificant and would not have a bearing on further spending.

I guess it all depends on the owners willingness to expand payroll and for how much. If the owners expand payroll then no, those contracts do not hinder the Sox but if they don't expand... I would not want Hahn's job.

Edited December 18, 2015 by BlackSox13

[GGajewski18]

I think STL ends up signing either Upton or Cespedes. They have the money since they were unable to sign Heyward.

 

Definitely disagree with this.

 

Upton and Cespedes doesn't fit the Cardinals MO at all imo. Their best fit is Alex Gordon, or like Fathom said, a trade for CarGo.

[BlackSox13]

Agreed, no one is taking on Laroche's contract unless some team's 1b goes down with a spring training/early season injury. Pittsburgh's rejection of the Sox offer to pay $8 mill of his salary this year killed that bird.

No kidding. Pittsburgh's rejection really helped to put things in perspective as far as the possibility of trading LaRoche is concerned.

[BlackSox13]

Definitely disagree with this.

 

Upton and Cespedes doesn't fit the Cardinals MO at all imo. Their best fit is Alex Gordon, or like Fathom said, a trade for CarGo.

And what exactly is the Cardinals MO? How does Gordon provide a better fit than Upton or Cespedes?

[GGajewski18]

And what exactly is the Cardinals MO? How does Gordon provide a better fit than Upton or Cespedes?

 

Left handed bat. Great outfield defense. Gets on base at a higher clip. Good on the base paths.

[LDF]

Left handed bat. Great outfield defense. Gets on base at a higher clip. Good on the base paths.

 

and great lh hitting is their MO..... or is it that maybe this yr it would be a good player b/c of the lh hitting.