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Early disclaimer...if you don’t care about the draft, that’s fine....but don’t ruin this thread. Thanks

And the best part is it’s all because we didn’t sign Manny Machado to one of the five largest deals in baseball history. Despite the fact we offered him $31M+ per over eight years, many believe the White Sox will never sign a quality free agent in the future. If people actually believe that, then they are simply not being rational anymore. All but two or three free agents will get deals for under $100M. For those citing history, we’ve spent $60M on Abreu, $50M on Robert, & $65M on a Danks extension. To think we won’t go up to $100M for a player when we’re sitting on $45M in payroll commitments next year is insanity.

Did you eat a lot of paint chips as a child?

You are incorrect. I talked to him about it recently and multiple others close to the organization. Hostetler is moving to pro side.

A high pick in what looks to be a very strong draft class is very desirable. Go tank go.

I totally respect and understand those of you who are very skeptical of Hahn's comments about being aggressive and your feeling about FO and JR. However, let's take a step back and look at some facts and some opinions. 1. This is year 3 of a major rebuild/tear down. No matter what anyone thinks or says we were not going to compete this year. 2. Injuries to key pieces have even slowed down the rebuild more then the FO and we as fans expected. 3. Even with the above we have begun to see some key pieces, Giolittio, Moncada, Anderson, Bummer, and ReyLo (of late) start to become good baseball players with potential to be very good to great. 4. There are others who most of us agree will also take that next step soon in Cease, Jimenez, Kopech, Robert...... 5. With the players mentioned above we have begun to build a foundation. 6. The FO did not trade away players at deadline like Bummer or Colome who can help us start to turn things around next year. I was upset as many of you with the lack of moves BUT I took a step back thought this through.........we are now getting to a point where we are done trading good MLB players for A or AA prospects (next step of rebuild). We need to start adding on...... 7. Even though the Manny M ordeal from the summer left a bad taste in our mouths and fans......the Sox have a lot of capital to spend and add to the players I mentioned above. The FO has said all along this process that when time comes they will spend the money. The time will start in this upcoming free agency. We need to let that play out. IF they do nothing this winter, then we have every right to boycott, bash, not show up at the ball park. 8. Rebuilds suck and as a major market team we should not be in this situation....BUT we are. We have to let this play out. I truly believe if the FO does what they said they would we are going to start turning the corner to becoming a good team next year. While I am impatient, i am willing to give the FO an opportunity to hold true to their word. If in year 4 we are looking like we are now and the FO has not lived up to their word then I will suffer as a fan and keep my money by not showing up to the ball park. Just my humble thoughts as I wait impatiently, like all of you, for this offseason and for this organization to start turning things around. I am getting frustrated with losing and having to root for all NL teams that play the Cubs. Not how I enjoy watching baseball. But I am sticking to the process of the rebuild and hoping the FO lives up to their words....... Go White Sox!!

Basabe starting to heat up. Now a hit in 11 of his last 14 games.

Yeah that‘s an insane conspiracy theory. Same for proclaiming that Rutherford is a non-prospect in his first stint at AA. I guess it‘s not enough anymore to shit up Pale Hose Talk.

There is also a 2020 draft thread here for those that are interested in talking players.

Obviously not a good series. The starts by Lopez, Gio and Cease are the good to take away from an otherwise awful series. Next year this will be a distant memory.

They battle Detroit 7 times of the last 10 games. Make your plans now.

Moaning about and assuming they will not be able to sign quality players in FA is entirely justified based on their previous offseasons, particularly the last one. I for one don't believe at all that this organization will put >>$200 million anywhere close to the table as an offer for Cole, and we'll see if they prove me wrong.

I refuse to put myself through that Hahn-spin cycle again. I expect nothing because it's Reinsdorf's MO. Given his ridiculously low payroll commitments, I actually allowed myself to believe he was going to sign both Harper and Machado plus a couple of starters. He could have done all of that and still been well under 200 million. If the fans didn't respond, he would have certainly been justified to pull the plug. He never gave us the chance. That would have a been a pivotal moment in his regime and he let slip away. He had a clear path to two future hall of famers in their prime. Just like he was able to buy two major market sports teams for pennies on the dollar (the only reason he owns them), the opportunity to sign two free agents of that caliber with no other big market competitors will never come again. It's his responsibility to put a competitive product on the field. I owe Reinsdorf nothing in advance. If he's not affluent enough to compete, then sell the Sox to someone who can. Evidently that transaction should have been consummated decades ago.

At some point Mike Trout is going to start sucking and you better believe I'll be here to make you guys eat crow.

Walker has the better hit tool, more power and might be able to stick in CF. I have him as the better prospect for those reasons.

Wow. This organization sucks.

I get the feeling more and more that you only scout the stat line

It’s an incompetent GM supervised by a terrible owner...end of story. It’s been two years now of Hahn failing to bring in a possible core player besides the draft.

Dick Allen is on a roll on here. I'd nominate Dick as most knowledgeable fan with PTATC second and fathom third. How bout u guys do a podcast with those three. I think Dick pretty much has correct takes on what's going on with the organization and so called rebuild; I think ptatc speaks for himself re. injuries and fathom has good basic knowledge. How bout u hold a podcast with the big three of soxtalk?

I don't run with this excuse as I said above, but note that the White Sox's attendance has substantially improved this year. Their braggadocio during the offseason about how they were going to add a middle of the order bat put them in the news and likely sold some season tickets. That was one potential motivation to publicly be deceptive.

So why waste all that time and energy if they were so confident in Moncada and Anderson at third and SS? Seems strange they were invested in Machado at third for $250 million (keeping Moncada at second) but not for $300 million...which was the WELL-KNOWN asking price all along. The only conclusion is that they didn’t have a firm handle on how committed the Padres were 1) to spend more even with Myers and Hosmer deals on the books, 2) to pair Tatis and Machado together as early as Opening Day and 3) their pledge to put the best 25 players out there regardless of service time. Along with the weather (Manny was already familiar with SoCal due to Dodgers’ stint) and the Padres having the best farm system, a nicer stadium and better attendance, it wasn’t that hard to choose.

I don’t think it was a con per se, but they weren’t going to pay the going rate IMO. I think they were very comfortable finishing in second. They didn’t he try for Harper, even though fake insider bucket of suck said they loved their position with him. The Nate Jones trade was very telling. The Rangers and Cubs are acquiring bonus money. The Sox would rather save $3 million than perhaps sign a player or players that may help them some day. The bottom line is all that really matters no matter how much White Sox owners have seen their net worth rise through the years.

Bring up Mercedes

From batting 4th to optioned. Ricky is amazing.

The fact that anyone could think those options would be picked up is equally incredible.

I literally posted "white sox draft pick status" underneath the title to give certain posters the heads up.

First I didn't know what it's about. It's also the time of year of NFL training camps, of talking about expanded rosters, of kids going back to school, etc. Secondly I like to read people's opinions on all topics. I like reading opinions of people who disagree with me and I an open to all forms of opinions and revelations. I just shouldn't respond and I won't in this thread. I will read it but no posts after this one. Thank u.

Why click on a thread you have no interest in? I don't understand.

I do love your non stop enthusiasm about the future, Poppy. Keep it up!!!

He had good competitive misses.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/03/largest-contract-each-mlb-team.html But yes, keep thinking Charlie Brown will kick that football. I know he will fall on his ass. If you bring up Machado, the simple fact of the matter is this, they offered him a contract that they knew he wasn't going to sign. Used that offer to sell to the fans that "the money will be spent". They really need new ownership.

I hope he stays up the rest of the season. I don't care if he's awful they have to get a longer look.

Free Yermin!

He's going to end up stuck in the net like some 2-bit spiderman villain.

I didn‘t mind taking a chance on Reed, but he makes Yonder look competent

This offseason is going to see teams that sat out last offseason due to budget issues be a lot more aggressive.

What the White Sox offered Machado was, at the time, the third richest contract in the history of major league baseball. Obviously it didn't happen. But to think they're just going to sit on that money is now is such a funny take. Unfortunately, most people won't believe until they see it, and even if the Sox do some damage in free agency this year, unless they sign a Cole, Strasburg or Rendon, a lot of the usual suspects will still being saying it.

Because they'd prefer to b**** and moan. That's really all there is to it.

Yes I do. They should not be outbid by anybody. No team that is competing or close to competing has the same financial flexibility that we do.

For those of you expecting the Sox to sign a good free agent this offseason, bless your soul. I learned my lesson with Machado. I have no expectations anymore.

As I said said in a previous thread, the FO should never listen to fans, ever.

So Brodie Van Wagenen asks for Vaughn-Madirgal-Cease, you're moving them for him? And how is Tim on your list, but not Moncada?

Ozuna can't play RF and bats right-handed. I dont see the fit but I agree with what you're saying though.

I am actually 100% okay with the quantity approach in free agency. We really need to turn over the 40 man roster and while I could argue otherwise, the team won't look at Rendon as a fit. Past Rendon, Cole is going to be highly desired and it is not reasonable to expect the Sox to sign a pitcher to a 6-9 year deal with an AAV north of a quarter mil. 1) Sign Grandal - 4 years, 64M 2) Sign Alex Wood - 1 year + player option. 11M + 8M 3) Sign Tony Cingrani - 2 years, 19M 4) Sign Brandon Kintzler - 2 years, 10M 5) Trade Fry and a prospect to the Dodgers for Ross Stripling 6) Trade a couple prospects for Brandon Nimmo. Then I assume the Sox will keep Abreu for 1+1 at a cheap price. By April 20th we're looking at: 1) CF Robert 2) 3B Moncada 3) 1B Abreu 4) C Grandal 5) LF Eloy 6) RF Nimmo 7) SS Anderson 8') DH Collins 9) 2B Madrigal - Use the DH as rotating with Abreu getting starts there and Leury getting starts with regular starters getting a look at DH. Your bench is McCann, Leury and couple of others. 1) Giolito 2) Wood 3) Kopech 4) Cease 5) Lopez/Stripling - Stripling can move and back forth from the pen being the flex guy when injuries occur. Rodon returns late in year and Dunning would seemingly be ready midseason for added depth. Pen: 1) Colome 2) Bummer 3) Kintzler 4) Cingrani 5) Stripling and whoever else they want to run with. Is that a perfect team? No. Is it pretty good? I think so. And it won't cost that much. To me the big thing is just signing Grandal.

It's disheartening how many fans just casually say "Just sign Cole." As if it's that easy. What I am watching and hoping for is an opt-out from Stephen Strasburg. That would add one more stud to that top tier of FA SPs with Cole and Bumgarner if you value him as such. That would help our odds at landing one tremendously. If it's just Cole, someone will get stupid and give him $200M and JR aint going there.

I think the points that you, chitownsportsfan and CWS are all good and valid. There are plenty of reasons to be down on him. His K% and BB% and the way they are trending is a bit scary. That said, there are plenty of prospects hitting a wall offensively in the Southern League and in BHam specifically. I think Rutherford swing has looked more powerful this year than it has in the past and despite his struggles, I still see a guy who uses the whole field to hit and isn't awful at any individual aspect of the game. I think getting stronger and growing into his body could make a big difference for the kid. There's still a 4th outfielder in him. I guess what I am trying to say is while I get the argument against his defenders, I can totally see this guy come back next year in Charlotte and put up an OPS over 1.000 in the first several weeks at Charlotte. There are plenty reasons to be down on him but there are a few lingering not to write him off just yet.

Why did they let Belle walk? Why did they put a diminished skills clause in Thomas' contract? Why did they let Ventura leave as a player? Why did Dye/Pierzynski take less money in 05 to come to the Sox? Why did they trade Lee before the 05 season? Why did they go to Paulie and AJ when trying to get Dunn and have them delay their salary to sign him? Why do they seem to trade for guys with 2-3yrs left on their contract rather than singing a guy for 5-6yrs in FA? Why did you just dump money with the Nate Jones trade? What happened in this past offseason? Jon Jay was your biggest FA acquisition... Let that sink in. We met with Bryce at the beginning of FA, had the United Center photo leaked and never another word. The amount of Jersey sales/ticket sales would of paid at least half his salary and that is not counting the endorsement money from being on the cover of games. And the Machado thing... He literally said he wanted $300M and the Sox literally had no competition all offseason until it was leaked their offer was under $200M. And what did he do? Signed for $300M like her said. They saw early on backlash from the fans, and then they had better play from Moncada/Giolitto and the rest of the team. And people got excited and went to games. And they are trying to sell us the same garbage as last offseason. And people are gonna buy it. And we are gonna go into next season with the same results, but this time Robert and Madrigal are going to be on the team doing what Eloy/Moncada/Giolito did this year. And it is just a big circle jerk. This teams problem is pitching, and they REFUSE to pay more than 3yrs to a pitcher. So you are not being "objective" by thinking this is gonna change. People DO NOT CHANGE, they just don't. Jerry cares about money. There is a reason FAs do not sign with the Bulls, and it is not because they have to live up to MJ. It is because he is cheap and puts dumb clauses in contracts. Why? Because Jerry is cheap!

It’s really quite simple...just like in 2004-05. Non-headlining additions, but still quality players across those board who coalesced into something great for 1 1/2 seasons (parallel with the Brewers and Twins again.) The problem at this point is most aren’t confident in Hahn pulling it off. Everything you described is perfectly, 100%, logical and reasonable and rational. Affordable, doesn’t blow the budget into the stratosphere, risk-mitigation (except those pitchers), heck...we were spending well over $120-125 million over a decade ago when we routinely ran Top Ten payrolls out there after the World Series. Just not sure it’s enough to inspire...once upon a time, it was going to be at least a five year window and I can squint back and recall a couple of weeks where Balta had us dominating/eviscerating the entire AL as a dynastic type of team (which is even quickly slipping away through the fingers of the Cubs with almost twice that level of payroll of what we’re aspiring to run out there.) PS: I had a nightmare your Scooter Gennett turns into Derek Dietrich and we’re still adding 1-1.5 fWAR pieces to supplement the core for the next decade. PTSD.

I mean after that disaster last offseason...call me skeptical.