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What do you expect him to say? We’re violating the CBA by gaming his service time, please don’t tell anyone?

One thing that's frustrating to see is how bad the plate discipline is across the low minors. Some kids have shown they have some raw talent, but at the same time striking out 5 or 6 times as often as they walk. You look at both AZL and GF, both teams rank dead last in their leagues in team BBs and 3rd most in strikeouts. Kanny is not much better, ranked bottom 4 in BBs and leading the league in strikeouts. Until the Sox get better as an org in developing plate discipline and helping guys become better hitters, they're not going to be very successful in developing young LatAM or HS position players.

White men can’t jump

June 24 was the last full game they played together.

So you're saying he's somewhat near those guys' level as a prospect? I kid, I kid. Thanks for starting this thread.

IMO, the drop dead date to call up Robert & Madrigal was August 1st. After that, I just don’t believe the benefit outweighs the cost of an extra year of team control. Both guys will likely be fatigued come September and would face a ton of garbage pitching due to rosters expanding. I just don’t view that as vital development experience. As for 2020, the Sox have 13 games in their first 16 days. I wouldn’t be shocked if there are few rain-outs in the mix, so we’re talking about missing 11 to 12 games most likely. While it would definitely suck not having them to start the season, I still don’t think it’s worth losing a year of team control in 2026.

I really hope they aren’t planning to call up Robert & Madrigal. Please don’t listen to those whiny SoxMachine b****es like Pnoles and stay the course.

This may be the most egregious stubbornness ever by a public scouting department. As the year comes to a close and their final scouting adjustments have been made, Robert has maintained his 30 game power grade. To put this in perspective Nick Madrigals game power grade right now is a 40. It is one of the most stubborn stances I've seen and their rationale is comically bad. Luis Robert remains behind Cristian pache by a full FV level as a CF prospect despite being only 1 year older, and performing 70% better offensively and grading out/projecting to be a top tier defensive CF'er. Fangraphs has not moved Robert a single ranking (he remains as their 20th prospect) despite having not just the loudest tools in MiLB but also the loudest production while being young for his level. All you can do is laugh at the stubbornness at this point. Fangraphs have spoken and all you guys saying Madrigal has no power, you are wrong! He has more power currently than Luis Robert.

I decided to create a thread about this kid and have some fun with it. Now bare with me, been doing this long enough to not get caught up in lower level numbers (seen alot of guys flame out covering and watching minor league players for years) but I really like what he's been doing and as a guy only listed 5'11, 175 pounds, the power is very intriguing. In no way am I saying he is nowhere near these guys as a level of a prospect, but just comparing the year he's having with the 2 guys listed who I just happen to glance at and compare in the same league from this past draft and a former Sox farmhand. Again, development is linear for different guys, but it speaks to the year he's having. AZL Jose Rodriguez (age 18) G 42, PA 189, R 26, (49/177 ABs) 2B 5, 3B 3, HR 9, RBI 26, BB 9, SO 42, SB 6 CS 1 (.277/.316/.492/.807 wRC+ 114, wOBA .365) Bobby Witt Jr. (age 19) G 33, PA 161, R 25, (39/149 ABs) 2B 2, 3B 4, HR 1, RBI 23, BB 11, SO 32, SB 8, CS 1 (.262/.311/.349/.660 wRC+ 83, wOBA .312) Fernando Tatis Jr. (age 17) G 43, PA 188, R 35, (48/176 ABs) 2B 13, 3B 1, HR 4, RBI 20, BB 10, SO 44, SB 14, CS 2 (.273/.312/.426/.738 wRC+ 108, wOBA .341) Again, not saying he is anywhere near the level of these two guys (nor saying he will develop like Tatis did or what Witt Jr. is projected to be) but it's interesting to see how close the numbers are with him. Witt Jr. is a full year older and Tatis Jr. was 8 months younger at the time. At this point the Padres promoted Tatis Jr. to low A to finish out his season. AZL Sox are already eliminated from playoff contention (I believe Great Falls are like 2 or 3 games from getting eliminated themselves). Not saying Getz and company should promote Rodriguez to low A (although they play more games down the stretch), but I would like to see him in Great Falls at least to finish out the year.

It's like I don't even know who you are.

I like how Hahn is preaching waiting on guys who pretty much have nothing to prove in the minors whereas you could argue Cease wasn't quite ready yet and they promote him.

Yep his command is atrocious and he needs to find something that will get lefties out. Also would be nice if the overrated, lazy pitching coach would go out to the mound and help him once in a while.

Jay's nickname is enough for me to want him gone. Love Yolmer dedicating his players name this year to his sons.

I think one of the things totally lost in this discussion is that Jose simply doesn’t need to necessarily be even the fourth best hitter on this team in 2020 or 2021. He just needs to be reliable, produce at 80% of his career numbers, and not get injured. It would be totally acceptable for Abreu to have a line like .265/.310/.460/.770 - which I think represents the very bottom of where I see him falling off - considering Robert, Madrigal, Jimenez, Anderson, Moncada, Vaughn, and an upgraded FA right field acquisition will also be in the lineup.

Because they complain regardless of what occurs. It’s absolute nonsense.

The way Collins was handled was the exact opposite of putting him in a position to succeed.

Why would anyone still want Robert called up this season?

Yeah...I know the feeling. I'm smart enough to know when watching game 160 of bad baseball...in just a few days it will be gone for months and months. It's a long winter between games.

I’d prefer a huge run and the #14 pick than staying the course and their current #9 slot

Abreu nearly injured Bummer there with his shit defense.

@The Sir has had a rough year with his calls between Moncada and Robert.

Yes

Agreed, offensively though Devers has been better. Moncada is a well above average 3B on D. It's really hard when you're competing with Bregman, Devers, Chapman and Jose Ramirez to get a ASG nod. There are 5 superstar 3B in each league and only 3 can make the ASG. Moncada just seems like one of those guys that is going to be overlooked because of the team he plays for.

Yeah, too bad review robbed Jay of his second hit.

Moncada is a fucking superstar. That ball was kilt

Would be nice to see him go 6+ and get 10 K's.

Haha my apologies. I don't know what the hell I was thinking.

That’s why you bat Jon Jay cleanup. Should have been his second infield hit.

Logan Glass homer. maldanado been hitting the ball a bit, having a better year 2.

Not even close. Cease strikes out over a batter an inning. Giolito was at 6.5K/9 and also walked more batters. Cease has a 20% HR/FB rate that will normalize.

Out yesterday and today due to a sore hip

Solid start for Pilkington. 6 IP 4 H 3 R 2 ER 1 BB 8 SO

Rally Engel !

I'd be all about those for the new throwbacks. I'm not sick of the current Sox jerseys by any means but I am sick of the '83 throwbacks

And guess what? This is what happens when people have a koosh job for life and are tight with their boss. There is no threat of him losing his job so he can just coast.

I love these Sox jerseys

No, but he’s been incredibly slow to get out there when his guys are having clear mechanical issues. Combined with rumblings about his effort (or lack thereof) off the field, and yes...I’m comfortable saying he’s become very lazy and complacent.

As much as I loved the trade with the Cubs and yes, still do, it should be obvious to Cub fans that neither Cease or Eloy would have contributed anything during their championship window...both of these players will take a while to reach their prime.

“Could”? He was struggling to complete the first inning in AAA.

cease has a long way to go until he's a MLB pitcher.

Basabe 2-2, BOMB, RBI, R Gonzalez 1-2, 2 RBIs Sosa 1-2, 2B, R

Yolmer is a great guy that can't hit a lick. Luckily for him he's already made a decent chunk of change and should be able to catch on somewhere next year.

Nah, they've upgraded individual grades for players throughout the season. They have maintained their power grade by choice. And there reasoning was... well lewis brinson who is also dark skinned and athletic and did cool things in the minors isn't good so Robert isn't either. Brinson never had a year like Robert has had though and literally downgrading a prospect because another human being had good tools and failed is one of the dumbest rationales ever. Players are unique. Lewis Brinsons outcome has nothing to do with Robert's. Prospects of all kinds of abilities and skills have failed. Some elite walk/k rate guys were complete trash. Some elite contact guys with good defense were trash. Robert started the year exactly where he ended it for fangraphs, 20th. Which is absurd unless they expected him to go 35/45 with an ops over 1000 and a 165 wRC+. He was an unknown to start the year.

Nothing personal either, but you and the other guy who responded don't quite get what I'm talking about. Its crazy to want to watch a great, we hope, ballplayer come up and play for our team? Im about to turn 50 and just beat cancer for the 2nd time. I don't care about 7 years from now frankly. My old man is 71 and watches most every game, im sure hes not to worried about 7 years from now either. You might be young, idk, and life looks long, but theres no guarantee you'll be around in 7 years either. Sorry I don't mean to get all philosophical on a baseball message board, but you see where im coming from? I just do not understand the modern baseball fan I guess. I cant grasp not wanting to see this guy in Chicago so the Reinsdorfs can save millions years from now. To me that's crazy. I get a lot of joy, pleasure, whatever the word watching baseball. But you say theres no value in that, its worth nothing? I guess we look at life a lot differently. ..Again, nothing personal.

Sure. I was just pointing out that Collins could be hella valuable as backup/versatile lefty bat.

Do you really think that signing Abreu for about 2 years to ~10-12 AAV is gonna preclude a team with basically no payroll from retaining a reliever or catcher? Because saying Alonso is a better fielding 1B isn't really saying much, and the value gained from playing him there over Abreu is almost negligible

There's no point in expecting it anymore but however many games are left plus however many he misses at the beginning of the year before being called up are all games that can lead him to faster assimilation to ML pitching, At this point what is that 40 games or so if he started every game ? It's all probably moot anyway . The Sox don't want to win in 2020 otherwise they'd have brought him up already . And if they do happen to sign some productive FA's that keep us close to a playoff berth while at the same time Robert struggles for his 1st 40 ish games I'll be here God willing to say "see they should've brought him up." I know it's his 1st year being productive and injury free but seeing so many agree with Hahn is just nauseating. Have fun missing the playoffs again next year Hahn.

I guess this is where I become disconnected in the conversation. Jose turns 33 next year, not 39. Are we really thinking this "crash" is going to happen as soon as next year, after a year where he's going to end up smacking 35 homers and drive in nearly 120 runs, and 35+ doubles? I mean, I can see and probably expect him to come down a bit on those numbers, but only into the 25-30 homer range and 90-100 RBI range, with 30 doubles or so. For $9-$12 million bucks, I'll take that kind of production out of my DH. I know anything is possible, but for Jose to hit that wall where he's totally lost it, I don't see that happening as soon as next year. There's certainly no indication of it as of yet, at least as far as I can see.

I may be one of the few who (somehow) discovered Soxtalk first and never posted at WSI. #homegrown