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Fire La Russa like yesterday for real.

I see you made a WNBA thread in 2013. You seem to bring it up quite often for somebody that doesn't care about it.

Maybe, just maybe, the Astros were t that good and the White Sox had a different issue?

Madrigal is a career .317 BA in 303 AB Vaughn hit .235 with 15 HR in 417 AB. Sheets had 11 HR in only 160 AB. Vaughn regressed in the last few months of the season even as Tony tried to protect him by not starting him against RH pitching. Sox don't really have a spot for him in the 2022 line-up as we saw in the play-offs. He is kind of surplusage.

Welcome to Soxtalk!

Trading Madrigal was an epic failure by Hahn. It was myopic and short sighted. Madrigal would have become the Nellie Fox of the modern White Sox era. Nicky two strikes was an on base producer and a perfect fit at either the 2 or 9 spot in the batting order. He was more than adequate playing at second base. Basically, the White Sox gave away both Madrigal and Heuer without any value exchanged by the Cubs. For 2022 the White Sox should trade Eloy and/or Moncada for quality starting pitchers. Forget signing Rodon and trade Keuchel to a second tier team in exchange for a young and proven but potential starting pitcher or double AA outfield prospect. Play Vaughn regularly in left field and Engel as the starting right fielder. Roberts, of course, stays in center field. Sheets will be the primary DH and play some games at both first base and right field. Bolger takes over at third base. Trade Cease to the Cubs in exchange for Madrigal's return to the South Side. Garcia becomes the super sub relieving TA, Madrigal, and Bolger in the infield. Jose remains at first base. Trade Grandal to the Mets for the return of McCann to be the number one catcher in 2022 with Collins as the backup. Arrange Gio, Lynn, Kopech, Crocket and the pitcher obtained in the trade of Eloy and/or Moncada as the starting rotation. Tepera, Bummer, and Liam handle the 7th, 8th, and 9th innings closeout roles. Foster, Marshall, Rios, and Cordera pitch in the early relief innings. With the above roster adjustments, the White Sox need to respect the fundamentals of baseball: hitting, catching and throwing the ball. Be selective at the plate, reduce fielding errors, and hit the cutoff man.

Sox were 5th in ERA this year. 162 games. In February/March, gospel around here was our offense would crush but we were severely challenged for depth in the pitching staff. Would love to go back and time and ask if the sox finished 1st in pitching WAR and 5th in ERA if they think that would qualify the pitching coach to have done a good job, or if the better evaluation is to be traumatized by a playoff series. For all the talk of cutting the legs out from under the offense to get better at the margins, the pitching staffs no control/ all velo approach seems like the better place to optimize for the playoffs. Getting a guy like Joe Kelly (curveball heavy) or McHugh (slider heavy/cutter) are interesting players to add and Kelly is never fazed in the playoffs.

TA could genuinely think TLR is wonderful. It doesn't make TLR an actually good manager in 2021 or 2022.

A simple it's not my call instead of writing a love letter. It's like he actually likes playing for a Hall of Fame Manager.

And their missing their ace. I believe we beat them if they didn’t have McCullers.

Absolutely. And that turd they threw tonight would've been the starter in Game 4 in Chicago, without the rainout. So this thing would've gone 5 games, with (you guessed it) Lance McCullers starting Game 5 and having to save Houston's bacon. I think we'd look at our series a lot differently under that circumstance.

Surprised at the overreaction on here about what Boston going up 2-1 in the series means for the WSox, in relation to their performance. McCullers was the difference maker in the series and facing him twice in four games was a bad break.

I feel embarrassed that the White Sox looked overmatched by HOU and the Red Sox are making them look weak, SMH

1 more day of hope

After his rookie year Nellie Fox never played less than 130 games until his final season at the age of 37. In his first two seasons Nick Madrigal is averaging about 1/3 of his teams game played.

That is the smartest post you have made in a long time.

Look, the pitching coach is more than just a "mechanics technician." Especially with an ancient alkie as manager who is without his lifelong friend as pitching coach by his side. There's the in game tactical angle, insofar as keeping Alkie Tony from doing colossally moronic things. Such as moronically running out a rookie, on the road, vs a tough trashtros lineup, after he'd just pitched the day before, in a game you HAD TO WIN. Ya know, like a CNA has to keep a watchful eye over the nursing home residents. Or in-game, keeping Grandal from calling 10,000 fastballs in a row. Or in-game, helping the pitchers find the strike zone, instead of letting Lynn, Giolito, Cease, and Rodon walk the yard. Again. Or in-game, not letting Lynn throw 74 of 76 pitches as fastballs, leading to another curb-stomping by the trashstros. There's also the strategic angle, where a pitching coach has to help Alkie Tony setup the pitching staff for the playoffs. Or helping to figure out how to use BOTH Hendriks and Kimbrel, BEFORE the playoffs start. Katz's job doesn't end when he unlocks a player's mechanics. A pitching coach and bench coach have MORE responsibilities with a geezing geezer as manager. So far, they've sucked at the in-game roles, and have let Alkie Tony fuck up royally. A year ago, with an inferior roster to THIS year's roster, heads rolled for perceived coaching fuckups. This year, despite epically bad coaching and managerial decisions that contributed to losing both HFA and the ALDS, we're supposed to be happy we took another humiliating curb-stomping? Sorry, but I can't feature that. If it was OK to launch Renteria and Cooper for shitting their pants, when you see more pants-shitting from this years coaching staff, they should be fired as well.

Do you really think Katz is the reason our pitchers are bad at holding runners? For chrissake how long had Lance Lynn been in the league?

The QO is really stupid and needs to go away but probably won't this year. I think the Sox will offer the QO and Rodon will reject it. Rodon walked off the mound healthy in his last start and that's all he needed to do to secure a multi-year deal. It may not be for $100M but it will be more than enough for him to go back to drinking beer and playing video games all off season. The last thing he wants is another 1 year deal where he has to put in the work during the off season.

If his injury was fatigue, it's a no brainer to offer it to him. If it's something else, it's a no brainer to pass.

Damn Ron just pulled a @Quin and straight up exposed somebody. Well done.

Dude just stop, you're making yourself look like an idiot. I'm sure there's other that don't enjoy the sport, but they aren't stupid enough to start an argument over it. Let the people enjoy the championship.

Tim said the same shit about Renteria. Yet you had this to say about Rick: So... I thought Tim Anderson knows shit about managing? I guess that only counts with TLR? Even though the team got worse in a lot of manager led aspects in 2021 vs 2020.

Again, I don’t know what y’all are expecting the players to say. They’re asked these questions and do you think they’re going to shit on the manager who’s coming back next year? They won’t do that.

Damned if you do, damned if you dont. I think that Rodon would likely accept the QO if offered. Maybe someone is willing to offer him 3/60 this off season (assuming the Sox havent made a similar offer). That said, if Rodon replicates this seasons results next year, he goes into free agency as a 30 year old with around 800 career innings with no draft pick compensation attached to him. Not offering the QO would mean losing a 5.0 WAR pitcher for nothing. Going for Stroman, Ray, Scherzer, etc. would be much more expensive and long term proposition. I think there are serious questions about whether the Sox can depend on Kopech to make starts in 2022 and it seems exceedingly unlikely that Crochet will be a starter. Making the wrong call on Rodon's health would be pretty catastrophic. The Sox now have some expensive players on the books in Abreu (19.6M), Lynn (18.5M), Grandal (18.2M), Keuchel (18M), Moncada (13.8M), and Hendricks (13.3M) all over the 10M threshold. The Sox also have an $16M option on Kimbrel to decide on. If the Sox pick up Kimbrel's option that puts them at $136M for Abreu, Lynn, Grandal, Keuchel, Moncada, Hendricks, Kimbrel, and Rodon. Factoring in TA (9.5M), Gio (8M give or take), Eloy (6.5M), and Robert the Sox are now at $166M. Picking up Hernandez's option, and bringing back ReyLo and Engel puts you at around $178M. The Sox would essentially have to run it back with the same squad in 2022, but would go into 2023 with Keuchel, Abreu, Rodon, and Kimbrel's money off the books. In a vacuum, I think the Rodon QO and the Kimbrel option would both be favorable for the Sox; however, selecting both would be a bold use of limited financial space in 2022. All of that being said. if the Sox believe that Rodon will be healthy in 2022, then you have to extend the QO. You simply cant get that upside for 18M, while also keeping the 2023 budget flexible.

Lot easier to have focused, tough at bats in a close game instead of being down 6-0 or 8-0 early in games

Sign corey seager to play 2b trade for jose ramirez to play rf sign rodon

Red Sox are beating the crap out of the Astros with three grand slams in 2 games. Sox will need to get more balls up in the air next year or and/or hit and run more to stay out of double plays.

This is reaching weirdo obsession territory. A) we all know where you stand on Mr. wrong-shoe-size, and B) the retort is so obvious (he was a rookie who never played above A-ball before this season) that what you’re saying is near worthless. Give it a rest.

@strx2000 - please come back so we can all be entertained.

Maybe, just maybe playing against them without their best two starting pitchers would have been a big difference?

BoSox making the Asstros look like crap the last 2 games.

Just a complete flub by Hahn during the trade deadline. I expect Pilkington to actually be a decent pitcher too.

How about Vaughn and Burger to the Cubs for Madrigal and Ed Howard ?

https://c.tenor.com/prVuu1bPO5wAAAAC/breaking-bad.gif

just a beautiful trade James McCann to White Sox Dallas Keuchel to Mets

Cocaine is a helluva drug.

To be fair, if you're going to talk about Rodon's offseason routine, you have to mention hunting in addition to the items spoken to above.

Not sure if this prediction or mine is more reasonable. ?

The White Sox aren't spending $6M on Cesar Hernandez. They may well resign him later in the offseason, but no one is paying him $6M.

In an alternate universe where Semien isn't traded, this is what YourWhatHurts and other gone-but-not-forgotten posters would have called him from 2015-2018 until he turned into an MVP bat.

I'm with CWS - we have to remember how many dudes got hit by workloads. Now throw in the league switch, the role switch (which, while I think is dumb, it only takes one reckless GM to buy into). I think the Sox could probably get something real nice if they shopped Kimbrel + $4-$8M. I doubt Jerry does that, but, maybe. I could also see them trying to bundle Burger or Sheets in there (but that's by no means necessary).

Nobody is better at holding himself accountable for this team's failures. Shame he can't fix them

If he accepts, that tells me what he thinks of his own health. If he has the confidence to take a bridge contract to try to get to the payday, that makes me feel like he is pretty confident in his health in 2022.

Midnight Mass was one of the best series I've seen. Creepy throughout, several jump-scares, incredible dialogue, and some of the best acting, especially from Hamish Linklater and Samantha Sloyan.

Yea I'm sure absolutely no changes will happen and everything will remain static

Yep, our Sox got exposed in the playoffs pretty much.