wrathofhahn

1. Approximately 50% of his games have been played at third base, and he has benefited from the positional adjustment. He just plays such terrible defense that it does not really help him. 2. What you quoted has nothing to do with WAR; his Fangraphs war is 1.5 largely due to the fact he played half his games at 3B and they are not as harsh on his defense as Bwar is. What you posted is his Offensive runs above average. Furthermore, it does not take defense into account or adjust for position. Though I realize this is stating the obvious, you should have a better DH than a league average hitter. 3. You keep making false claims despite your accusations of bias. I am not biased; I believe he was a useful DH, but the fact that we struggle to identify talent and have players with negative WAR throughout the roster does not make him more valuable in a trade, even though some fans are biased in favor of keeping him. To all others, he appears to be a streaky all or nothing, controllable hitter with no defense. You only need to look at the guys who get DFA'd annually to see that it is not worth much. 4. Ever since we traded for him, Eder has been awful. I am defending the process, not the outcome. The FO should make more of these kinds of moves rather than fewer because this team sucks and our farm sucks we should be focusing on upside rather than making safe trades for marginal prospects.

I am not minimizing anything he has played 103 games and accumulated less than 1 WAR and Marlins on are on pace to lose 105 games. He has some value but his loss is not worth crying over. I'd make the trade 100 times out 100 to acquire a former top prospect coming off an injury. It sucks that Eder appears he won't be the same but you move on and try acquire the next high ceiling guy whose available

https://www.baseballamerica.com/players/7476-jake-eder/ Scouting Report: Before his injury, Eder's stuff placed him among the game's best pitching prospects. https://www.mlb.com/stories/jake-eder-671109 After rocking a 93-96 mph fastball that peaked at 98 with riding action before his elbow reconstruction, Eder pitched more at 90-93 last season and is sitting at 92-94 this year. He has regained the power on his mid-80s slider, which lacks consistency but can be a plus offering with two-plane depth and horizontal action when he stayed on top of it. He has added a low-80s curveball that can miss bats when he lands it in the strike zone, but his mid-80s changeup has gotten firmer and less lively. Eder had a history of inconsistent control and command before dominating in his pro debut, and Chicago is trying to help him regain the delivery he maintained in 2021. If he can repeat his three-quarters arm slot on a regular basis and recapture the stuff he had three years ago, he might be a No. 2 starter. This season, he has looked more like a guy who'll have to be a reliever who relies on his breaking pitches. https://blogs.fangraphs.com/2023-top-100-prospects/ 62. Jake Eder, SP, MIA Before he got hurt, there were folks in baseball who considered him a top 30 prospect, so his ceiling is big enough to include him on the top 100 now even though he’s coming off injury. The average DH is about.750, so finding those hitters should not be too difficult. Burger is a little bit better than that, though. We lionize guys like Burger because we are bad at finding those guys, but every year there are guys off the scrap heap who can hit and give you positional versatility at 750 or so OPS. Even though I would not have wanted to trade him for nothing, I think we should take advantage of the opportunity to acquire a top prospect who has recently returned from injury. Eder was not just a back-end starter before getting hurt; he had front-line stuff. If Eder managed to return to his former form, nobody would be posting about Burger. We attempted a trade with a high ceiling but were unsuccessful. it happens. A soft-tossing MILB pitcher with a 4-5 starter ceiling is not someone I would much rather take a chance on; even if is what Eder turned into after returning, which is unfortunate but sometimes happens. Still, it was a risk that was worthwhile. TJS is a risk some guys come back throwing even harder other guys are never the same.

Eder had value when we traded for him. Teams like the marlins don't make these kind of deals in the offseason. In the offseason they can bring in guys without having to surrender an asset. I know we suck at identifying talent in free agency but a sub .800 OPS DH isn't that valuable in todays MLB. We capitialized on an opportunity yes Eder hasn't worked out but the thought process of the trade was sound. We traded a sub 1 WAR DH for a former top pitching prospect who was coming back from injury, It was a gamble worth taking

This is a great example of a time I was told about the dangers of holding onto Cease during the offseason, and my response was that the player we traded for might also require TJS at some point during the season. We made a terrible trade, and now that Thorpe is hurt, the return is even worse. Stupidity has a way of snowballing.

I never viewed him as a huge asset. On a good roster he's a DH. On a bad roster he plays 3B. To me he was always a marginal asset. It shouldn't be hard to find his replacement every year there are guys with his archetype available for minimal cost either via free agency, waiver wire, or minimal cost in a trade. Gio Urshela was just signed for free by the braves and he's a guy I would have preferred at 3B to Burger. To me the issue isn't trading Burger is we have wasted the year giving jobs to guys who have no buisness playing MLB baseball this was an opportunity to give guys looking to rebuild their career jobs and opportunities with the idea that if they had a good year they would be moved to a contender. Instead we signed trash and the few players that had bounceback years we got nothing in return. But yeah not just Gio but guys like Amed Rosario were available off the scrap heap too. It's not hard for smart teams to find useful players who can play positions I just don't put much value on a sub 1 WAR DH. Just because we suck at it doesn't mean we should irrationally value a player like Burger

Yeah it was a buy low option that didn't work out. I liked the trade. Stassi numbers have varied wildy but when healthy he is usually pretty good. It was worth a flyer. Had we backfilled the move with another buy low bounceback candidate it would have been much better. But we signed Maldonado that was the real problem. You sign as many of those guys as possible and hope one of them has a bounce back year or is decent enough he brings back something at the deadline. You don't sign one guy then when he doesn't bounce back pretend there was some sort of problem with the process.

How valuable do you think Burger would be if he were traded in the upcoming offseason? Burger's only position of WAR value is third base, but he performs it so poorly defensively that you should constantly look to upgrade. If not, he is roughly a 730 to 770 OPS DH. In today's MLB, those are not particularly valuable. From my perspective we sold high even if the trade doesn't work out we should be doing more of these moves in the hopes 1 or 2 guys hit because the upside of Jake Eder before his injury was a front line starter

https://www.espn.com/mlb/insider/story/_/id/40846519/2024-midseason-top-100-mlb-prospects-rankings-update-kiley-mcdaniel top 100 prospect 15. Colson Montgomery, SS, Chicago White Sox/AAA, Age: 22.4 19. Noah Schultz, LHP, Chicago White Sox/AA, Age: 21.0 48. Hagen Smith, LHP, Chicago White Sox/None, Age: 20.9 96. Edgar Quero, C, Chicago White Sox/AAA, Age: 21.3

He has a -1.6 WAR and a.629 OPS. He basically had eight hot games. How bad is this team that we are resorting to getting excited over two series worth of bats?

Its not that we traded him its that we gave him away when his value was at its lowest. But hey, we'll replace him with a soft-tossing veteran with no value and no future value. It's the sox way.

He has 0.6 WAR. My guess if Eloy manages to stay healthy we are going to regret that deal much more more than Burger.

It's so penny wise and a pound foolish. How much did we waste on free agents since then? I've counted close to 100M in buyouts. You could buy the top analyitics and scouting staff in baseball just off the amount of money the White Sox have paid players not to play the last five years. You can't tell me that with a better staff we still sign Maldonado I mean anyone with two working brain cells saw this was going to be the result.

It is not necessary to condition us. This is a terrible team. There is absolutely no talent pool either at the ML or minors. Even if JR wanted to spend 200M lets say this team would still suck. If JR is going to spend take gambles on guys who could bounce back, explore IFA, take back salary for prospects. Rebuild the base of this club once you have a foundation then you can start worrying about bringing in the superstar players. I mean it will never happen but really the whole notion that we are going to spend our way out of this is bonkers. We have no talent. We have one pitcher. Literally no one who can hit. A CF who spends more time in rehab then he does on the field. That isn't a team. The Angerls had a better roster Ohtani and still couldn't win anything and the dude was a two way player. They also had Trout. Baseball is about being able to fill out your entire roster. If you got one guy with a 900 OPS and another guy with a 580 OPS. You might as well just bring in two 750 OPS players save yourself 30M AAV and get the same production.

Nothing Getz said could, in my opinion, make me change my opinion of him, and in order for me to do so, he would need to alter the way he views trades and asset management in general. He lost me with the Cease trade and the Maldonado signings; they were so ill-advised and lacking in any kind of strategy or plan that I immediately started a fire Getz thread. At this point, I do not give a damn what he says; the only thing that concerns me is how much harm JR will allow him to do before firing him.

When you are a baseball fan, there is no better job than being one of these guys; some of them are actual fans who get to travel the nation and watch games while earning money. That turns into more of a job than a passion, though, when the product stinks. It sounds like calling games has become a job and at his age, he doesn't need one

The problen with Getz is really this was the key part of the rebuild it honestly won't matter all that much who is GM after Crochet and Roberts is moved. Firing him after allowing him to make bad trade after bad trade and tearing down the roster isn't going to change much in the near term.

If the season had not been historically awful and just bad, the questions would have been fine. However, the hosts, CWS management, and even most fans no longer seem to give a damn. I want to see Getz challenged, not just asked difficult questions. I would like to see his responses contested. But hey I get it until the NFL season begins, everyone is just going through the motions. After that, they will not have to discuss the CWS any more. For me this is not just another losing season; Getz assembled one of the worst MLB teams in history, and it will always be remembered as such, and then he subtracted from that historically bad talent base at the deadline and made it even worse. To me fans are allowed to be emotional about the state of this franchise; this is Rod 0-16 Lions type territory this team isn't just bad it's embarrassment to baseball.

Your passion came through. I am just glad there are still sox fans passionate about this club. I barely care when this team loses anymore and I have zero confidence in the current group. I personally wish there were interviewers who just say the truth of what fans think even if they couch it by saying the fanbase thinks you are terrible, are making awful trades, and should be fired. How would you defend the Cease trade. How do you defend the Maldonado signing. Why didn't you ask for Carlson back from the Cardinals. How do you plan on improving the talent base for this club in the short term to put a watchable product on the field not just signing washed up stop gap vets who are just looking for an opportunity. None of the CWS media has the balls to ask these questions. NY media does that is only because they don't care about access as much. I maybe watch a game a week now and when football starts that will be 0

What did he say that people found offensive? Am I missing something?

He averages 30 homer runs per 162 he'll be fine if his hammy is fine

I acknowledge that he had no value when we moved him, that does not equate to him has no value in the past or in the future. With the Orioles, he still has time to regain value the season is not over. This brings me back to my earlier statement that a large portion of Chris Getz terrible performance as GM has been due to his ability to manage assets, weigh the pros and cons of making trades, and making deals at the proper time. For example, did I like the Cease trade? No, but that does not mean there was not a better deal available at that time what it means is you have control you manage the asset, and don't panic yourself into taking the best bad offer. In some cases, you have to trade players because they are going to become free agents; you take what you can get and move on. Eloy did not have to be moved; we just wanted to. Kopech did not have to be moved; we just wanted to. Cease did not have to be moved; we just wanted to. All three trades are biting us in the ass hard. Cease would have been worth multitudes more at the deadline. Kopech stuff should have had us continue to try until we had to pull the plug. Eloy option would have given us the flexibility to walk away if he didn't bounce back.

He has never been below replacement level until this season. I have much more faith in his bat than, clearly, most of the board does. I am kind of confused as to why people on this board think he can't hit when he has been dealing with soft tissue injuries the entire year. You guys think he forgot how to hit? He is a career. 800 OPS hitter. This isn't the result of his current hitting either; I said it at the time of the trade. To me, it just was a dumb bet because all it did was save JR money this year. If he finishes with a.850 OPS or better, that option is getting picked up, and he will have good trade value. I feel like some people are still stuck in 2015 prices. Josh Bell got 2/33, coming off a.780 Ops year that is the market floor. His injury history may prevent him from getting a deal longer than a year, but 1/16 or 1/13.5, depending on how you factor in his buyout, is more than reasonable if he finishes the year strong. It just is.

I agree. For that reason, so they recover or gain any kind of value, you should hold onto them. If not, you let them go as free agents and move on. These guys with that kind of stuff are genuinely hard to find in Major League Baseball; you can not find enough worthy bounce-back candidates to fill a roster. In actuality, there is not a better way to get impact prospects then these guys having a bounce back year as an Erick Freede is an example of that. We should be trying to fill our roster full of these guys and moving them when their value is at their highest point or they are about to be free agents not moving them when they have control and they have almost no trade value.