WestEddy

Okay, I tried. I don't really get along with ssY2K, but I'm pretty much aligned with him on this one. You have one argument pretty much shot down, and you don't even acknowledge that, you're just off to hurt feelings, or complaining about not signing free agents. The White Sox are in a rebuild. The free agents they're signing are more about competently covering innings than winning games. The focus is on getting the "prospects" PAs and playing time. Guys like Rojas, Trauchman, Slater - they're just veteran bodies. When players like Montgomery, Quero, Teel, etc. get established, one would hope they would start spending on actual production major leaguers who could give value above and beyond their market rates. Whether they do spend will remain to be seen. They have before, they've just cheaped out, or over-invested in their bullpen. Signing Kim is a great idea. The Tigers or Royals should really look into that. They're at the point of their rebuild where Kim could put them over the top into the playoffs.

You are correct. There is "value". But it's not value that will benefit the White Sox. Mentioning the Royals is like the 3-legged horse metaphor. Sure one could win a race somewhere in some scenario, but that doesn't make 3 legged horses some market inefficiency. It's a fluke. The Kansas City Royals didn't make the playoffs because they splurged on free agents. They made the playoffs because their rag-tag team played the worst team in modern history 13 times, and went 1-12. And your $12-14M AAV is you making up a number that would be a discount for a package that Kim most probably wouldn't sign.

If Kim didn't have big questions about his injury recovery, he'd already be signed. So he's already a roll of the dice. But pretending he's going to be the same player as before, I don't see why he wouldn't sign a 3 year deal with an opt-out after this year, in which case, what's the point? Hey, I get the argument of the guys here who scream for entertaining ballplayers to watch. I don't agree, but it's a valid argument. But that's not the argument you're making. You want him for 5 years, at a discount, when we've already amassed a glut of 50 FV prospects at his position(s).

C. Monty's not going to play 3 games at shortstop, then move. He will play, at the very least, most of one season at SS. Monty should be earning a call-up in 2025. My hope is that Getz has the sense to wait until Monty is ready, then give him a good, long run before benching or demoting him if he is completely overmatched. Already, you have Kim competing with Monty for playing time at SS in his first year.

There are multiple arguments being made here. Yes, if you went out and signed Greg Maddux to a 20 year contract right now, technically, he would be part of the "future". The most efficient use of a free agent signing is to sign them when you have a point of need on the win curve. The way teams are built now is that they sort through their internal options to determine where they have holes, or need depth. It now takes 85-88 wins to make the playoffs. If you are a .500 team, obtaining a 4-5 WAR player or two puts you over the win curve. That is the point where those wins are most valuable. If you're a 50 win team, adding 5 wins doesn't change your team's ability to make the post-season. So, what you are doing is adding 4-5 wins to a 50 win team. (Some here would argue they're a 41 win team, or less.) My highly optimistic view is that the Sox won't really be able to use those extra 5 wins to put them up over the win curve until 2027 at the earliest. Others here would argue that critical year might come in 2028 or maybe not even until 2030, either when Kim's skills are diminishing, or he's even gone. Pretend the Sox can contend in 2027. You're paying for 2 full years of 5 WAR production until his contribution puts you over the win curve, and probably for diminished production for a couple of years afterwards. The most efficient use is to hit the youngest and most productive seasons in the first years of his contract. Are you saying there won't be shortstops on the market in 2028? You seem like a fairly positive guy. The Sox will draft #10 this year, top 5 next year, and maybe #10-15 in 2027. Will there be no good shortstops available in the first round in those 3 drafts? Will we not get better at developing prospects and have a package to trade for a shortstop by then?

But I'm addressing people commenting about Romy in this very thread. Just to sum up all of my views: 1) I support signing Rojas. We're going to need the bodies to cover 3 IF spots over the course of the season. 2) I don't support signing Kim. He costs too much for what the Sox are doing right now, and he will most likely begin to fade before the Sox hit their competitive window. 3) I would love to still have Romy Gonzalez as a utility infielder. 4) However, some here speak of Romy like he's another Tatis Jr. we let get away. Romy Gonzalez is a utility infielder. 5) IF we still had Romy Gonzalez, we should use up all his options when guys like Meidroth, Ramos, Vaughn, Baldwin and every other IF is injured. Romy Gonzalez is a utility infielder. 6) Baldwin will be a super-sub, able to start at multiple positions. Romy Gonzalez is a utility infielder.

If Lenyn Sosa hit .100 for 8 weeks, and never caught a baseball with his baseball mitt while playing the field, he can be cut, and gets paid the pro-rated amount of the minimum. Nobody's arguing that it sure sucks having control of a guy for 5 years.

And when Rojas got the same treatment as Romy, picking his spots, and not being "the starter", they're pretty much the same player.

Well, they developed him. Winning! But he's a utility player. My point is directed at those who act like we let a starting 2B option go on the waiver wire.

I don't get the Romy love. A good manager picked his spots and Romy succeeded in them. If Romy stayed with the White Sox, he would have started at 2B, and within 6 weeks have been exposed and OPSing .520.

Great? No. You do have Vargas and Sosa, both of whom are out of options, that you need to figure out if they can be average to above average major league starters. You can't do that by starting them twice a week. You then have two prospects in C. Monty and Ramos who actually do project out as average major league starters, and they should earn a full preview in 2025. EDIT: Oh, I thought you were talking about Kim. I like the signing of Rojas.

Yeah, I've made these arguments in support of signing Rojas, because he will probably be cheap, and will be a steady, above-replacement addition. The Sox used 12 IFs last year, in a complete disaster of injuries and overmatched minor leaguers. They have 10 infielders lined up, 7 weeks before spring training starts. My sunniest take on this rebuild is that 2026 will be a "These Kids Can Play" season where they struggle to hit .500 by the end of the season, and make a spirited run for it in 2027. Kim's best seasons will be in this 50-110 year, and the "coming of age" season where .500 becomes a moral victory (again, in my sunniest of scenarios). He might also put up 2-3 WAR in '27, his age 31, an actual "going for it season", but you're looking at declining performance once you actually enter your window. So, you pay Kim 5/$70M, and the first 3 of his seasons, he's starting in front of C. Monty, Baldwin, and maybe Sosa, Vargas, Meidoth and Ramos. Then, if everything goes right, you're paying a utility infielder $14M per for his declining years. Again, that is if this current group pops, and they get better than average MLB years out of C. Monty, Ramos, Teel, Quero, etc.

They are certainly shopping Robert and Benintendi, and Vaughn has come up in trade talks.

C. Monty may not stick at SS, but he'll probably get a season or two to show he doesn't belong there. In the meanwhile, Kim's taking PAs away from whomever should be getting them at 2B & 3B.

James Fox has a preview of the upcoming international signing period. It's a cheap paywall. Sign up on Patreon and become smarter. You're welcome. https://www.patreon.com/c/FutureSox/posts

I'd say Vargas gets a season before other prospects start pushing him out. If Vargas can't hit, and Ramos can, now Vargas is scrambling for another position to stretch out his audition. They have too many options for Sosa to mess up another clear shot at starting time. I think if Sosa hits .100 for 6 weeks, he goes to the back of the queue.

I think the Sox could be pushing for .500 by the 2026 season. I admit that's overly optimistic by average commenter standards. If the Sox really have 2-3 more seasons in the wilderness, you're pushing well into RIP Jerry territory. Kim plays his age 32 season in 2028. Maybe that's JR's plan. Embark on a long rebuild, save a s%*# ton of money, and maybe he won't live to the day he has to start spending, again.

Maybe Elias is just a point A to point B guy, and they need a B to C replacement.

Why should the Sox guarantee $22M to a utility infielder? If they're going to do that, bring back Leury.

He's at 4.126 service days, so probably about 2 months into the season.

As indicated in the latest SoxMachine article, 5 years of service time seems to dictate that Rojas would have to accept an option. https://soxmachine.com/2025/01/following-up-what-even-is-the-white-sox-infield-right-now/

You still didn't answer my question. Are you saying the White Sox aren't prioritizing developing young pitching? Four of five of the end of year rotation was Sox-drafted and developed. I guess you know you're wrong, and will just babble about Touki Toussaint. I'm not even sure if you wanted to keep or cut him.

You didn't answer my question. Are you saying the White Sox aren't prioritizing developing young pitching? You seem to have this hang-up with age that people working in baseball don't. They have to play the games. Last year, they ran out of arms. As the Brewers' trade shows, all teams do this regardless of whether they're rebuilding or retooling. Please tell me about all these 23-year-old pitchers with 5 solid years of success that are just waiting on the waiver wire for free.

Are you saying the White Sox aren't prioritizing developing young pitching? The White Sox have a top 5 minor league system based pretty much solely on their development of pitching. I think they'll be okay.

The Brewers doing something that all teams do