GreenSox

It's been so dismal that fans are turning into masochists. Another round of Shields? Dear lord.

Tonight was a righteous tanking effort. I realize the advantage of finishing behind the Marlins....but, my god, how can we be so bad as to finish behind the Marlins!

Nate Jones - another spot on the 40 man now freed.

Except that the ownership let the same people who ran the org. into the ground stay in charge for the rebuild, as per above. That is a problem, and, if this doesn't work in the next couple of years, the problem.

Leury, Rondon and Yolmer are utility players; Leury can play OF and is probably the best SS of the 3. Yolmer probably has the most trade value, but the Sox, par usual, have nothing behind him at 3B. Yolmer also walks some and something tells me he might explode soon. Delmonico had a rough year; I can see the Sox dumping, but I don't see a real urgency to dump.

If we don't have a playoff team by (generously - 9 years!!!!) 2021, then we can write.....

Yes, but they were trying to win until 2 years ago, albeit ineptly.

Garr's batting average was good. His OPS was modest, to be kind.

I don't fault JR for not spending, and that sort of thing - he has spent. He can go either way on spending. I do fault him for over-loyalty and I feel that he will be comfortable should the White Sox fall into a decade long Royals/Pirates funk, for which I think there is a decent chance, and he won't do what is needed to shake the organization out of it.

That would be a much needed good outcome on the pitching front.

We hope; but Robert doesn't have a single homer outside of the DSL and Gonzalez is still in A ball himself. I guess Engel starts - but he's a bad hitter, but I guess there's not reason not to give him another year at this point.

I don't think he quite did that, but he was an above average regular for them for 10+ years. The post 58 transactions are probably the most egregious, but, as you said, they have a habit of doing that sort of thing. In the late 60s they trade for Tommy Davis and an aging Aparicio and the team hits the skids. Then it's Ron Santo and Ralph Garr. And then Bobby Bonds (for the highly productive Brian Downing; Dotson coming the Sox way as a thrown-in took some of the sting away).

I believe that they also traded Norm Cash around that time.

And Bobby Knoop, Syd O'Brien and Gary Janeski. And then Roland came in and took care of things......Made some real baseball trades like Ken Berry and Syd O'Brien for Tom Bradley and Rick Reichardt.

Ritchey and Shields is a righteous comparison. I'm just looking for 4 more wins.

Stick to your guns, Moncada. That will turn. IN the meantime, work on fouling off pitches you don't like.

Of course they should. But it would require an investment they don't want to make (if they did, they'd have the team). And yet, it would seem that, say, a second Az team would be a fairly modest investment.

Agree - don't want the team to lose 100.

No, they just have a manager and pitching coach that think Gomez can pitch. Of course, that begs the question...

The Royals got that return. Very questionable whether the White Sox would have. They couldn't move Frazier, who's the same player as Moustakas. They had to lump him with 2 good relievers, and it's debatable whether they got the return Moustakas alone got: Rutherford has a higher ceiling I suppose, but he's a corner player. Hahn worked his entire career under Williams, so it's no surprise that they share trade negotiation skills.. The similarities abound, including each giving up a legit prospect for a pitcher having a terrible year that should have been a pure salary dump. His secondary trades have, key to the Astros, Cubs and Brewers rebuilds, have come up snake-eyes.

In the sense of intentionally trying to lose, I don't think that the tank has ever been on. In the sense of being a bad team, it probably never left...as you said, just the ups and downs.

Maybe they'd have given him a year as they didn't know they were quite ready to win. But there's no way they'd keep him to manage a ready-to-win team. Also, unlike other "modern" front offices, Theo has hired strong managers in both places (others hire managers the FO can control).

They could have done that without rebuilding. In fact, they did. And it didn't work then and it won't now. This exactly what needs to be avoided.

It's back on because the Sox have just out-tanked 2 tankers in 2 home series, and in style, losing 35-10.

Because a)I don't think that Rodon brings an ace return and b)if the rebuild is way off track, then much has been squandered already, and the remaining assets should be preserved.