GreenSox

QUOTE (miracleon35th @ Oct 23, 2016 -> 12:41 AM) As far as the Sox "blowing it up" that is what the Cub fans want to see happen. It isn't a legit way to build a team any more, because there are too many bad teams vying for the top Draft choices. Therefore, there is no guarantee that a bad team will net a star like kris Bryant in the following year;'s Draft. What Epstein did involved a lot of very fortunate circumstances, some very good judgment ,a virtually unlimited budget, and a whole lot of luck. He is also not operating under a salary cap. I'm pulling for the Indians/. You don't blow it up to get the #1 pick; as you said, there's no guarantee of that; nor is there any guarantee that Bryant will be just waiting for you. you blow it up (or trade veterans) to get good young players into your system. That was the key to Theo's rebuilding of the Cubs, really moreso than the drafting. Major gains can be made especially in July. And yet Rick Hahn repeatedly insists on doing the OPPOSITE of what successful teams that are trying to build do. Instead of dealing away the veterans, he amasses them. And not just any veteran....Hahn is first in line to pay top price for the veteran that the other team is overtly trying to dump. And I doubt it will be any different this offseason.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Oct 21, 2016 -> 09:43 PM) That's why I don't get some of the fans' giddiness to trade Sale or Q. The problems are in scouting and development. That's true - but it's also true that the status quo won't get the Sox anywhere. I'll risk Hahn trading Sale for prospects or young players...he came up with Eaton so there is some history of competence. But my fear is that he trades Sale primarily for a veteran...and Hahn has a history of taking that bait when some team dabbles an ex all star in front of his nose.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 05:37 PM) They just fired their president a week or so ago Thanks. Preller and Williams would be an interesting dynamic.

What opening do the Padres have? I'm not sure who the Pres is or if they have one.

I think the Rangers are bogus and the Tigers will continue to slide back. Royals will win 85ish. But the Angels could get a lot better, the Yankees will be decent and the Astros may have take a small step back to take a leap forward if they can develop pitching(they foolishly traded young pitching last offseason). Seattle will be solid. It's easy to concoct a lineup where the Sox look like a contender. And Hahn can trade the good prospects we have for proven veterans. But I just don't see the defense or the pitching depth to really contend. And the usual usual Hahn moves for players that other teams are openly trying to dump just won't get it done. I'm not sure that Hahn is capable of much else. But if he is, a trade of Sale could make this a better ballclub. Get a young CF and 3B or catcher in here and give the young pitching a year to pull together and see what happens.

QUOTE (bmags @ Oct 20, 2016 -> 02:01 PM) Agreed and considering the troubles the White Sox have had in finding an average DH the last few years he is probably more valuable to us than any other team in that respect too. Agree

Teams who had that core and a thin farm like the Sox do would be reubuilding or at least taking a step back actually, they would have worked on things like young pitching depth and adding to the core 2 years ago). what they wouldn't do is start trading for vets on 1-2 year contracts, Hahn-style. Lack of spending "big money" is a canard...an excuse. Capable front offices would do a lot more with this core than Williams and Hahn have. Keep the prospects (the Sox do have prospects to trade for some Hahn-heroes; it would just wipe out the farm), trade Sale, fix the defense and get some pitching depth in here.

The Dodgers have a massive front office infrastructure...they could afford to take a risk on Kapler. Getz may be fine; but it just looks like another opening without a thorough search. Kapler had been writing about analytics for a long time; I wonder if Getz knows analytics or is interested in it (pretty obvious that Hahn, despite his impressive degrees, knows very little about analytics; or at least he doesn't use it).

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Oct 16, 2016 -> 12:40 PM) The defense comment is accurate. However, 2015 Melky (who, by the way, was still decent) also was extremely unlucky. This year, his luck balanced out and his numbers got better. My point is, it isn't an issue of ability. edit- he had a .297 2015 BABIP despite a higher hard contact % than he had this year. He's a complementemry hitter. 3-5 on a good team as said above. And yes the kind of hitter that the Sox FO would get goo goo over and act like they had acquired the elite (Frazier and Swisher were similar levels of hitter)- and partially because top hitters aren't traded very often. Contending front offices will see him for what he is- good hitter with 1 yr in a deal with bouts of inconsistency. Sure you can trade him- but not for much and you could get more in July desperation period. I think they'll read Sale but I don't think they'll rebuild.

QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Oct 16, 2016 -> 06:38 PM) I don't think it is but I definitely thinks this unfair to criticize a move and it's process, when you don't know the happenings behind the scenes. If you think this is a bad move, please name me someone who you would like instead. Two years of experience for this job is worthy of scrutiny.

QUOTE (daggins @ Oct 16, 2016 -> 04:42 PM) Like, who is the strong leadership figure Getz is going to get his guidance from early on when he is still green? Is it Kenny Williams? Don Cooper? Frickin' Buddy Bell?? Rick Hahn Seems like a Hahn guy. Fellow Michigan man. They let him switch out the top scout, so maybe this too.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Oct 16, 2016 -> 04:09 PM) Retired from playing after 2014 season. He then joined the Royals front office as some sort of assistant around the end of 2014. So, at max, he has 2 years' experience in player development. And now he's going to be the Director. yea, that seems real light on experience. I wonder if he's one of those guys like McCarthy or Kappler who started looking at analytics while still playing; that might help.

It doesn't seem overly insider to me. But what exactly are his qualifications?

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Oct 16, 2016 -> 11:29 AM) He was 65th in OPS. 65/270 puts him in the top 24% of hitters in baseball... he's one of the best and to say that "nobody wants him" is just absurd. And he can't play defense at all and he was not a good hitter the prior year. The only teams interested in him would be contenders and where exactly will a contender use him....DH. Like I said, July trade guy, presuming he has a good year and presuming Hahn doesn't take another nap this July

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Oct 15, 2016 -> 11:11 PM) Yeah you're right, I mean who would want one of the best hitters in baseball? Melky one of the best hitters in baseball....good lord. Re trading Sale, if they want to do that and rebuild, I doubt they'd be holding out for Bradley Jr. They should also try to move Eaton if that were the case. And they really shouldn't have sat out the July period. I suspect it's more a matter of moving Sale for his antics and the idea that they could just get better with the players acquired (which may be true).

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 12, 2016 -> 11:03 PM) If you could get Moncada, Benintendi, Kopech and Swihart for Sale and Melky, do you do it? Nobody wants Melky, except in maybe a July pickup if he's having a good year. Like others said, Jones, or preferably Robertson.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Oct 15, 2016 -> 10:52 AM) Seems like promoting two development guys to the coaching staff in Capra & Hasler signals we'll be rebuilding next year. That's an interesting angle.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Oct 14, 2016 -> 09:50 AM) http://m.whitesox.mlb.com/news/article/206...-coach-changes/ All in the family for Williams and Hahn. No sense of self awareness from either of those 2. Rick Hahn lives in fantasy land.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 12, 2016 -> 09:51 AM) I forget who made the point originally, but reading the subsequent posts, taking advantage of the Red Sox catching depth is a must, and makes a ton of sense if the Sox are going to try for a hybrid rebuild. Not many teams can show depth behind the plate. The best of the White Sox depth is years away, and a guy like Collins might not make it to the bigs as a catcher. I had no idea the depth at catcher the Red Sox had, and would rather see the Sox go after a guy like this versus another pitcher or position player at the end of the deal. Do any other teams have this kind of availability? I agree 100%. This is how you construct value trades...find out where they have depth and the value gained to the Sox will > value lost by the Redsox. IN no way would, say, a Swithart be a key loss for the RedSox...but he would be a key throw in for us, esp. if they are trying to still contend. But I'll believe it when I see it out of this FO.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Oct 11, 2016 -> 11:16 PM) Plus how do you replace Q and Sale? Shields is a weak link. Somehow the Sox scouting would have to be far more accurate when it comes to giving up quality cost controlled pitching. Giving that up seems foolish. The Cubs blueprint is wishful thinking. Key to the Cubs blueprint were clever and extremely productive July trades. Rick Hahn passed on those opportunities the last 2 years. I think the club needs to trade sale but I don't think Hahn has the guts to do it. I think it's more likely Hahn undertakes a major hero hunt this off-season

QUOTE (raBBit @ Oct 11, 2016 -> 12:40 PM) I do think a lot of posters on this board are underrating JBJ. I know we're trading the best asset the White Sox have ever had in this hypothetical and people want better than JBJ as a headliner, but JBJ is a .340-.360 OBP guy with 20+ dingers and great defense. I like your scenarios, but this gives me pause. He's only had one season like that and I'm not convinced it wasn't somewhat flukeish. This the need to pair him with an elite prospect, imo.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Oct 11, 2016 -> 07:22 PM) He had said in a few posts Jackie Bradley Jr and Eduardo Rodriguez. Okay - those guys pretty risky too, like prospects. Both could be really good- or flop. Unfinished players. Jr's defense isn't risky, though. With those 2, not sure you'd get more than 1 top prospect added on. QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Oct 11, 2016 -> 04:38 PM) I wonder what other teams could use Frazier? Mets could be a team looking for one if they end up moving Wright to 1B. He's a guy whom I think the Sox could get a lot more for if they traded him in June (and if he's having a good year). In June, when a team realizes they are a contender, they aren't so worried about 1 year on contract..prefer it in many cases.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 11, 2016 -> 08:04 AM) Except the Braves made the playoffs 14 consecutive years....the White Sox have never even managed to go back to back in their much longer franchise history. Details, details.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Oct 11, 2016 -> 06:20 PM) With Anderson graduated and no other position players on the cusp, the Sox need to add youth to the lineup. I am with you on best group of players, but acquiring 1 or 2 MLB players brings immediate value while decreasing and diversifying risk. Who do you have in mind?

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Oct 8, 2016 -> 02:16 PM) I'm laughing at this... how does one develop a #4 or 5 starter? I think Q had the ceiling of a 4 or 5 in many's eyes but turned out better than that. In short, there aren't many pitchers who are long term #4 or 5 starters, you either improve or get replaced. Putting that blame on Cooper is asinine. Same way they develop any other pitcher. Several pitched today in the playoffs - like the Dodgers and Nats starters. Cooper hasn't developed many to get replaced. The White Sox front office often falls for these frauds thinking that they're top rotation guys when they're not . bottom line is that the guru as presided over the pitching staff that has been no better than average for years despite an absolute ace on that staff.