GreenSox

the rotation is 6th, the pen is 8th. Overall rotation plus pen = 5th. The pen is really worth less than the stats suggest because it just lacks any stopper beyond 1 or 2 guys; a If all they needed was a couple of more bullpen studs, I could see going for it next year. But then you get to the offense....and this front office has been utterly incapable of fixing that for years. Proven veterans, decliners, heroes...they've tried everything, except what has a chance of working.

Bring up Fulmer. Expand rotation to 6. Or put Shields in pen- see if he can reinvent himself there since Sox are stuck with him. Take it easy on Sale and Q and Jones.

Speaking of Avi, give Coats his at bats in September.

QUOTE (Insp @ Aug 30, 2016 -> 08:29 PM) Actually, its Hahn who needs to go the most since he's the reason why Albers is still on the team. Yep. Ventura didn't sign him. He didn't sign Jacob Turner either (who in the world made that decision? He was terrible last year and the Sox paid him $1.5 million). When will Hahn and Williams be made to answer?

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Aug 29, 2016 -> 02:15 PM) April/March .697 OPS May .955 OPS June .700 OPS July .496 OPS Aug MIA And lets not pretend you werent like he was a guaranteed +.800 OPS guy what your point. I said .706 he was Sent down for performance not personality. Looks like you're confirming my assertion. I think I've been pretty consistent in saying that Sox should trade for these guys before they become proven because you get them at a much lower price. I credited the Sox with the Eaton in that regard and wonder why they make so few of those trades despite the FO high success rate with them. Trading for proven young players is to do something like the Swisher trade, which was another Kenny Williams clown show both in acquisition and dispersal. You have to overpay. This may be an opportunity to get somebody on the cheap and if it is on the cheap I'm all for it.

QUOTE (harkness @ Aug 29, 2016 -> 09:24 PM) jones is okay.. not great. When he is your 2nd best reliever... you are going to lose some games late. Using Jones 3 days in a row is absolutely pointless. Jones as 2nd to best reliever is fine; the Sox just need 3 Jones' and the one Jones doesn't need to pitch more than a few times a week now that the Sox, dare I say it Hahn and Ventura, are out of it and have been for months.

Ventura, Williams, Hahn and Cooper live in la la land. They are not grounded on planet earth. These dim bulbs think the Sox are in the race and run the org/team as such.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 28, 2016 -> 11:57 PM) He's a positive WAR player the past two seasons. He was worth what Trayce was in 2015 and more than Trayce this year. Or is Trayce someone that you don't want on an MLB roster? Per this board, Trayce is useless...4th outfielder. What, pray tell, is your objection to only trading at a steep discount? Would would you suggest paying for him? Top dollar? Top 100 prospects? Go back and look at threads from 2 years ago...you'll see plenty of suggestions of Q plus for him. .706 OPS this year.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Aug 26, 2016 -> 11:12 PM) I thought you wanted youth ? Everyone acts like he's an ax murderer . He just a a young rich dude who capitalized on his talent.Probably lacks some social skills and maturity but thats not so terrible and fairly common in sports. ?? he's 25. He isn't in the minors because of his personality. He's in the minors because he hasn't been a good player the last 2 years. Note the words "steep discount." You certainly don't pay for his 2014 production.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Aug 28, 2016 -> 04:08 PM) Nice to see them playing well lately and that Rodon seems to have turned it around. Hell maybe they can still finish over .500 for the year? Mark Yes, Rodon is the best news in a while. I'd certainly play Navarez a lot; I'd pitch beck, Kahnle, Ynoa and whoever else interests them from the minors in the 7th-9th more as well; see if they have the guts for it. No reason to throw Jones out there every day.

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Aug 27, 2016 -> 10:17 PM) Several things. Do you know how few people on planet Earth can manage being an at least adequate defensive catcher at the major league level and at the same time be an average major league hitter? There are virtually none of those people. That's why Avila gets a big boost in WAR. The fact that he can't stay on the field obviously hurts him. The same premise goes for SS, 2B, CF. Literally anyone can play 1B. Good points, but the market says Avila is worth $2.5 million. Abreu would bring far more than that, even today. Right is Eaton's best position by a mile (although I suspect he'd be really good in left as well). It wouldn't surprise me if the Sox sign a right fielder and move him back to center, where he's only average.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Aug 28, 2016 -> 04:19 PM) Not just Birmingham. Top four teams in the system are a collective 95ish games below .500. Every minor league team except for some of the rookie teams are absolutely dreadful. Now there's not a complete correlation between minor league records and quality of farm, but I don't think it's pure coincidence either. We'll see where they rank our system this winter and if it's improved as some believe..

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Aug 28, 2016 -> 02:47 PM) Brad Goldberg and Brian Clark are young possibilities for pen as well I'd like to see those guys up and Ynoa and Beck and Kahnle get high leverage work the last month. Let's see who among them can pitch (or can't pitch).

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Aug 28, 2016 -> 12:53 PM) If Robertson gets moved, I hope to see Burdi called up in September to close. He's done enough. He had a long college season as well.

Bimingham...good gracious. Must be the worst season ever for the Barons and by a wide margin.

Here's to some more spoilage. I'd like to spoil all of these central teams as well.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Aug 25, 2016 -> 04:41 PM) Move 1: trading Sale or Q with everyone thinking rebuild. Move 2: signing a bat to help win ASAP making it clear what they want to do. Or move 2 doesn't happen and they do decide to rebuild. All I know is I can't wait for offseason speculation (yes the season is at that point haha). Even though on a macro level I think this ML team needs a good scrubbing, I wouldn't do either of those things this offseason. I would sign a defensive catcher (although not to a LT contract) and a CF who plays plus D and isn't inept offensively. In the meantime, give these back pen guys with good stuff high leverage opportunities to see if they can be useful pen pieces, and put Fulmer in the rotation. Disbursement prices are better in July than December, so I would do a measured "go for it" at this ppint. Do NOT sign a hitter...been there, failed at that too many times. Re-sign Morneau. And do not trade serious prospects for yet another Williams-Hahn "proven veteran" Trade Lawrie - Saladino's a better baseball player.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Aug 28, 2016 -> 10:17 AM) Anyone think we can get Conforto for Melky? Mets need an OF and the Mets refuse to call Conforto back up even though he's their best option. The Mets front office should be put into an asylum if they made that trade. Another one the Sox should move, if they want to move these guys, is Avilia. He's a good catcher when healthy. I'd sign him long term, if he could stay off of the DL. If the Sox are "going for it" in 2017, they shouldn't move any of these guys on contracts beyond 2016, except Lawrie, and they can't move him now.

QUOTE (NCsoxfan @ Aug 27, 2016 -> 05:57 PM) Wait, there's a return we need for those guys? We're not talking about Q or Sale here. I can't imagine there'd be a substantial return deserved for either one. Sure there is. Should get a solid prospect for each. but if they were going to do this, they should have done it well before now. But what's the waiver situation on them?

QUOTE (captain54 @ Aug 27, 2016 -> 03:46 PM) Comments from KW earlier in the week indicated that the problems in 2016 were 'spearheaded" by bullpen injuries…. The idea that losing Putnam and Petricka are the difference between contending and losing is just more denial out of the front office....refusal to take responsibility and admit their factual failure. I have been concerned for a while that they would look for excuses and that injuries would be one of them (Ventura the other) instead of recognizing that their personnel moves and decisions have been poor and changing tactics.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Aug 27, 2016 -> 10:46 AM) I am not so sure that a relief pitcher shouldn't be taken as a 1st round pick anymore, just because of what some GM's are giving up for them. It's insane what the elite relievers command in trade value. Trade a couple high end relievers like the Yanks did and wham you can rebuild your farm. All for guys who play maybe less than 5 % of the total innings played ? The Yankees are very smart for trading Chapman and Miller. Sure - the 2 best relief pitches in baseball brought that return. People seem to think that's what Burdi will be. Highly unlikely. Draft someone and he develops into one of the top starters or hitters in baseball and he will bring 3 x the return those 2 did. What will Robertson bring? What did Addison Reed net out? Those are more realistic and probable goals for Burdi. And in the end, a player drafted where Burdi was drafted should be a top 100 prospect in short order...which is basically what the return on Reed was.

Jones is good. the top pens have several Jones'.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 26, 2016 -> 10:32 PM) You said we whiffed on this deal. Dioner Navarro has been awful this year. The fact that we traded him for more than cash is a win. i did not say the Sox whiffed on the deal. I said the poster whiffed in his attempt to to mock me. Getting nothing for Navarro- a DFA - would have still been a Sox win.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 26, 2016 -> 10:13 PM) Seriously? Have you seen Dioner? The fact that we got a live body for him is f***ing amazing. Okay. I'm just wondering why this is directed toward me.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Aug 26, 2016 -> 10:03 PM) GreenSox, please tell me what you wanted for Dioner Navarro via trade. I wanted nothing. Where did I say I expected anything? I didn't. Honestly.... Very happy getting him off the 25. At the risk of more wrath from the hahn fan-boys, if he does want to trade more players, may I suggest that he get on with it? As each day passes, value falls (for those that have any value).