GreenSox

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:29 AM) Their third catcher got injured the day of his debut. Which was 2.5 months ago.

Many do. But the #3 is usually not a highly valued property, unless you're fortunate enough to have a good AAA prospect, which most teams don't. QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 11:19 AM) SO NOW YOU HATE THE SCOTT CARROLLS OF THE WORLD? Also their third catcher got injured the day of his debut. Hate? I don't hate people because they don't need a spot on the 40. It's supposed to be a professional baseball organization, not a holiday camp for friends.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 10:59 AM) So you are saying you would have passed on Rodon because of the contract demands? Interesting. If it demanded him playing before he's ready, sure. The idea of Rodon is 5/6 years of a top end guy. Well now it's down to 5, and falling.

Considering Avila's injury history, they should have had one of those AAAA guys or grizzled veterans who have played for 1/2 the league stashed away in Charlotte. maybe they do. They actually had that one guy, but released him to "clear room" on the 40. but the 40 contained such luminaries as Scott Carroll et al.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 6, 2016 -> 09:36 AM) Not to mention that what he is learning at the major league level is great for his development. But hey, ax to grind. Gotta throw in the dumb deity comments How's that development coming, all while the control clock is ticking? And if Hahn was going to let Boras make personnel decisions, then pick someone else. Tell us, what has Cooper accomplished in the last several years? Honestly, listening to yall one would think that Hahn, Cooper and Williams have actually been winning.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 09:27 PM) Who is next man up even? The guy they just acquired from the Astros? Saladino is the third catcher; I wonder if he can really catch or if that's just pure emergency.

The affirmative decision to rush up Rodon and his stunted development as a #4 is another feather in Hahn's cap ( Cooper's as well). Cooper's continued status as whitesox deity another issue as well.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 06:42 PM) If all that's true, why did no other organization think to convert him into a starter? Because he doesn't have all the pitches to be a starter. And while the Sox think that they could make him into a starter, I haven't seen much out of them that that's a high priority. Hahn seems intent on rushing him up. And frankly, he sort of has to to justify #26.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 05:25 PM) No matter how you slice it, they aren't going to consider turning Burdi into a starter until next season. Therefore, if there is any chance he can help the big league club in the near future, there's no downside to calling him up other than potentially wasting an option year on him. Hopefully after a week or two, we'll see if he's worth that risk and my guess is he will be. An option year shouldn't be a problem. But you lose a control year or part of one. Plus he's had a long year already.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 04:08 PM) With all the ridiculous things you post all the time, the most hilarious thing is your continual defense of Rios. It also completely goes against your entire philosophy, it's a complete mystery. Being on a team that won the World Series doesn't mean that player was any good. And the fact that De Aza (-1.1 WAR this year) is still playing isn't an actual argument for anything. While De Aza had a bad year his last year, he produced for the Sox the prior 2 years; and somehow he made it on a world series team. I omitted another Hahn giveaway - Thornton. Of course I would never trade for Rios. But he had a .749 OPS, after years of .850 and .756 and had the all-important credential of being "proven." Shall I list the names of players with similar stats that this board has pined for, oogled over? And when I have suggested offering L Garcia for said players, I get scoffed at, as if it's an insult to such high talent. Yes he had a bad contract...so do certain other parties.... Money over prospects. And, indeed, Caufield, I omitted several "million here, a million there" Hahn signings like Paulino et al. What could you do with that money...oh, maybe pay a few big international bonuses.....

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 03:42 PM) Interesting to note... full season #'s Austin Jackson .254/.318/.343/.661 dWAR -0.3 JB Shuck .235/.262/.398/.660 dWAR -0.1 Jackson has about double Shuck's PA's. And Shuck is trending upward. He's filling the spot fine. Just hope it continues.

QUOTE (CB2.0 @ Jun 14, 2016 -> 07:33 AM) Even though our turd catchers have been producing this last week, I'd probably kill a man (Shields) to see Lucroy in a Sox uniform. The marginal value from our catchers to Lucroy, isn't nearly as great as the marginal value between, say, our DH and any number of solid hitters. But the marginal cost of Lucroy would be immense. Avila is a good catcher...not a great hitter, and also injury prone (which I presume is why he splits time with Navarro)

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 09:27 AM) White Sox roster now Core Chris Sale - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Inherited Jose Quintana - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Inherited Jose Abreu - Strong addition Adam Eaton - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Strong addition Carlos Rodon - Hahn got the benefit of drafting #3; anyone would have picked him Tim Anderson -My mistake - Strong pick Nate Jones - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Inherited Veterans worth their contract and worth something in a trade Todd Frazier - Strong Addition; but At the cost of Thomposon et al Brett Lawrie - Not much trade value actually; but an acceptable player Melky Cabrera - Good this year; terrible last year. FA signing. James Shields - highly questionable if he's worth his contract; he has 2.5 years to go to prove that. Right now, he's pitching about at his contract level. David Robertson - Good signing Prospects in the top ~200 range Zack Collins Carson Fulmer - Hope he works out; Hahn could have taken the top college bat but passed. Spencer Adams Zack Burdi Alec Hansen Trey Michalczewski Hahn had 3 drafts in the top 10; of course he's going to add talent. But is this anything special? Maybe it is. And then the opportunity cost of Keppinger, Beckham, Bonifacio, Turner and Laroche. What could have been done with those dollars? The weakest part of Hahn's arsenal are his trades for veterans and low-rent signings.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 09:27 AM) White Sox roster when he took over in 2013: Core Chris Sale - pre arb Jose Quintana - pre arb Addison Reed - pre arb Veterans worth their contract and worth something via trade Jake Peavy Alexei Ramirez Prospects in the top ~200 range Erik Johnson Courtney Hawkins Carlos Sanchez --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Players you omitted: Inherited: Tim Anderson Marcus Semien Trayce Thompson Micah Johnson Josh Phegley Several other prospects that Hahn dispatched De Aza (still playing; no value received) Rios (Playoff and WS winning team; L Garcia received)

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 02:28 PM) I agree. He has to earn it, but it's obviously there for the taking. He needs to earn it against an objective measurement...not against the back end of this bullpen. Charlotte is full of hard throwers..we don't want him to be one of those guys. Sale was drafted to be a starter; they thought he'd be ready quickly, he was, so they eased him in via the pen. There was a time when some in the org. wanted him to stay there. Burdi was drafted because they thought he'd be an impact reliever quickly. They might be able to turn him into a starter, but opinions vary. But he wasn't #26 value as a starting prospect.

QUOTE (chisoxfan310 @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 07:31 AM) Desmond on a one year deal would bring back compensation in the offseason though. On the flip-side, if he starts at short stop for us, Anderson isn't up now. And would Sox put him in the outfield? They have a bevy of young infielders really don't try any in the outfield. Plus Desmond had a terrible year last year. Maybe they were quantifiable reasons for that that the Rangers saw, but now he's having a career year. Avi has some traits of a good hitter. He takes walks and goes the other way. He just has no power when doing it. And good hitters who take walks and go the other way usually don't strike out so much and have better batting averages. Probably be better off if he tried to pull.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 06:16 AM) There was no harm in trading for shields. Paying some of that contract may make some mad but if he pitches like has his last three starts its worth it. He's pitching like a 5th starter now. His first 2 starts were indescribable. Is he worth that price as a fifth starter? In a vacuum, no. But in the Sox circumstances, maybe. Still the poor talent evaluation out of Hahn and Cooper is a big reason for the circumstances requiring a overpayment for a fifth starter.

Sox are up 6-2. Do they really need to use Jones 3 days in a row, 5/6? He's going to need a couple of days off now.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 10:08 AM) All this talk about how the bullpen has been awful but they're 9th in WAR and ERA in the MLB. You sure like to exaggerate Caulfield. Even if you want to go by WPA the bullpen is still in the top half of the league. 25 in WHIP and 21st in allowing inherited runners to score. They lack top end guys; Petricka would help the middle/back.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 10:45 AM) Anderson SS Eaton RF Abreu 1B Frazier 3B Avila DH Lawrie 2B Navarro C Garcia LF Shuck CF Rather see Saladino at 3rd and Frazier DHing. Improves D and doesn't hurt O. Also risk, although slight, of losing DH spot.

Petricka and Putnam were not high end relievers. Petricka pitched to a WHIP of around 1.4...the good late inning guys are 1.1 or below. Putnam was really good in 2014, but mediocre in other years. Useful guys for the back of the pen. Duke was signed to be a late inning guy - he's been around 1.3...good player to have in the pen, but not as a top 4. Nate Jones' WHIP is under .9. they need a couple of more Jones' and, frankly, it was a wish and a prayer that the Sox would have that this year. But, really, you have to grow some of your own relievers like this...prospects who flame out as starters. Credit Hahn for signing/extending Jones though....that was big, especially as things have turned out.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 05:43 AM) I understand that but he couldn't be worse than Coats and is a better defender. Plus would give him a quick taste oh the majors. To develop into a major league hitter, May needs more time in the minors and consistent at bats to do that. Bring him up, and, yes we get better than Coats, but highly risk stunting his development. And the Sox need a young major league CF.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 09:29 PM) I thought Petricka and Putnam were doing respectable work. Back end of the bullpen guys but not high leverage guys. Putnam has shown some flashes of being that but it hasn't been consistent. And he was a scrap heap pick up, not a farm guy. Hahn Signed/acquired a lot of scrap-heap pitchers the last couple of years, but none have done much except Guerra, whom he let go. Semien, Trayce, Anderson and Saladino (imo) are all major league players, so I think the farm, for the grief it gets on hitters, has been much been much better developing hitters than pitchers. Harder to see, perhaps, because Hahn dispatched 2 of them and in general the major league club has struggled more on the offense side. Hahn has got to do better talent evaluation than what he's done lately for this team to have a chance under his leadership.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 07:57 PM) Agree with you on Hahn, but I wish the Sox could make some good trades/acquisitions for bullpen help and a couple of bats that can also play defense. Don't know if it's possible but if it would require JR overspending in salary as opposed to trading talent than so be it. . I agree with you that the Sox need those players. I think they can get by with Shuck, at least for a while They have only 2 dependable late inning relievers. They have 2 5th starters, but only when those 2 pitch their best. A starter and late inning reliever cost a ton at the deadline. And that is if Hahn knew what he was doing. The fault though is the farm...for all the ballyhoo about how good they are with pitching, where is it? We haven't seen a pitcher out of them since Sale or Nate Jones. Can't even pull an 8th inning guy or dependable 5th starter. And the Sox have maybe 1 A prospect in the whole system (this draft excluded) so they have to load up 3 or 4 of their Bs for a good player, and they really don't have many Bs.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 06:33 PM) Any ideas? As far as position players I'd like to see them add a centerfielder that can hit and a good hitting first baseman who plays good defense so Abreu can DH. Unless Morneau shows he still has something left in the tank. I'd really like them to picjk up a couple of solid relievers. Don't know if all of this is possible though. Sox don't need Rick Hahn making any more trades. They had a CF, they had a 17 homer guy, and they had a starter w/ a 1.06 WHIP. The D at 3rd isn't the best either...he's probably the best choice to play first.