GreenSox

QUOTE (CB2.0 @ Jun 14, 2016 -> 07:33 AM) Even though our turd catchers have been producing this last week, I'd probably kill a man (Shields) to see Lucroy in a Sox uniform. The marginal value from our catchers to Lucroy, isn't nearly as great as the marginal value between, say, our DH and any number of solid hitters. But the marginal cost of Lucroy would be immense. Avila is a good catcher...not a great hitter, and also injury prone (which I presume is why he splits time with Navarro)

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 09:27 AM) White Sox roster now Core Chris Sale - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Inherited Jose Quintana - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Inherited Jose Abreu - Strong addition Adam Eaton - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Strong addition Carlos Rodon - Hahn got the benefit of drafting #3; anyone would have picked him Tim Anderson -My mistake - Strong pick Nate Jones - Hahn locked up on a team friendly deal - Inherited Veterans worth their contract and worth something in a trade Todd Frazier - Strong Addition; but At the cost of Thomposon et al Brett Lawrie - Not much trade value actually; but an acceptable player Melky Cabrera - Good this year; terrible last year. FA signing. James Shields - highly questionable if he's worth his contract; he has 2.5 years to go to prove that. Right now, he's pitching about at his contract level. David Robertson - Good signing Prospects in the top ~200 range Zack Collins Carson Fulmer - Hope he works out; Hahn could have taken the top college bat but passed. Spencer Adams Zack Burdi Alec Hansen Trey Michalczewski Hahn had 3 drafts in the top 10; of course he's going to add talent. But is this anything special? Maybe it is. And then the opportunity cost of Keppinger, Beckham, Bonifacio, Turner and Laroche. What could have been done with those dollars? The weakest part of Hahn's arsenal are his trades for veterans and low-rent signings.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 09:27 AM) White Sox roster when he took over in 2013: Core Chris Sale - pre arb Jose Quintana - pre arb Addison Reed - pre arb Veterans worth their contract and worth something via trade Jake Peavy Alexei Ramirez Prospects in the top ~200 range Erik Johnson Courtney Hawkins Carlos Sanchez --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Players you omitted: Inherited: Tim Anderson Marcus Semien Trayce Thompson Micah Johnson Josh Phegley Several other prospects that Hahn dispatched De Aza (still playing; no value received) Rios (Playoff and WS winning team; L Garcia received)

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 02:28 PM) I agree. He has to earn it, but it's obviously there for the taking. He needs to earn it against an objective measurement...not against the back end of this bullpen. Charlotte is full of hard throwers..we don't want him to be one of those guys. Sale was drafted to be a starter; they thought he'd be ready quickly, he was, so they eased him in via the pen. There was a time when some in the org. wanted him to stay there. Burdi was drafted because they thought he'd be an impact reliever quickly. They might be able to turn him into a starter, but opinions vary. But he wasn't #26 value as a starting prospect.

QUOTE (chisoxfan310 @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 07:31 AM) Desmond on a one year deal would bring back compensation in the offseason though. On the flip-side, if he starts at short stop for us, Anderson isn't up now. And would Sox put him in the outfield? They have a bevy of young infielders really don't try any in the outfield. Plus Desmond had a terrible year last year. Maybe they were quantifiable reasons for that that the Rangers saw, but now he's having a career year. Avi has some traits of a good hitter. He takes walks and goes the other way. He just has no power when doing it. And good hitters who take walks and go the other way usually don't strike out so much and have better batting averages. Probably be better off if he tried to pull.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 5, 2016 -> 06:16 AM) There was no harm in trading for shields. Paying some of that contract may make some mad but if he pitches like has his last three starts its worth it. He's pitching like a 5th starter now. His first 2 starts were indescribable. Is he worth that price as a fifth starter? In a vacuum, no. But in the Sox circumstances, maybe. Still the poor talent evaluation out of Hahn and Cooper is a big reason for the circumstances requiring a overpayment for a fifth starter.

Sox are up 6-2. Do they really need to use Jones 3 days in a row, 5/6? He's going to need a couple of days off now.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 10:08 AM) All this talk about how the bullpen has been awful but they're 9th in WAR and ERA in the MLB. You sure like to exaggerate Caulfield. Even if you want to go by WPA the bullpen is still in the top half of the league. 25 in WHIP and 21st in allowing inherited runners to score. They lack top end guys; Petricka would help the middle/back.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 10:45 AM) Anderson SS Eaton RF Abreu 1B Frazier 3B Avila DH Lawrie 2B Navarro C Garcia LF Shuck CF Rather see Saladino at 3rd and Frazier DHing. Improves D and doesn't hurt O. Also risk, although slight, of losing DH spot.

Petricka and Putnam were not high end relievers. Petricka pitched to a WHIP of around 1.4...the good late inning guys are 1.1 or below. Putnam was really good in 2014, but mediocre in other years. Useful guys for the back of the pen. Duke was signed to be a late inning guy - he's been around 1.3...good player to have in the pen, but not as a top 4. Nate Jones' WHIP is under .9. they need a couple of more Jones' and, frankly, it was a wish and a prayer that the Sox would have that this year. But, really, you have to grow some of your own relievers like this...prospects who flame out as starters. Credit Hahn for signing/extending Jones though....that was big, especially as things have turned out.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 3, 2016 -> 05:43 AM) I understand that but he couldn't be worse than Coats and is a better defender. Plus would give him a quick taste oh the majors. To develop into a major league hitter, May needs more time in the minors and consistent at bats to do that. Bring him up, and, yes we get better than Coats, but highly risk stunting his development. And the Sox need a young major league CF.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 09:29 PM) I thought Petricka and Putnam were doing respectable work. Back end of the bullpen guys but not high leverage guys. Putnam has shown some flashes of being that but it hasn't been consistent. And he was a scrap heap pick up, not a farm guy. Hahn Signed/acquired a lot of scrap-heap pitchers the last couple of years, but none have done much except Guerra, whom he let go. Semien, Trayce, Anderson and Saladino (imo) are all major league players, so I think the farm, for the grief it gets on hitters, has been much been much better developing hitters than pitchers. Harder to see, perhaps, because Hahn dispatched 2 of them and in general the major league club has struggled more on the offense side. Hahn has got to do better talent evaluation than what he's done lately for this team to have a chance under his leadership.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 07:57 PM) Agree with you on Hahn, but I wish the Sox could make some good trades/acquisitions for bullpen help and a couple of bats that can also play defense. Don't know if it's possible but if it would require JR overspending in salary as opposed to trading talent than so be it. . I agree with you that the Sox need those players. I think they can get by with Shuck, at least for a while They have only 2 dependable late inning relievers. They have 2 5th starters, but only when those 2 pitch their best. A starter and late inning reliever cost a ton at the deadline. And that is if Hahn knew what he was doing. The fault though is the farm...for all the ballyhoo about how good they are with pitching, where is it? We haven't seen a pitcher out of them since Sale or Nate Jones. Can't even pull an 8th inning guy or dependable 5th starter. And the Sox have maybe 1 A prospect in the whole system (this draft excluded) so they have to load up 3 or 4 of their Bs for a good player, and they really don't have many Bs.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 06:33 PM) Any ideas? As far as position players I'd like to see them add a centerfielder that can hit and a good hitting first baseman who plays good defense so Abreu can DH. Unless Morneau shows he still has something left in the tank. I'd really like them to picjk up a couple of solid relievers. Don't know if all of this is possible though. Sox don't need Rick Hahn making any more trades. They had a CF, they had a 17 homer guy, and they had a starter w/ a 1.06 WHIP. The D at 3rd isn't the best either...he's probably the best choice to play first.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 05:20 PM) Because it's cheaper to bet on these prospects than sign real players. Hence, the restrictions of the low budgets. And they probably invest in some decent scouts so that they don't trade for players like James Shields, while cutting players like Junior Guerra, which could have financed a big overage.

Very amateurish 3rd inning. AKA clownshow. But the clubhouse is happy and that's what's important.

fister/Fliers...getting a lot of mileage out of those 2 #4/5 pitchers. Their staff is about that, now that Dallas K isn't pitching like an ace. Their whole team is really the 3 young stud hitters, plus slightly above average players around them and, at least this year, a strong pen. It seems to be working

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 2, 2016 -> 11:05 AM) They paid 1 or 1.2 million on Guerrero. Thanks. But I wonder why. That's more than some top 20 guys got.

Kind of surprised they called up Sanchez over L Garcia, who seems to have more utility versatility.

Not enough for Sale, although it's probably realistic. Too much for Quintana. imo

So they must have a big one coming in, right, as Hahn talked about 1 large bonus. So far they have 33, 36 and 37 and none would seem to warrant a high bonus ahead of the others.

Shields had 2 5th-starter performances and 2 abysmal performances. He's got a long way to go before he earns his keep.

I think he's more than a utility player; he's steadily improving, has a nice swing, runs the bases well and is a solid defender. People debase/under-value young Sox players who aren't hyped prospects...which is fine, except when the front office does it on its own players, as it has been doing the last couple of years. That shouldn't happen. 3 ML ready players went for Samardzija, and 3 went for Frazier. And they have several ready this year. I'm glad they're floating several onto the major league team to see if they are players. Most won't make it, some will, and I suspect Saladino will. Saladino should play regularly. L Garcia should be the utility player.

Astros have 3 young stud hitters. Kind of a patchwork team around those 3, but those are quite a 3.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 30, 2016 -> 04:54 PM) Ouch, talk about bad luck. Probably a jones fracture of the 5th metatarsal. That is an extra long healing time usually probably 8 weeks. Good gracious. How unfortunate for him.