GreenSox

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Dec 6, 2013 -> 10:08 PM) This where we disagree. Any trade for Sale would bring back major league ready talent. Take AZ for instance, guys like Davidson 3b, Gregorius SS, Parra etc. I'm not talking about A ball or AA ball players. At least a few of the players in return would be major league ready or already have gotten their feet wet which was stated earlier in this thread. Guys that can fill holes now as well as help in a year or so. This would speed up the rebuild, not slow it down. As for Q, he doesn't hold nearly the value of Sale at this point and well we still need starting pitching after a Sale trade so keeping Q is the smart move. Again its about Sale's crazy value and how the return can help now and later, not years down the road. What level of major league talent? There have got to be at least 2 players, if not 3, with Sale potential (i.e. all star potential) to make it worthwhile. We need at least 2 in the bush to give up the bird in the hand. Usable players in return for a player of Sale's caliber will retard our growth; we can sign cheap free agents to get those kind of players anyway.

Quintana would bring a lot more in return and we'd be selling high on him.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Dec 5, 2013 -> 09:08 PM) I've been a huge proponent of rebuilding and I think its a bad idea to trade Sale. Not yet at least. There's no reason this franchise can't be a serious contender in 2015 if the right moves are made. If for whatever reason we aren't legit contenders by 2015, then yes, you have to start to explore a trade. Really don't even want to think about that though. I tend to agree. I think it will take some really clever moves plus some fortune in the player development department. But you aren't winning anything without an ace pitcher. And we have that at least.

Webb have starter potential?

QUOTE (raBBit @ Dec 5, 2013 -> 09:22 PM) Not too worried about it. Closers are easy to make. Cash in on the value if you can. I'm not saying definitely trade Reed, but if the right package came in return that's definitely something we should consider. Absolutely. I like this signing. Is Webb a ceiling middle reliever?

QUOTE (flavum @ Dec 4, 2013 -> 03:00 PM) If Arizona wants Sale, start with Archie Bradley and Didi Gregorius, and then add 2-3 more. But they've already said Bradley isn't going anywhere. Agree, and that can't be serious about landing an ace if they keep prospects off limits. I'm okay with dealing Sale, but I wonder if others' injury concerns might make teams offer lesser value.

Axe pitched his rear off for us. Just limited in ability.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Dec 3, 2013 -> 02:16 PM) Well, he was .246/.330/.406 in 198 PA vs RHP last year. Not exciting but Flowers was .213/.268/.393 in 198 PA vs RHP and Phegley was .190/.213/.266 in 166 PA vs RHP so it's definitely an upgrade. It's an upgrade from what our two did last year, but it's still lousy and not worth much. How's his defense?

QUOTE (QuickJones81 @ Nov 27, 2013 -> 07:40 PM) If you were Rick Hahn, and you had two options for a catcher in front of you, which would you take and why: Option A: Jarrod Saltalamacchia at a cost of 4 yrs / $36M Option B: Matt Wieters at a cost of Erik Johnson, Tyler Flowers, and Carlos Sanchez Salty by a mile We can't trade our top pitching prospects at this point. That's the stuff that gets us into these messes.

QUOTE (GREEDY @ Nov 17, 2013 -> 10:33 AM) Would Semien & Reed be enough, to get a "window" to extend him? Good lord. Expensive rents are the exact opposite of the type of move we need to make.

So they say it's a seller's market for SS. Who are the other suitors for Alexei?

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 22, 2013 -> 07:04 PM) Exactly. I dont see Bourjos as a starter. He can fill in and provide value just fine, but on a contender, he's a 4th outfielder. The way he's hit so far he's a 4th outfielder. But he doesn't have that many at bats and the Cards needed to improve their OF defense, as do we.

Beckham played a good 3B for the sox. Gillespie would be okay for 1 year - see if he can improve. He had a near 9% walk rate, which is stupendous for this organization. Put MS there - that would be fine too. Certainly don't use assets on a declining veteran there for this transition year.

Cards have to have some young hitters in the minors. They always do. This team doesn't need to add declining veterans.

De Aza still hit will so I doubt his value is that low. I'd try to sell high on Quintana. I like Jones and Santiago...don't think we'd get full value on eithr.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 18, 2013 -> 01:45 PM) Yeah, he seems like his ceiling could be very similar to what De Aza is right now. That would be fine...if he hits it. And he can play a good CF. DeAza can't.

When Flowers, Wise, Keppinger and Danks the Younger are the available bats. not pinch hitting much is understandable.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 17, 2013 -> 07:54 PM) The pitching could support a 90 win team. They just need to score some runs, somehow. Sale, Qutinana and I guess Santiago and who else can you trust? Jones, Reed, I guess Lindstrom and some of the worst relievers the Sox have had in 5+ years. Honestly, if any of those other bullpen pitchers are back (Veal, Purcey, Troncoso, etc.) this team won't win 70 games again.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 17, 2013 -> 01:07 PM) This continues to be a great way to make the 2014 white sox a worse team. Better than having both on the team. Nobody's giving Konerko 7 Mill or even 3 Mill...hopefully they do and spare us from the apparent obligation of having to bring him back.

They can bring Konerko back if they can move Dunn. If they can't,they just can't.

QUOTE (chisoxfan310 @ Nov 16, 2013 -> 07:18 PM) And I don't understand why people knock his defense. Flowers and Phegley are terrible behind the plate Because it's not good. That our 2 guys weren't good doesn't make his D good. We need an upgrade defensively. Let's develop our pitching depth...don't trade it for replaceable players.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Nov 16, 2013 -> 11:10 AM) Then you're not gonna get him. He was bad defensively, yes, there's no denying that, but to me, I think the offensive payoff out weighs his defensive inefficiency. A round-about case and point is Alex Avila, who ranked worse defensively and we saw what that team did. A positive for Jaso is he didn't allow a single passed ball last year, where as Phegley and Flowers both allowed 8. His big problem is throwing guys out, and I think our LH heavy rotation will help with that. You're adding a bad defensive catcher to a team that was already horrid defensively. The bad defense was a major reason for our complete tanking of last year...I'd argue it was more of a factor in the tank aspect than the O. And for how long is this guy signed? I don't like trading with Beane anyway. Our track record isn't the best. We need to sign Salty...won't even cost a draft pick. We can then make some minor trades to shore up CF, 3B and the bullpen for a year or 2. We don't need to trade any of our pitching.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Nov 15, 2013 -> 06:11 PM) Hell no. If they can get Jaso for some lower level pitching prospects, it would be a great pickup. But to trade someone like Santiago for him would be crazy. WE sure as heck shouldn't trade real prospects for him. We don't need to make our D worse.

I'm sorry. A guy with a .287 OBP will cost c. Quintana? I'll take him - if we pay the price one should for a .287 obp hitter. WE've got plenty of complements to that around.

C FA 1B -Abreu 2B - Semien SS - Ramirez 3B - Gillespie RF - Garcia CF - FA LF - Viciedo DH - DeAza Bench: Garcia, Keppinger, Flowers, someone who can hit Dealt - Dunn, Beckham