Reddy

You fucking wait until our country isn't on the precipice of destruction at the hands of Trump and his bastardized GOP.

EXACTLY! We've listened! But it's never enough for Bernie and his followers. THIS is the moment we have to come together, and the Dems have been trying to throw the left as many concessions as possible to get them on board. Still they refuse.

Fortunately that's not the messaging. The fact that you think a $15 min wage, medicare for all, guaranteed jobs, and not taking PAC money is establishment is a little silly. And women who've never run before are winning across the country. Is that establishment?

Doing multipost responses like that makes it hard to respond back to your individual points. I'm not going to keep relitigating. No one went negative on Bernie. Re: banking regulations, you picked the single issue that exists where some Dems are problematic. Congrats. I agree with you. That doesn't supercede EVERY. OTHER. ISSUE. Is that issue worth not supporting Dems over if it means Roe v Wade is overturned? If gerrymandering is made even worse? If the environment gets destroyed? If climate change goes unaddressed? If millions lose healthcare? If medicaid, medicare, social security and food stamps get gutted? If we get no gun control? I could go on and on. I want corporate money out of politics. I don't want us deregulating wall street. But that is not this moment's fight. There's too much else at stake.

The party did terribly for the 8 years under Obama, and there are a lot of reasons for that. Since Trump they've been doing a helluva lot better. And you're misrepresenting facts. Establishment Dems have won the VAST MAJORITY of races since 2016. Stacey Abrams is establishment. Bernie endorsed her because he badly needed a win.

The frustration comes from not understanding how the system works, and what Democrats can and can't do as a minority party. A lack of appreciation for the diversity of the Democratic coalition. And a selfishness that puts purity over progress. There are things about the party that frustrate me. Schumer pisses me off sometimes. But I'm not so arrogant as to put my personal feelings ahead of doing the thing that will help the most people and protect those that are currently under attack. Right now we need Democrats - ANY Democrats - in office. If we don't take the Senate, Roe v Wade is gone. Is that something you're willing to lose for the sake of your principles?

You mean the establishment that KEEPS WINNING and has far MORE SUPPORT than the Bernie wing?

1) Sweet Jesus people are still making that argument? No. One. Had. Gone. Negative. On. Bernie. At. That. Point. And polls are a snapshot of a moment in time and have no bearing on future moments with different contexts. I swear. We need to teach polling analysis in grade school. Little frustrates me more than people who make bad arguments with polls they don't understand. 2) Democrats are making all of those arguments. Unfortunately, those policy positions and arguments don't make headlines in today's world.

Come on. I can't change how Bernie speaks, how he does it, or his implicit biases. You're trying to talk pragmatism while suggesting I should change things I have absolutely NO impact on. All I can do is try and convince people that he's not a smart choice if we want to win because of his inability to excite and mobilize and incredibly vital part of our base.

You realize I support Bernie's platform in a perfect world (and if there's a viable funding source) right? I just don't support him because he divides the party and is an electoral liability.

This narrative is patently and unequivocally false. It's insane that it's so prevalent. Pick ANY social issue, and establishment Dems and Rs are on completely different sides. Same for the majority of economic issues. Seriously. Pick an issue. Or make a list. I'll tell you where Dems stand vs Republicans, and we can examine whether they're the same.

Great. They poll well. Why aren't those polls reflected in the results on election day? As for that last paragraph, I'm aware of the arguments, and I agree with the policies, but why can't Bernie articulate them like this? Why is it so hard for him to speak in a way that doesn't cast minorities and marginalized groups as an afterthought? Words matter. It doesn't really matter what your policies are if you can't sell them to the people you need to vote for you.

I agree with this. That's why I'm stoked at the leadership Perez/Ellison have been providing as they recommit to a 50 state strategy with the goal to run candidates everywhere - something we got away from during the Obama years. We've got candidates across the country in races that haven't seen Dem opposition in years - more Dems running for office than ever. Perez's covert strategy in the Doug Jones race was executed flawlessly. I agree that the party made massive mistakes over the last 10 years. That was then. This is now. And so far, our strategy is paying dividends in these races. I know it doesn't seem like it, but the DCCC, DSCC and DLCC are operating better and more effectively than they have over a decade and a half.

How many high profile (read: higher than city council) elections has an OR-endorsed candidate won? You say it's done well in some races. Can you cite them? Are they victories or just "strong showings"? The VAST majority of OR endorsed candidates have lost. The number's something like 82%. I never suggested Republican-lite. I suggested establishment Democrats. Are you really going to pull the false equivalency card? Nancy Pelosi was one of the most liberal members of Congress her entire career, and she still is.

To be clear, the progressives who lost last night did a GREAT job of rallying behind the winner and endorsing them - creating unity. I definitely applaud that. They didn't learn that, however, from Bernie. Bernie does continue to lob grenades at the party. Who does that help?

The hope is that they realize that supporting someone like Bernie won't get Dems the coalition they need to beat Trump. That there's so much division within Democratic and progressive ranks on this that supporting someone who alienates a majority of the base (minorities, women, and white establishment Dems) isn't shrewd if your goal is actual realized progress. Theoretically, based on the data, it should be clear that we need to move on from BOTH candidates from 2016 for the good of the country. If Dems don't take back Congress this fall, Roe v. Wade is gone. Trump appoints another SC justice, and the courts swing far right for a generation. Gerrymandering gets further entrenched. This is the most important election of our lives, and based on the data from ALL the races that have taken place since 2016, in the vast majority of them, Berniecrats don't give us the best chance of winning this fall. His brand doesn't resonate the way his supporters think it does. My only goal is winning this fall and in 2020. That's it. I'm not gleeful progressives lost, I'm hopeful that those data points will help convince people that those strategies aren't in our best interest RIGHT NOW. Obviously, because of the demographics on this board I seem like an outlier, but I promise you I'm not. There are more Dems who feel the way I do re: Sanders than are excited about him and his brand of progressivism, and that's been born out election after election. It only seems the other way around because of the skewed demographics on social media. We need to vote blue no matter what, and we need to have candidates who have the best chance of winning. While your emotions may say otherwise, the data is so unequivocally clear that Bernie's brand doesn't give us that in 2018.

Well yeah. Trump and the GOP are supposed to try and beat Democrats because they disagree with us ideologically on almost every issue. I don't agree with them, but they're doing the logical thing for people who think and feel the way they do. The far left attacking Dems makes literally no logical sense, and directly undercuts the work we're doing to try and achieve progress and defend our country from the greatest threat its faced in a long, long time. So yeah, that's much more frustrating.

https://www.vox.com/2018/5/22/17382650/georgia-texas-kentucky-arkansas-winners-losers 3 winners and 3 losers from primaries in Georgia, Texas, Kentucky, and Arkansas: A good night for establishmentarians and Medicaid expansion. "And while progressive ideas continue to flourish in the post-2016 Democratic Party, the vehicle for bringing Bernie Sanders’s political revolution down ballot continues to struggle to establish itself as a real difference-maker. Loser: Our Revolution - Bernie Sanders’s post-campaign national political organization endorsed two House candidates in fiercely contested primaries — Laura Moser and Rick Treviño — and they both lost rather badly."

It is FASCINATING to see that the Rush Limbaugh/Bernie crossover support is a real thing. We really do need to improve education in this country.

Bernie has been in the pocket of the NRA for his whole career... And there are a number of Democratic Presidential hopefuls who support Medicare for All and free college tuition. So...

Are you arguing that minorities voted for Donald Trump at a higher rate than they usually vote for Republicans?

Omg we agree on something. (Reality is we probably agree on 95% of things)

Then why on Earth would minority voters have supported Clinton over Bernie in a landslide? C'mon. Think for a second. https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/03/why-black-voters-dont-feel-the-bern-213707

This is absurd.

Straight white men are under attack and being treated unfairly in America.