Soxbadger

QUOTE (brett05 @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 02:41 PM) It's not a debate. It's murder and needs to end. Folks making themselves feel comfortable with murder by calling it women's health and the word abortion is abominable. Youre right, it isnt a debate. Its not murder. In order for something to be murdered, it has to be alive. In order for something to be alive it has to be capable of self sustaining. Is it "murder" when I get a haircut? Is it "murder" when someone has their tubes tied? Is it murder when someone has a vasectomy? (edit) Earth flat? You do realize the people who call abortion "murder" are the same people who said the "earth is flat." Either you with science or you are against science, this isnt a scientific debate, this is a religious one.

QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 02:35 PM) White people that are married to any minority group Jewish people Handicapped People with long term medical conditions Anyone that votes non-Republican Jews are good. Ivanka is a converted Jew as her husband, Jared Kushner, was raised as an orthodox Jew.

QUOTE (The Mighty Mite @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 02:23 PM) If you really want to drain the swamp the people of this country have to start a movement demanding term limits in the US House and Senate. The problem is that the party who was supposed to keep big govt in check just overwhelmingly supported a candidate who appears pretty authoritarian. There wont be any draining of the swamp, this is just more status quo. The people in Congress (on both sides) get elected back in because all of their supporters just blame "the other guy." Even if they start off with good intentions, they usually get lost in the struggle to "keep power", which is why "gerrymandering" never gets addressed, as both sides want to use it to their benefit. Its also why the electoral college and many other "status quo" rules will likely always remain. The only reason Trump is an "outsider" is because over time he found a way to basically alienate both parties. Somehow that became a good thing. I really dont know what is going to happen next. I used to think that I had an idea, I really believed the Republicans/conservatives I knew who for the most part believed that "real" Republicans would turn their back on him. But now I guess we have to ask ourselves, what is a "real" Republican. Are we watching the Republican party shift, or is there some sort of core "small" government voice in the Republican party who will say no to Trump. The only "good" thing for Democrats is that when you have the house/senate/President, it often leads to infighting. But who knows.

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 12:10 PM) I guess i don't see why. On the other side you have a complete robot who is totally calculated and fake and has been working that way for 30 years. People are naturally going to gravitate towards someone that has more charisma than a lamppost. We have a dumb electorate. We all knew that going in. I strangely find robots safer.

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 11:56 AM) Inciting violence and hatred sure, totally agree. Having disagreements about tough decisions when it comes to something like immigration I don't. You guys tend to view things very black and white and b**** when the "other guys" don't agree with you 100%. There's no right answer on a lot of that stuff. There are tough decisions that may not be fair to some people. Doesn't mean those people are awful human beings that you shouldn't associate with. Youre doing exactly what youre arguing against. "You guys". Its not everyone. Over the last few months I have made a lot of arguments against Trump. But today I am arguing to give him a chance. I could easily say "how many people who voted for Trump would be doing that", but the answer really is, it doesnt matter what other people are doing. At some point we have to be accountable to ourselves.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 11:29 AM) Hillary sure as hell wasn't going to get re-elected in 4 years against any half-way decent opponent. That's what I meant by easy. The silver lining for Democrats in all of this is that they get to run a real candidate in 4 years. Not just someone who thought it was their turn. There is no silver lining besides for hoping Trump is "who we thought he was" and changes his position now that he actually won. Due to the Supreme Court, this election likely had much more significance than the one in 4 years. Im sure there will be a ton of second guessing, like what if Biden ran.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 11:19 AM) We're becoming a reality TV show... Weve been a reality TV show, sometimes it just takes something completely shocking to make people realize the truth. In fact, our country is run worse than an alliance in Survivor. And that is on BOTH sides.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 11:16 AM) However you want to look at it, Trump winning just gave Democrats a really easy way back into the White House in 2020 where they can elect a candidate much better than Hillary. Michelle's very well liked and well spoken, so she has that going for her. But going off the sentiment of anti-establishment rhetoric, Warren has a really good shot in 4 years. She's basically the younger female Bernie Sanders. Every Democrat needs to stop with the "easy" stuff. I will always believe part of the reason Trump did so well is because he was the "underdog" which gave this false illusion that he somehow is fighting for the little guy. Right now the best thing any liberal can do, is wait and see. A big part of the reason this country cant do s*** anymore is because everyone prejudges. Obama is the worst Ill never agree with anything he does. Trump is the worst. Bush is the worst. Clinton is the worst.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 11:06 AM) I think any hope of Trump actually being about the country and not about Donald Trump is out the window. His surrogate, the great Omarrossa, said they are keeping track of their "enemies", those who didn't vote for him, and will even up the score. This is actually what Democrats have to be hoping for. That Trump goes to war against Ryan, etc. Everyone keeps saying "Ryan" budget, but there is a chance Trump goes after the Republican's that he felt "betrayed" him. A lot of Trump's talk is that he isnt part of the establishment, that he is an outsider and that he is going to shake things up. If anything now is the time for the Democrats to woo back Trump. Not sure if its possible, but I do believe that Trump could have less hatred for Democrats that opposed him as compared to Republicans that did. Who knows, its Trump. He has no sacred cows.

QUOTE (CrimsonWeltall @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 10:06 AM) In 2008, Obama had real political principles and policies. But he thrived because he was able to move a lot of people emotionally with "Hope and Change". In 2016, Trump had no real political principles, and barely cared about policy at all. But he was an absolute beast at grabbing hold of people emotionally and stoking their passions (for better and worse). Charisma/salesmanship is the name of the game now. I think policy nerds are gonna be fighting for VP slots. Well see. Its really hard to come to any conclusions based on one election, especially as a lot of Clinton's problems were self inflicted. That being said, in many ways its not a great scenario for Trump. He is going to have the house/senate, so no one really to blame anymore. Or maybe its just more of the same. Who knows, but I think we all know that in 2020 Yeezus has our vote.

Jenks, Personally I think its too early to tell what Trump is going to be about. He has been all over the place on a lot of different issues in the last 50 years. Trump would say/do anything to win. So is there a part of me that believes a guy from NY who has been married 3 times, etc, isnt going to be the poster boy for the religious right, of course. And that is ultimately my biggest concern. Trump is an unknown quantity, he could be great, he could be terrible, he could be in the middle. But does anyone really know what is going on in his mind? His entire life has so far been dedicated to making Trump great. Now he has to put on an entirely different hat.

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Nov 9, 2016 -> 09:54 AM) Yeah the big problem here is that our manufacturing output has actually been really high recently. Those jobs were mostly lost because of technology. I could see him getting coal/steel type jobs back if he puts big tariffs on the import of those raw materials, or being more ok with pipelines, but those are pretty small groups of people that would be affected by any change (relative to the amount of people hoping that he can help them). The tariff part is the most mind boggling of it all. Republican's used to be about free trade. NAFTA was actually passed by Republicans not Democrats in the house (Democrats voted 102-156 against the agreement, Republicans voted 132-43 in favor.) I have no problem if people are upset about the economy, but (imo) the conclusions dont make any sense.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan99 @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 11:17 PM) And I agree with whoever said it earlier, let's get rid of the f***ing outdated nonsense that is the electoral college. Trump is winning that too. At this point its Hillary who is hoping for electoral win.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 11:06 PM) The markets are the least of my worries, but I'm not ready to start talking about things as if we're in the midst of WWII or something. Yet. Its not WWII, but there could be some civil liberty issues that could take some real hits. Its not the end of the world, but something has to change. Because in no world should Trump have even been a candidate.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 10:59 PM) I sure hope you are being a bit overdramatic here. Stock market is going to get crushed tomorrow. Trump literally has no plan. When things get even worse, they are going to blame minorities, etc. It is what it is, but Trump is really unqualified and he is going to inherit a country that is being ripped apart. (edit) At this point it may not even be a respectable loss. Hillary is bleeding bad in PA.

QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 10:51 PM) Sorry everyone. I'm sad and angry and I'm not sure I'll ever get over this. It happens. Its hard to win President 3x in a row, that is just how things work. But, if you really think people like Trump are the problem, then the rest of us cant be Trumps. We cant wake up tomorrow and want to blow it all up, we have to be positive. Because its likely that there are going to be some dark days ahead, that many of the things people fought for are going to be erased and it may take years to fix it. But that is what we have to do. Even if it isnt what they would have done. Because actions matter and tomorrow if Trump wins, we all have to set the example. Its not forever, but right now America is not in a good place, and its up to all of us to do something about it.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 10:22 PM) I don't think she took anything for granted. She, just like John McCain, didn't excite a lot of people. QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 10:23 PM) I don't think so. She had a pretty extensive field operation. Rural whites just existed more outside likely voters than hispanics. She didnt go to Wisconsin 1 time. She could have spent 5 hours to go between Madison/Milwaukee to tell people how important it is to vote and take nothing for granted.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 10:20 PM) Wisconsin is the concern right now. You can register same day. Back when I went to school there waited over an hour to vote. Dane County is at less than 70%. So there is a definite chance. But this is on Hillary, she took a lot of people for granted.

QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 10:06 PM) This was a nice post. But god I'm sad and scared. Then WE all have to do better. This isnt just "Hillary's" fault, if a lot of people really believe that Trump is bad, then we all failed. Maybe 1 vote didnt make a difference, but maybe I could have done more, maybe I should do more. Its going to be a long night, University of Wisconsin has a lot of votes and you can same day sign up. Right now shes +70k in Dane County with 53%. So maybe its just the close call everyone needed to wake up. And if it isnt, and if Trump wins, then I hope he is the best President ever and I was wrong.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 09:59 PM) I am sad. A bunch of people without the internet who only get local channels just elected a President because he dislikes non whites as much as they do. The gift and curse of Democracy/Republic is that people get to express their opinion. I am not going to hate on people who went out and voted. If Hillary loses its because she couldnt get people to go out and vote for her, in places that she should have done better. Win some/ lose some. Well see what happens, but if Trump wins, we move on as a country and we do what we can.

QUOTE (JenksIsMyHero @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 08:43 PM) ABC just said her stronghold there, fairfax county is 80% reported. And she's still down. Way closer than "they" thought. Yeah thats why I originally thought shed lose. But each update shes closed the gap by half (down to 10k) so its looking like that one could go to Hillary.

VA comeback is on. Its going to be super super close.

QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 08:16 PM) What Look at the VA map and the votes left, its hard to see where she gets +90k votes.

QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 08:16 PM) I'm in full panic mode honestly I dont know anything about NC so I dont know where the late votes will come from. But Id say right now its likely Hillary loses both VA and FL.

QUOTE (bmags @ Nov 8, 2016 -> 08:13 PM) More concerned about VA and michigan VA is probably tougher than Florida at this point.