Soxbadger

In football if you are fearing Illinois, or Illinois in 10 years, you are a bottom dweller in the Big 10. Illinois is not going to touch OSU or Michigan, and it looks like Penn State may be coming back. You are talking about two or three of the best teams in the nation, teams that over all record can stack up to the greatest programs of all time. In basketball I look at the Illini and MSU as the yearly challenges for Wisconsin. Michigan used to be something to fear, but lately they just havent gotten the job done. Indiana has been up and down, but in my opinion on a downward slide for a few years. OSU looks to be a good team now, but whether or not that will go on passed Oden is questionable. As for making fun of Illini? Outside of basketball they are just not a rival, and really Minnesota and Michigan are more disliked. I dont even think Wisconsin has a ceremonial trophy with the Illini in football. Really I just feel sad, because as some one born in Illinios, and who grew up as an Illini fan watching Jeff George and rooting for some pretty bad teams, I just wish they could do something. But when I see Zook, I see nothing. Maybe he will prove me wrong and be the Barry Alvarez of Illinois (Alvarez is a terrible coach by the way but excellent recruiter), but if you cant win at Florida with Spurriers talent, I just dont have that confidence. Generally you inherit a sweetheart program like a Miami, LSU, you are still good because you have all the players the coach before recruited and had ready to go. SB

No Zook was not a choice, I believe that he was really the only option that Illinois had. There program was going no where, they are in a terrible recruiting spot, and most of the home grown talent already looks at Michigan, ND, OSU as better places to play. Illinois just did not have much on the table to go out and get a stud coach with. That being said, I think that Illinois could have taken a look at a guy who is in a Mid Major, or small conference and wooed him with the chance of being in a big conference. Zook just does not do much for me as more than a place holder. Still Zook is not getting awesome players, hes getting good players. And his coaching is not that much of an improvement over Turner. His recruiting however is. (Edit) Would you rather have Self, the recruiter, or Weber, the coach?

I already said that: but I think that the best hope is that he gets the Illini to the middle of the pack, where hopefully they can get a better coach. And I disagree about s***ty coaching of awesome players versus decent coaching of s***ty players. First of all, Zook is not getting awesome players. He is getting decent to good players, this is not a USC, FSU, megaclass where you are looking at multiple first round selections. Second, your statement is not a mirror, it should be awesome coaching of s***ty players versus s***ty coaching of awesome players. And in that case I think that awesome coaching will generally win out. When you look at the college game, recruiting is a huge part. But system is a huge part as well. In my opinion Zook just does not have a good system, and that is inexcusable coming from Spurrier (who I hate) who had one of the best systems.

This thread is the epitome of hope springs eternal. I hope that Zook can bring some respectability to the Illinois program, but I think that the best hope is that he gets the Illini to the middle of the pack, where hopefully they can get a better coach. It is not about recruiting with Zook, it is about coaching. At Florida, he had superstars, and he lost 13 games in 3 seasons, compared to Spurrier losing less than 30 in 12 seasons.

They wanted Vazquez over Colon a few years back, from what ive seen the Sox have really wanted him for a long time and kept coming up short. Another thing to remember is, Contreras tanked as a Yankee. Vazquez tanked as a Yankee, and as a Diamondback. It seems that Vazquez did his best when he was comfortable, and perhaps coming to the Sox where there is pretty big latin influence will have a calming effect on Vazquez. Who knows, but the talent is there.

Its much easier to be Boras than it is to be a GM or owner. Boras has 1 goal, $. He doesnt have to make people happy, he doesnt have to make sure his clients actually play well, all he has to do is make sure that the contract they sign is iron clad. That is why it is difficult to negotiate with an agent. They have almost all of the leverage when you are dealing with a player more than 1 team wants. They know the offers, they know what the teams are saying, they have the information. The GM, owner, only has what the agent tells them, and more often then not its smoke as compared to truth. Its really not that hard to go out and get contracts like Boras does, especially when its the players who do the talking not you.

I said "practically" the same. Bush is better, but is he $30million and 30 selections better? When I see Bush and Calhoun (and yeah its the Wisconsin, but in the past I have not been high on Dayne or Bennet, so Im not always a homer.), they raise the same questions. Both are extremely talented, the question is will they have the strength and durability at the next level. Here are my concerns about Bush, 1. 150, 200. Those are the amount of carries Bush has had in the last 2 seasons. Deangelo has broken 300 carries in successive years, Calhoun had 350 carries, and 50 catches, for 400 touches this season. 2. Defensive talent. The Pac 10 is bad at defense, maybe the worst "good" conference. When you look at Bush's stats you have to wonder how he would of faired in the conference of his comparison. Do I think Bush would have had more trouble in the Big 10? Yes. I still do not believe the Texans will take Bush. I know that is what they said, and everything, but I just do not buy it. I think they will select Vince Young. As for Leinart, everything people say reminds me of another LA product, Cade Mcnown. Polished QB, can put the ball in tight spaces, most NFL ready QB in the draft, etc etc. The only problem is, in the NFL if you can not throw the 20- 30 yard pass with authority, they are going to shrink the coverage. Can Leinart suceed? Im not so certain, he looks good, but the NFL is so far different than the Pac-10 db's. Its hard to talk about this stuff before combine, because I think that combines are very important to gauge the individual players talent. Many college players are system players, ie Ron Dayne. He runs the stretch play really well for whatever reason, but does nothing else good. He was in the perfect system for his talents, but he never could translate that ability to other plays. It should be an interesting draft, I cant believe Calhoun declared. He got some really bad advice, seeing as this year he just started to become a household name, and next year he would of been looking at 1st round for sure. He should be happy if he is drafted in the 2nd round, because RB's fall alot come draft day. And I think Maroney is slightly better than Marion Barber III.

Looking at Addison's IMO, Ive got. (Notice this subject to extreme change due to combine and other factors.) QB 1. Young RB 1. Deangelo Williams 2. Lendale White 3. Reggie Bush 4. Brian Calhoun The rest Im to lazy to go over with enough time, but I think the RB rankings will be shocking enough. In my opinion, Calhoun and Bush are practically the same, they are both undersized at rb for the NFL level. That does not mean they wont excel, Barry Sanders, Emmitt Smith, but it does mean that the road will be much harder. Bush is good, but he looks like an undersized S. Alexander. I would not be able to in good conscious draft him ahead of White or Williams, who are more likely to have have immediate impacts in the NFL. Williams is good and a work horse, but I think the real suprise could be White. When I watched USC, I saw Ricky Waters/ Bettis or more close to our time, Ronnie Brown / Cadillac. The difference is, I feel Bush/White resemble Waters/Bettis more than the other pair. Bush is the Waters, break away back. White is the Bettis punishing back. It is a shame that the Bears f***ed themselves by drafting a RB last year, not even the best one available, and now will be probably looking atleast 1 top 5 rb available at their draft slot.

Wisconsin has been Big 10 champion before and been seeded low, so its just something you expect. I generally feel Wisconsin has gotten some pretty rough draws and seeds the last few years, so I expect the worst. Wisconsin generally has a chance to do well because of the Ryan system, and for whatever reason other teams just do not play well in the Kohl Center so home games are almost always wins. SB

Wisconsin a 2 seed. That would be pretty remarkable considering better teams Wisconsin teams have been given much worse seeds. But ive always thought that part of rankings is based on what you have done years prior, as much as it is on this year. SB

Im standing by my Vince Young will be drafted by the Houston Texans. For all we know the Texans are trying to get some one to trade up to take Bush so they can slide down and take Young. Id rather have Young than any other offensive player in the draft.

I mean off the top of my head Im going to say that Colorado versus ND where the Rocket ran back the kick but a phantom block in the back was called. The Miami versus OSU gamed seemed to have some more excitement. It was a good game, its hard to rate them, for each person each game is different.

Only biased was directed at you. As for where I would draft Williams, I said he would be a good 2nd or 3rd round pick for the Bears. Not once have I said the Bears would draft Williams at 1, I said that if he had a great combine that he probably could move up to a 1st round pick. I didnt even realize he was the leading WR in the Big 10 until I was looking at some Calhoun stats. I really like Randle El, I just would say in my opinion that Williams has more to offer than El. SB

You dont rank teams on the fact that they can beat bad opponents. You are supposed to rank them based on whether or not they could beat the opponent ranked below them. For some reason I feel that if WVU was in a conference such as the ACC or Big 10 they would be looking at minimum 2 losses. Honestly those are the 2 best conferences IMO, Big 12 has a huge drop off after Texas, Pac 10 big drop off after USC, and SEC just seems to have lost its identity. SB

Cheat, No clue every Big 10 back that is in the top 5 gained a significant amount of yardage against non top 25 teams. But on that same token, so did Reggie Bush and Deangelo. I mean should Calhoun be penalized because unlike Young he put up good stats against the teams he was supposed to dominate?

Ill bet you that Hart is not invited to the heisman ceremony. The only way he even has a chance at being the best Big 10 back is if Calhoun declares. Calhoun was the 4th highest rusher this year. He had over 2100 yards from scrimmage. Mike Hart in his entire career has 2400 yards from scrimmage. Hart has 15 TD's total in his career, Calhoun had 22 rushing TDs this year and 2 receiving. I hope your basing this off of Calhoun entering the draft, but even then I think the next Wisconsin back will probably out gain Hart. SB

Actually you said that Hart was the best back in the big 10. He isnt the best back this year, he isnt going to be next year, and even in 2 years he will not be. If the Wolverines do not have serious competition at the RB position, then they may really have some problems. Impact player is a much different term then best back. Every RB, even on the worst team, is by definition an impact player. They handle the ball around 40% of the total offensive plays, that is always impact. Atleast I dont have to hear that Leinart is the next Tom Brady. That statement has been pissing me off for a week. Its so inaccurate it makes me wonder if the person who made the statement even had a clue about Tom Brady in college. SB

Yah but personally I think Calhoun is the best RB Wisconsin has had in the last 7 years, and that includes Dayne, Bennet, and Anthony Davis. I also would say that Sutton and Maroney are better than Hart.

Calhoun is better. SB

Mike Hart plays defense? That was the only way they were stopping Calhoun. As for the rankings, they are just nonsense. The top 3 Big 10 teams won, OSU almost beat Texas the best team in the country, and yet the Irish are ranked 2? Dont believe the hype. SB

Southsiderirish, First of all I dont see where bias enters my statement. I am a Bears fan, meaning I want the Bears to do well. Ive watched Randle El since he was a qb in Indiana, he is not as polished as Brandon Williams. Not to mention Randle El's little Brother Marcus is on the Wisconsin football team so not sure where bias enters. Ive seen Williams play for years, and I feel I am a good judge of talent, I feel he will be a solid slot WR for years and good PR/KR. These are things the Bears need. As for Young leaving. If he is going to be picked by the Texans, his home town team, Young is gone. If he is not going to be, he may stay. As for the Texans picking Bush, that is dumber than picking Young and having Carr. The Texans not only have Dominick Davis, they have Vernard Morency, and Wells. Bush is not as good as Young and they will forever live in the shadow of one of the greatest state of Texas players. IMO, Vince Young is hands down the best player in this draft. SB

Japan is much better thats why they send their medicore players here and we send our best players there. I rue the day that Japanese baseball began to steal our beloved American players.

I dont know how damaged his value has been. Some scouts were not always thrilled with him to begin with. I mean I think you could get a 2 this year and maybe a 1 the next. Teams are always more willing to deal next years 1st round pick. Especially when its a high 1st round pick like some of the worse teams have.

I really dont think Young can stay after this game. He just flat out dominated, and he almost always looks to pass first and run second. He will be very good in the NFL, if I was Houston I would trade Carr and draft Young. They have a good RB core, they have Andre Johnson, they in no way can hurt their franchise by drafting Young. He is going to be a Texas hero, if they pass on him and he does well, they will never live it down. Even if Young doesnt pan out, the fan base will understand far more. Bush looks like a smaller S. Alexander. Some of those Texas lineman look real good, I could be real happy with the Bears getting one. SB

Bears not drafting or signing a good wr would be one of the worst mistakes. I can not name any time where they have had more good WR's then they could find playing time. And why would you want Randle El, who is going to be more expensive then Brandon Williams, and is not as good of a WR or returner? IMO you draft best player available unless you have a glaring need. SB