Y2HH

I wouldn't necessarily boo Crede, but after his first at bat/well deserved standing O, I won't cheer for him anymore, either.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 09:28 PM) Oh, I was saying that my 401K is a mere pittance and 20% of nothing is something (play on words). Yes, it was hard to watch my 401k go from what it was to what it is, however, there is a silver lining to all of this. If you are lucky enough to work for a company still doing a match or partial match it's even better. But just think that you're not buying into these funds for less per share than you were when the market was riding high, so now you're share count in these funds will rise faster. Don't worry about where the market is right now, worry about where it's at 20+ years from now when your 401k matters. It would be more of a worry if you were one of the unlucky ones that's right near retirement and had this happen, but this is good for us, it gives us a rare opportunity to buy low.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 05:11 PM) IMO, Roubini's right on this one. I'm cashing out tomorrow... after my 20% pickup since the beginning of March. When the banks report earnings, things are going to plummet again. Or you can leave it there for 10 years and you'll be happy you did. Although this is a traders market -- 20% isn't enough for a trader. For a long term investor (1yr+), 20% + dividend payouts would be huge, but for a trader, 20% is just too low considering the tax rate is 30%+ on short term cap, not to mention the broker cost for the purchase and the sale also cut into the profit. The profit needs to be enough that you notice it after trading fees and taxes when it comes to short term trades. There is a huge ETF market for people who like to do that called pro-shares, etc...it's nothing I'm into, but it exists and it's tailored for people who like to actively trade. I do nothing but buy and hold. I bought into BAC at 4, it's up well over 100% since I bought it, I believe it closed over 9 yesterday. Sell it?! No way. If this guy is right and it goes down to 4 again, I'll just take the opportunity to buy even more -- I don't care about short term gains, I care about 10 years from now. I mostly look for dividend paying stocks, and right now there are still plenty of them at bargain prices. I wish I had more money to sink into the market right now.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Apr 10, 2009 -> 02:55 AM) -- As a fan, I'm sick of the Thome shift. As a fan, I'm sick of Thome not learning to go the other way, since the Thome shift works...a LOT. And I know we don't pay him for base hits, and he's there to pull the ball, but come on -- they're cutting off a ton of his hitting area with this shift, while leaving the ENTIRE left side open.

QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Apr 9, 2009 -> 10:31 PM) And that right there is where your entire argument loses any sort of validity with me. Pods did not win us a ring. Pitching did, there is no other argument against it. Better OBP, BA, HR, TB, RBI, R in 2008 over 2005....Guess what was better in 2005 over 2008.....drumroll......every pitching statistic. Um, I never ONCE said Pods was the reason we won the ring, he was merely one of the many reasons. If you can't score, you can't win -- no matter how dominant your pitching is/was. The biggest difference was Pods was a leadoff hitter, and Gooch was an exceptional #2 hitter who knew what to do and when to do it, and more often than not, if you needed either of them to lay down a sac bunt, they did. And while you may be right about the OBP, BA, HR, TB, RBI and R in 2008 -- you're leaving out something very VERY important...consistency. While we only scored 2-3 runs a game in 05, we did that EVERY game...last year we'd score 1 run, 2runs, 0 runs, 15 runs, 2 run, 1 run, 0 runs, 18 runs. That will eventually add up to higher stats, but it does nothing for consistency. So far this year, we've put up a massive 5 runs in 3 games, which means the 12 run game is inbound, where we win 10-1, then it'll look like we score a lot on paper, even though we don't.

Don't get me wrong -- I'm happy with our pitching...very happy...so far, anyway. I just don't like the fact we can't find a legit #1 or #2 hitter that can make contact or lay down a bunt when it's necessary. I don't even care if our leadoff hitter was fast, just as long as he knows how to lay down a bunt, take a walk, not K, etc. If we had that, I'd be fine with the slower middle of the order power guys -- but we don't. So right now what we have to do is hope one of those guys hits a HR, much like last year (so far anyway), but again, this has only been three games. Oh, and I'm very happy with Getz as leadoff, so maybe this will all change if he finds his groove -- now let's hope he stays there. Then we have to figure out what to do with the 2 hole. We need someone that understands how to move a runner over and make contact. But it doesn't mean I can't call a code blue and vent.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Apr 9, 2009 -> 10:10 PM) I disagree, I think his bat speed is perfectly fine, in fact at times he is a little too quick through the zone. He needs to wait on the pitch a bit more IMO. And BTW, I know you havent seen him hit at every level since he was drafted so the "ever has been" is a pretty bad generalization. He's cheating right now, which is why his bat is through the zone if the pitch happens to be an off speed -- meaning even he thinks his bat speed is down, otherwise why is he swinging so early? That said, I think his bat speed is fine, too...I just thing he's trying to uppercut too much -- his double in the 9th today looked like the first pitch he didn't try to uppercut, and it worked.

QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Apr 9, 2009 -> 10:01 PM) Everybody says this s***...and I just don't see it. How was '05 different from '09 speed lineup wise? 2005 Speed/non slow - LF, CF, 2b 2009 Speed/non slow - LF, CF, 2b, SS, 3b Fields is faster than Crede - 09 Xei is faster than Uribe - 09 Getz is faster than Gooch - 09 Wise/Anderson is faster than Rowand - 09 Pods was faster than TCQ - 05 Thome vs. Everett/Hurt = wash AJP, Dye, PK were never "fast" Those don't add up to us being "slower" this year. We won the WS in 2005 because of pitching....thats all there is to it, Pods/Rowands "grindyness" did not win us a ring. We hit homeruns and our pitching shut everybody the f*** down, simple as that. People need to stop romanticizing that we were winning every game with a god damn bunt, steal, and suicide squeeze.....it did not happen like that. It's not just a speed thing -- but a type of hitter thing. The point is, in 2005, we didn't *have* to hit HR's to win...on the days the HR's didn't come, we found ways to score with singles, steals, SUCCESSFUL sac bunts, etc....we aren't doing that now, we didn't do it last year, and when we do it now it's by accident because this team lacks fundamentals at the plate. Maybe that's how people see it this way. And the biggest way we were different in terms of speed in 05, was Pods was on base a LOT, and he was causing havok to opposing pitchers who were worrying more about him stealing than making a good pitch. We have "some" speed on the team now, but we have no downright scary speed. And Gooch was pretty fast, he stole some bases, but most of all...he knew how to adapt to hit #2 -- and he did it very well. I really don't know how you could question any of this. In 05 we had a legit #1 #2. We haven't since. And this whole list of yours is meaningless: Everyone from 05 still on this team is 4 years older than they were in 05, everyone is now 4 years slower. And none of us saying this are even comparing position to position speed based on 05 vs 09 -- it's just an OLD slow team now for the entire middle of the base clogging order. Pods alone makes the 05 team faster than this entire team combined. Yes, pitching won for us in 05, so did timely hitting, laying down the bunt when we needed it, and getting the big HR when it mattered. Right now the only thing we can rely on is getting the HR, because we can't bunt, we can't steal...and no opposing pitcher is afraid of us doing so.

This is the same feast or famine built offense we jettisoned after 2004 (Magglio, Lee, Valentine, Thomas, etc.) where we went with more defense/speed in 05, won the World Series, and gradually returned to that same offense, some due to age (Dye has slowed considerably), injuries, etc. My point is, we are right back where we started in 2004. Station to station softball where we will go through spurts of scoring 4-5 runs in 3 games, and then we'll score 15 runs in 1 game, even though scoring 2 would have sufficed. I know it's only been three games, and I do hope they proove me wrong/dumb, but I see no consistency coming from this team. We will either rake, or we will do #@$!.

QUOTE (TheHolyBovine @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 03:31 PM) We're on page 8, so I would say that people have opinions on this topic. Isn't that the point of a message board? Is there an approved list of topics we can talk about? I think there are several points to this thread: a) People are pissed about the CF situation (deservedly so) B) Many potential acquisitions exist that would at least temporarily solve the problem (including Dukes) CF has been a problem for this team FOR YEARS. KW's insistence that we "can't afford" a CF, either financially or in the players it would take to acquire such a player, is complete bulls***. The truth is, they have been counting on Ownes to take over the job for years, and cannot publically admit that their player evaluation skills were abysmal in this case. Someone needs to learn how to take a joke.

QUOTE (DBAHO @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 02:48 PM) Alright, I know I've started enough of these "I'm going to such and such, and wanna know what to do there" threads over the past year, but well I finish work here next Thursday and have 1 month to travel around America before I get kicked out of the country, so I'm going to make the most of it. So if anyone has any advice on any of these places that I'll be going to, will be much appreciated. Nashville (gonna go to the Flying Saucer again Northsider). I've also heard that the Blue Bird Cafe is good, as is the Loveless Cafe but that's out of town a bit. Tampa Orlando Daytona Beach San Francisco Los Angeles Seattle I'm also going to Vegas and San Diego, but I've been to the later, and already have enough info on the former. Why are we kicking you out?

Gavin, 6.2IP, 2ER, 7K

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 02:38 PM) Congress isn't going to do it either. That'd be too angry and partisan, you know, enforcing the law, and we can't have that. Nice.

What brand are these new dogs? They still big like the awesome koshers were?

/me boos stretchstetch and Dick Allen. BOO.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 02:22 PM) Of course its not. The point is, he's not capable of doing the things the crowd wants him to do. He shouldn't be booed. I am very critical of White Sox players, but the only player I have ever booed is Jaime Navarro for his piss poor attitude. Its alright IMO to be frustrated with a player or think he absolutely blows, but to boo a guy giving all he's got is just wrong. The people responsible for putting him in a position where he cannot succed should be booed. Boo Ozzie and Kenny. People do.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 02:08 PM) How come they didn't boo when Quentin fanned before Thome homered? Or when AJP and Ramirez had back to back pop outs with the bases loaded an nobody out? The boos were very noticeable for Wise. Unfortunately for Wise, he isn't very good but has been put in a position with a lot of responsibility that he probably doesn't have the ability to fulfill.. He has become the USCF whipping boy. If you need to me answer this question, the team you should be cheering is a few miles north.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 02:10 PM) So just playing for the Twins is good enough reason to boo a player? If that's the only qualification for being boo worthy then you could conceivably boo every Twins hitter each time they come to the plate, that's pretty lame. In my world you need to do a bit more than put on an certain jersey to get your ass booed, if you want the gesture to retain any kind of value then you need to pick your places. If you played for the Twins, I'd boo you too.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 01:45 PM) So you boo every Twins batter who comes to the plate? Sounds like a waste of energy to me. No, I never said I'd boo, I merely said he could DIAF, and some people would consider being a Twin reason enough to boo, you asked for a good reason, I gave you one.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 01:50 PM) Wise was booed after every AB. There even were a few when he was introduced. The few when he was introduced are the typical obnoxious fans and they are better off ignored. But when a lead off man K's, expect some boo's, when he K's twice, expect more...and when he botches a critical lead off situation, expect what he got. Again, too damn bad. And the few boos the first times were meh -- it was the final time that everyone noticed...because until you just said this, I didn't notice him getting booed the first few times, so I'm just taking your word that it even happened. Cleveland fans boo Jim Thome, too. There are always idiots.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 01:41 PM) I can't think of a single good reason to boo him. He'd get a polite golf clap in his first AB from me were I in attendance. I can, he's a Twin. He has leeway because of 2005, and because of all he's done with the Sox, but...he's a Twin. A TWIN. $#@!

I'm not even going to look at who started this thread. Feel free to DIAF along with Joe Crede after his first standing ovation at-bat for Minn for suggesting this.

QUOTE (stretchstretch @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 12:31 PM) He tried out for the team, and management picked him to start. If that's the wrong choice, he personally should not be booed while at the plate, he wronged no one, and treating him as such does nothing to help his confidence or ability to deliver when needed....that behavior is wrong..just wrong...... and counterproductive to the team effort. when mgmt traded roward away and anderson couldn't do the job mgmt picked him to do in his place, did the crowd boo him everytime he came up to the plate??? I'm the camp that BA is the better overall choice, but while Wise it in, I'd rather see him have the best chance at delivernig some of the sparks he did last year by having the crowd back him in the spirit of backging the White Sox. Let him do what his ability allows, and hv mgmt act accordingly in the coming weeks, but don't help doom him to failure--that's just sh**y fansmanship... To be fair, nobody booed him every time he stepped up to the plate...it was just that once, when he super mega failed to perform a basic lead off man task in a critical situation. That was the only time he was booed that I saw, and more to the point, I think people were booing the "typical Sox failure" situation more than they were booing Wise. As for affecting his confidence and ability to deliver? Let's not act like he's a hot dog salesman making 5$ an hour. At MINIMUM, so long as he stays in the majors, he's making about 500K this year. I say that because in 2002 he made 200K, in 2004 he made 350K...feel free to do the math, I'm guessing he makes about a half-mil now, if not more. So boo-hoo to his confidence under pressure. He's paid VERY well to make do with failing and then getting booed for said failure. Now go tell your brother/son/cousin/father Dwayne Wise to buck up and start performing. :P

QUOTE (Ron @ Apr 8, 2009 -> 11:19 AM) Standing O that first at bat. After that, he's a Twin and will be treated accordingly. Exactly. I'd give him his due, tip of the cap, standing applause...after that he's a Twin and may feel free to DIAF. That's die in a fire, not literally of course, but sarcastically.

Dye is going to kill the ball.