fathom

I think the reports of A.J. signing anywhere soon are false because he would be much better off waiting until Varitek signs somewhere. If Varitek left Boston, he could get a nice contract offer from them.

Are we sure that it's not just a poster on WSI that saw the thread on this site, and wanted to start it on that site? That seems like the likely scenario.

I've honestly never heard of a team that saves that much money for a deadline deal. It sounds like a bunch of BS, if you ask me. However, the heat will definitely be on KW if he doesn't spend that money. If he refuses to sign anyone else this off-season, I would be willing to guarantee that he gets fired after this year. I'm confident this current team won't make the playoffs, and that's the only way he can keep his job (making playoffs).

We also didn't win with Willie, Crede, Uribe, Rowand, etc., etc. Getting rid of one power hitter was excusable, but you can't have an offense where you have to rely on mediocre to average MLB players to have career years in order to just have a sufficient offense.

I have to say that when 3 or more different respectable sources report the same thing, it's a lot more than just another stupid message board rumor. I don't trust the White Sox official that told Levine that the Sox aren't involved in the deal. Also, anyone that doesn't think Garland wouldnt be included in the trade is nuts. Dodgers need like 3 starting pitchers to complete their rotation.

Did the Score say that Konerko would be traded for 3 players, or would Vazquez be traded for 3 players from the Sox?

Qwerty: I agree with you, I think Cabrera sucks. However, he's definitely the type of guys that Ozzie/KW seem to have a hard-on for these days. However, I personally feel that any move which makes Willie Harris a reserve is a good move.

First, if we trade Marte, we will not have a great bullpen by any stretch. The Twins have a great bullpen, we would have an average one without Marte Second, Ishii is one of the last pitchers I would ever want on the Sox. He's just awful. No control, no innings, and that was pitching in a great pitcher's park. I would rather have Cotts than Ishii, and people know I'm not a Cotts supporter.

I agree, it's horrendous because we have so little faith in KW that he won't make the stupid move. However, I would be willing to support the trade if it was along the lines of Konerko/Marte for Vazquez/Navarro (with Sox gaining some money in the deal). I could see the Sox then trying to sign Cabrera with the money.

And if you read the NY Daily News article that's linked on rotoworld, the deal seems more likely to happen than to not happen. There's going to be a lot of pissed of Sox fans when they look on this message board when they wake up in around 5 hours.

If we get Duncan in this deal, we can kiss either Anderson, Sweeney, or McCarthy good bye. I still think that the deal will involve more than just PK in terms of Sox major league players. If we give up Garland in this trade, KW shouldn't hold the title of GM another day.

No cash is being exchanged in the 3-way deal, so we'd likely be having to pay for Vazquez entire contract.

Would have been a lot better off saving the money and Timo and using it in a deal to sign Mackowiak if he's non-tendered. He could fill in at 3b against tough righties on occasion. But of course, KW would never let one of his favorite guys go.

I put a lot of this blame on f***ing Ozzie Guillen. His stupid desire to play smallball in the American League in a massive homer park is going to screw this team. He would rather have mediocre/average players like Willie Harris or Scott Podsednik that can run than players that can actually hit a 3-run homer. Hey, we're getting what a lot of people warned us about when we signed him....Ozzie wants players that play like he did when he was here (and he sucked as a hitter!).

BTW, the only way that this trade would make any sense is if a lot of Vazquez's salary is paid by the Dodgers, but it doesn't seem like that would happen. Vazquez makes about 12 million, while the Sox guys being traded make about 14 million. If KW is doing this to save 2 million dollars, then he's a bigger dumbass than we give him credit. Now, if we were to save like 8 million dollars in this, and he turned around and tried to sign Odalis, Pierzynski, and Polanoo with the new money, I would actually support this trade. However, I don't see the Dodgers giving up any money.

Projected lineup would be 1b- Gload 2b- Harris 3b- Crede SS- Uribe Lf- Podsednik CF- Rowand RF- Dye C- Davis DH- Thomas/Everett Folks, that's one of the worst hitting teams in the majors right there. And guess what, we'd still be without a number 5 starting pitcher, and we'd be missing our most reliable reliever over the last 3 years.

Well, it looks as if KW is trying to involve himself in the big RJ trade by offering a package of Konerko, Garland, and Marte for Javier Vazquez. Well, this would be one of the worst trades in history if you ask me. KW, if you do this trade, you will not believe the outrage that occurs by Sox fans. Our offense will be the worst in baseball next year, and JR is too f***ing cheap to sign even average players. How f***ing pathetic is it that we don't even have enough confidence in KW to not even make the dumbest of trades? EDIT: Since this talk is turning out to be bunk, I (Showtime) changed the title of this topic.

Carlos is all but locked up for the next two years for a sum of about 15.5 million dollars. In this market, that's extremely cheap for a .300/30/100 type of player. I know a lot of us care so much about the White Sox that we develop a bias for certain players. However, all you have to do is read what unbiased baseball experts have to say about the Carlos trade. Rotoworld might have been the only source who said that the trade was decent for the White Sox. KW has just a terrible reputation among baseball analysts.

No, it just goes to show that it was pretty obvious that Clement was the impact starter that KW had his sights set on. However, if the 3/21 (which I gathered from different sources like Tribune, Bruce Levine, Comcast, but am fairly certain it was in the vicinity) was all that KW could afford to spend on a pitcher, he's better off just filling in other holes cause he won't get an impact starter this offseason at that price. A big problem I had with the Carlos trade was that it didnt really fill any of the team's glaring holes. We could have used Carlos to get us a starting pitcher. The only thing that the trade did was make the 4 million we're spending on Everett seem even more pointless.

Difference between Johan and Cotts is that Santana has 3 pitches, while Cotts only has 1 right now. The only reason that Santana was in the majors in 2000 was cause he was a Rule V draftee, and had to remain at that level to remain on the Twins. Also, Santana has a more lively arm than does Cotts. However, on this current staff, I could see how people would think that Cotts could be a potential number 3 pitcher. It wouldn't shock me at all if Cotts was our number 4 pitcher by the all-star break next year.

If KW really thought that 3 yr, 21 million was going to get Clement signed when competing against Red Sox and Angels, he's dumber than I thought. I've never heard of a team hoping for a hometown discount when he wasnt even on the White Sox last year.

YES. KW's line about saving the money for a deadline deal was a perfect excuse to use against criticism. I don't know about you, but I've never head of a GM saving 6 million for a deadline deal. I'm calling KW a f***ing liar on this one. Just for the record, I was saying this the second I heard him on the radio the day of the Lee trade. If KW goes out and spends money this offseason, I will apologize to him. I hope I'm wrong, but I feel this was a salary dump all the way. I think that the bad things that have come out about Carlos the last few days was a way for KW to deflect some of the criticism for the deal.

The only way I could understand KW not bringing in another starting pitcher is if he upgrades the Sox at other positions by bringing in a few guys like Pierzynski, Polanco, or others. I would hate that we'd have to go with Grilli or Cotts, but I would be a lot more confident in our lineup. Rather, if this team stays at it is, KW is a f***ing idiot who deserved to be fired 2 years ago.

Well, since they didn't sign Clement, I would assume that it would only increase the chance that he "may" enter camp as the 5th starter. Also, on no planet is a 7.40 ERA acceptable from a starting pitcher. If we want a crappy 5th starter, Cotts is a better option cause at least he has potential.

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