ZoomSlowik

The problem with that system is if your choice is go pro right out of high school or stay there for 2 or 3 years no one good is going to want to go to college. Then we're back to the huddled masses entering the draft and no one knowing what the hell you've got until 3 years down the road outside of the top 1% of players. DeAndre Jordan very likely would have been a top-5 pick if he could have declared right out of high school, after a year in college they saw he wasn't even close and slid considerably. It's better for the NBA and college basketball if these guys end up going to college, even if it's only for a year. If they're going to set it up like that, the NBDL has to become a more viable option as a minor league system so these guys aren't riding the bench in the NBA because they're not ready. They also might want to consider adding another round to the draft to accommodate a few more projects entering the draft.

It's probably safe to take the Warriors off that list until they find another real PG, or possibly another big man as well. Davis really made that work, and they still missed the playoffs last year even with him. It's generally not a good sign when your 4 best players are wings. However, Portland should be a MUCH bigger threat assuming Oden is even close to healthy, so the point remains valid. It won't be easy to make serious noise out west.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 9, 2008 -> 03:50 PM) What was the difference in what happened with Brand and Davis. Did the Clippers actually renounce the rights to Brand after he opted out? I'm assuming that is the case and the Warriors did not do that? I ask that because I remember reading that the Clippers did not have Larry Bird rights with Brand due to something (I know Brand opted out same as Davis, but the question is did the Clippers also renounce his rights to clear additional room for Davis). I'm not really sure, maybe I'm wrong. I thought that Seattle did that with Rashard Lewis last year though so he could get more money. Was he a restricted free agent? I didn't think so. Maybe it no longer applies once they hit the open market and is only good when signing an extension, or maybe the option years throw the whole thing off.

QUOTE (DBAH0 @ Jul 9, 2008 -> 03:45 PM) Cleveland could maybe offer Szcerbiak (big expiring contract), Vareajao and Daniel Gibson plus a few draft picks for Baron Davis. But yeah, I think Baron's stuck in LA at this point. They're going to go after Josh Smith or Emeka Okafor (who'd be perfect next to Chris Kaman at PF) at this point. They may offer Okafor something like a $70M deal for 5 years actually. Varejao and Gibson are the only two remotely interesting youngsters they can give up, and I can't really see them giving up Gibson because he's so amazingly cheap and his outside shooting is a huge asset, especially if you have Lebron AND Davis drawing defenders. They do have PLENTY of expiring money they can send back, besides Wally they also have Damon Jones, Erik Snow and Joe Smith. That's like $25 mil in contracts. Varejao makes about $6 mil as well now, so salary clearly isn't the issue. However, if you're Golden State do you really do them a favor like that just for something like Varejao and a future pick? The pending cap space isn't as big a deal because you don't have the contracts right now and that would prevent them from going after restricted free agents. It's FAR more likely that Davis just ends up signing in LA anyways, he doesn't have a whole lot of options. Plus with Brand going to Philly and Magette off the books LA still has 10-15 mil left to play with depending on what kind of contract Davis finally ends up signing.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 9, 2008 -> 03:40 PM) Does Golden State have enough cash to put together a sign and trade deal? I'm assuming they are limited by the cap in what they can offer Davis since he opted out? Or am I mistaken in that and they can still offer him a max deal. I'm not 100% sure, but the wording would seem to suggest they do: "In a nutshell, the Larry Bird exception allows teams to exceed the salary cap to re-sign their own free agents, at an amount up to the maximum salary. To qualify as a Bird free agent, a player must have played three seasons without being waived or changing teams as a free agent." Technically he's still "their" free agent, they just don't hold an option year or an option to match the contract anymore.

QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Jul 9, 2008 -> 03:23 PM) Maybe not. I wonder if Cleveland might try to get Baron now. There's been talk that he might want to get out of his LA contract now that his "friend" Elton left him there to rot. They don't have enough money to get him, the only teams with any cap space left are the Clippers, Golden State and Memphis. They'd have to work out a major sign-and-trade with Golden State and they really don't have any good, young talent to send back.

QUOTE (DBAH0 @ Jul 8, 2008 -> 10:21 PM) Yeah that team's going to be good next season, top 6, and the East has gotten a lot deeper already this off-season. Magic signed Mickael Pietrus as well for the MLE. Interesting signing, that we'd go for him over Maggette, because he's a better defender and 3 point shooter (which is what we need from the SG spot). It'll be nice if we actually have someone to guard Rip Hamilton come playoff time. The East will be a lot more interesting this year. Boston is the defending champ, Orlando will be back and Detroit still has 4 above average starters. Philly looks like a major contender for that #4 spot along with possibly Toronto if O'Neal is healthy. Washington has their big 3 back and might be healthier (not a fan personally, but they have talent), Lebron will likely keep Cleveland from falling to far. Then you still have a young Atlanta team, a potentially resurgent Miami team with Beasley and maybe a healthy Wade and MAYBE the Bulls if they do things right. You might actually have to earn a playoff spot in the East this year.

Assuming Davis really does want out of Golden State (and it sounds like he does), the Clippers are really his only option barring a major sign-and-trade or a serious paycut. Golden State, the Clippers, Philadelphia and Memphis are the only teams with significant cap room. Philly is using it on Brand and Memphis isn't going to make a sizeable offer. He probably won't be happy about it, but unless something weird happens he'll honor his verbal agreement.

Since I guess this is the NBA thread now, Elton Brand will apparently sign with the 76ers. ESPN story That's a VERY interesting team once it becomes official and they extend Iguodala (though no assumptions yet since we said the same thing about the Clippers after they signed Davis).

You've got to think Beane was thinking that he had to get something for Harden while he could before he got hurt again and can't move him for a bag of balls. It just might be that it's coming soon given the erratic performance his last two starts and constant reports that his velocity is down of late. He did the same thing moving Mulder a year before he had to, and that turned out pretty well. I just can't see Beane doing this if he had ANY confidence in Harden staying healthy even up until the deadline. The Cubs basically got Mark Prior 2.0.

Happy birthday you crazy bastard, I'm sure you're too drunk to read this by now.

QUOTE (chimpy2121 @ Jul 3, 2008 -> 02:18 PM) They should just be the Oklahoma City Spartans. They'd go undefeated their first 2 seasons! (That's a GLB reference only a couple of people will get). I would just like to state for the record that I thought of this first, but didn't bother posting it because there are literally 4 people on this board that will get the joke/reference.

QUOTE (Frankensteiner @ Jul 1, 2008 -> 10:58 PM) Well, the original poster was comparing the two pitchers in their careers, or at least I thought he was. Him pointing out that Garcia's 4.09 ERA wasn't a massive upgrade over Vazquez's 4.29 ERA. I took that to mean that Garcia wasn't all that much better than Vazquez during their career. I disagree with that. Garcia was much better. I said I would take a healthy Garcia (i.e. Garcia of 2004 - 2005) over Vazquez and then added that it was doubtful Garcia was healthy now. There really wasn't all that much difference, a .2 ERA difference comes out to one run every 45 innings, or about 5 runs in an entire season, or 1 every 6 starts or so depending on how you look at it. Yes, Vasquez was pitching in the NL in Montreal, but Freddy was also pitching in pitcher-friendly Safeco for some much better teams. Just look at his 2004 split between Seattle and the Sox to see how much difference that can make, he posted a 3.20 in Seattle and a 4.46 in Chicago. Vasquez also got off to a much slower start to his career (6.06 and 5.00 ERA his first two years), which hurts his overall numbers. Freddy wasn't quite as bad as Javy when he was bad, but he was still pretty damn inconsistent, and 3 of the last 5 seasons before this surgery he posted an ERA above 4.50 (and it might have been 4 if all of 2004 had been in the Cell). I really think the "better pitcher" debate comes down to which year you pick, as it's clearly in Javy's favor the last two seasons as well several years in Montreal. And yes, if he had close to his old stuff or people thought he would he'd have been signed already, Mark Prior and Mark Mulder got signed while they were still injured, I believe Bartolo Colon was as well at some point the last few years, and I'm sure there are others that I'm forgetting. If we're talking about him as a late season alternative to limit the innings for Danks or Floyd in September that's one thing, it's another to say we should take Javy out of the rotation for him in the unlikely event that he's healthy. He's 3 seasons removed from being a significantly more effective pitcher than Vasquez now, it's really not the same guy.

Yes, Freddy's 4.09 career ERA BEFORE he was hurt is clearly a massive upgrade over Vasquez. Both guys have been talented starters that can be wildly inconsistent. The difference is one clearly still has the stuff that makes him elite at times while the other doesn't. If Freddy had anything CLOSE to his old stuff he'd be signed already for a fair amount of money.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 30, 2008 -> 09:52 AM) While I totally agree with you that your lineup there is as good of a 5 as the Bulls can put on the court this year...I'll still fire back that "The best offensive 5 the Bulls can put on the court this year" should not by any means be Paxson's goal right now. His goal should be to have the best team assembled possible for the 2010-2011 season and beyond, because you just have to assume Rose's learning curve is going to take a couple years, and trying to win now has a strong chance of hurting you down the road. Considering Brand is the only player in that lineup over 25, I don't see how that's really a concern. God forbid they make Tyrus actually EARN playing time for a contending team. Just look at Andrew Bynum, he STILL didn't get 30 minutes a game this past year when he was healthy and it hasn't exactly hurt the Lakers. He can still get a fair number of minutes (though Noc might have to go too, then you'd have only 3 legit options inside splitting 96 minutes and Tyrus still occasionally playing the 3) and you wouldn't be putting all of your eggs in one basket hoping he develops. The same goes in the backcourt with Thabo, with Hinrich gone as part of the deal there's only 4 guys splitting 96 minutes, it's not like he'll never see the floor. You can still make plenty of progress with player and chemistry development without throwing a roster out there that'll score about 90 points a game and win 30-35 again.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jun 26, 2008 -> 11:48 AM) Technically they can still work out a trade though, it just can't be official as of today. This has happened several times in the draft in previous years. They'll make an annoucement saying that the two teams have "agreed to a deal in principle" but all of the details and technicalities won't get ironed out until mid-summer.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 26, 2008 -> 10:34 AM) Anyone know what it would take to make a Wade & #2 pick for #1 pick and [insert players here] work under the salary cap? Wade makes about $14 mil, so money isn't a terribly big issue. Hinrich or Hughes make up the bulk of it, and Nocioni or Gooden can take up a pretty big chunk as well. The bigger issue is talent, I have a hard time seeming them do it with out getting at least 2 more key pieces besides #1.

Weird, could have sworn that same one said something different... Still, it depends on which article you believe. There was another one they posted that said it wasn't an either/or with Conley/Lowry and that the package would change, plus if you click on the rumors link on the draft page it says Conley will not be part of the package at all according to the Memphis papers.

I don't think any of the deals have been Conley, Miller and #5 thus far, IIRC it's been either Conley and #5 or Miller, Lowry and #5 (though I think some versions have them not taking Blount). You never know though, this is Chris Wallace we're talking about, and they love to shed money. They might just give you that package if you take Cardinal's awful deal off their hands the way they seem to want to save money.

Happy Birthday!

QUOTE (JFields27 @ Jun 4, 2008 -> 12:10 PM) just draft Rose, trade Gordan and the 2nd to move up to the 22nd spot in the 1st and grab Roy Hibbert Wow, no thanks. Hibbert has stiff written all over him, no way I give up Gordon (or Hinrich) to get him. The guy just isn't a good athlete and struggles when he has to face guys that are quicker than him, which is nearly everyone.

QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Jun 2, 2008 -> 08:57 AM) That would definitely also be a target, but I personally feel that between his youth and the fact that he played all 82 last season, Charlotte will want far too much for a guy who really isn't all that fantastic offensively. Brand is a 20-10 guy at age 29 while Okafor is a 14-10 guy at age 26 (when the seasons starts). To be honest with you, there is no reason not to expect Noah to be able to put up Okafor numbers in a season or 2. Unless Rose actually does become Chris Paul soon, no. Okafor actually has SOME ability in the post and can hit a turnaround jumper, and was a monster offensive threat at UConn. He's not a go-to post option by any stretch, but he's more than capable and his FG% went way up when he stopped taking so many jumpshots. He averages 14 a game even as a poor free throw shooter and takes about as many shoots as Drew Gooden (who normally gets closer to 12). Unless Noah gets drastically better as a shooter/post-up player he's not going to get much more than what his teammates can create for him, and his shooting form and strength leave something to be desired. 8-10 he can do with playing time, I wouldn't expect a whole lot more than that though, if it does somehow happen it's a bonus. That said, paying him significant money on a long term deal wouldn't be high on my list given his history of frailty and the fact that he's good but just not an impact player.

Man, I got a bunch of things, though many require a more extensive spice collection. I'll throw a few in here anyways... We never used to make it very often, but I'm starting to get hooked on ham. It's pretty cheap (just got like a 10-pound ham for like $17 even when it wasn't on sale) and you can make some very simple glazes with brown sugar or molasses or some kind of honey mustard to give it some more flavor. That'll be good for plenty of meals if you're cooking for one and can be used frequently for sandwiches. Here's another one, a very simple casserole with ground beef that is very good. 2 lbs ground beef (fairly lean) 2 large potatoes, peeled and thinly sliced 2 large onions, sliced 1 large can of diced tomatoes or tomato sauce (at least 15 oz) salt and pepper to taste crushed red pepper to taste (optional) shredded cheese of your choice (optional) First, layer a fairly large casserole dish or baking pan (should be fairly deep) with the beef (preferrably fairly lean). Season it with some salt and pepper and some crushed red pepper if you're so inclined, then add a layer of potatoes. Season it again, then add a layer of onion and season a bit again. Just repeat that process until you use up all of your potato and onion (usually 2 layers of each). Then dump the tomatoes in and top with cheese (actually, now that I think about it, you probably want to do that closer to the end of the cooking time). Then stick it in the oven on 350 for 1-2 hours (varies depending on your oven) and you've got a tasty meal that'll last you a while (it re-heats pretty well too). Serves 4 or 5 pretty healthy eaters, or often times more. I got another beef skillet recipe too, it's a bit faster but also requires a bit more effort. 1/2 lb bacon cut into small pieces 2 onions cut into bite-sized chunks 2-3 bell peppers cut into bite-sized chunks 2 lb flank steak, cut into small strips 1 1/2 cups ketchup 1/2 teaspoon sage (or more if desired) salt and pepper to taste Start by frying the bacon until it's nearly crisp (you want it to be cooked but soft, not crispy) in a large skillet. Then drain the pan if necessary, but you want to leave some grease in there for cooking purposes. Then add the onions and cook until they're slightly soft. Add the green peppers and cook until they're slightly softened. Remove the veggies and bacon from the pan. Brown the strips of beef (it's a bit easier if you do a few pieces at a time). They don't need to be fully cooked yet, just seared to add some flavor and to get them started. After they're all browned, re-add all of the beef and the veggies/bacon. Season as desired with salt and pepper. Add the ketchup and sage, mix well. Cover the pan and simmer on low for 15-20 minutes (or until beef is tender). We generally serve it over some thick noodles to absorb the sauce. Again, a tasty meal that will last a while that is also good re-heated. Serves at least 4 healthy eaters.

QUOTE (SoxFan101 @ May 23, 2008 -> 11:51 PM) quit slurping Chandler, yes he was a better defender but he is way more ineffective offensively than Tyrus. Without Paul he would avg. 5 ppg. Also have you considered most of the time when called for goaltending the likelyhood of that ball going in anyways was pretty high. With a guy like Rose leading the offense Tyrus is prob going to avg. more points just next year more than Chandler ever did. I used to be a big Chandler fan but between you and Hammer im starting to dislike him. One would think he was the greatest thing on Earth with the amount of love he gets. Also, Chandler was avg. 5 points a game his last season with the bulls so dont know where you were going with that, the only reason we struggled without him was because we had nobody competent behind him to play. Chandlers only real solid year was the 04-05 one but if given the playing time I have no doubts that Tyrus can match or top his point output and block output he had that year. Maybe not the 10 boards but around 7-8 isnt out of the question. Tyrus was an awful offensive player this year, he shot 42.3% from the floor and his 48.7% on shots in the basket area was among the worst in the league. Even Kirk Hinrich hit 55% of his shots in the immediate basket area, and he's not exactly a great finisher either. Even on the Bulls Tyson shot around 50%, and it's not like either of them takes a lot of high difficulty attempts. Blocks are only part of defensive play, a lot of times the smart play is to just stick your arms up and make the shot more difficult while getting in better position to get the rebound. Tyrus hasn't figured that out yet.

People forget how productive Tyson was at times for the Bulls because he had a bad 05/06 season before he was dealt. In his second year (02/03) he posted a PER of 15.89 and in his 4th year (04/05) he posted a 16.47 PER. Considering he's pretty offensively challenged that's fairly impressive, and if he hadn't been hurt most of 03/04 there might have been another solid season. He hasn't really played THAT much better in New Orleans (17.06 and 17.56 PER's, reasonably big difference but not colossal), really the only differences are a lower foul rate (which allows him to play more) and a higher field goal percentage (which you can obviously attribute largely to Paul).