southsideirish71

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Dec 1, 2006 -> 08:12 PM) Err, I said that. I said, if we can get some good youthful pitching in a trade, then do it, but if we can't get something good then keep the five. Enjoy your useless draft pick compensation then.

QUOTE(VAfan @ Dec 1, 2006 -> 02:35 PM) "Barring a trade making sense for the White Sox in the present and helping in the future, Williams will bring his same starting five to Spring Training in Tucson in February. " I was going to start a separate post on this point, but I'll confine my comments to this thread for the moment. I see no reason why the Sox should make moves this offseason unless they will help the team make another run at a World Series in 2007. I don't think we should sell out for 2007, but I also don't see dumping skilled veterans to embark on some rebuilding plan that will clearly weaken our team next year. That's one huge reason why I thought the Crede+Garcia for Figgins+Santana deal made no sense for us. We could significantly weaken our team going into next season without appreciably helping us in the long run. Now, if the right deal came along for Vazquez -- and I don't think any deals for pitchers will materialize until the FA pitching market is settled and all the major arms are signed -- I think it would make sense to move him. But that's because I believe replacing Vazquez with McCarthy in 2007 would help us NEXT YEAR. You must love draft picks, because if we dont resign Buerhle or Garcia for jackpot money that is what we are getting. Remember we are at 100million already, if you think we are going north of 130 to resign every favorite player you are mad.

These quotes from one of the websites that have some of these pics are pretty funny.

QUOTE(CanOfCorn @ Dec 1, 2006 -> 04:21 PM) So you are saying that Iguchi is being shoe-horned into the #2 hole? You think he's a leadoff hitter? I think not. He's a #6 or #7 hitter. This signing is called covering your a**. We DO need OBP guys and Gload is that guy, but we also have pitchers that pitch to contact, we know what we have in Pods...maybe it's not great, but we know what it is. Gload has NEVER played LF for an extended period of time. 2.9 mil for one year isn't a big deal especially for what FA are signing for. Pods is horrible in LF. Ozuna is almost better than him, and that is saying a lot. I think Gload will give you the same bad defense that Pods gives you in LF, except that Gload can hit, Gload can hit lefties, and Gload is easily something we need in front of the thumpers, someone that can get on with his stick and have a good OBP.

QUOTE(VAfan @ Dec 1, 2006 -> 03:33 PM) Pods RC27 number -- 3.88 -- ranks him among the worst qualifiers in baseball last year. Of course, this wasn't the worst figure on the team. While we're at it, why not look at the whole team. We averaged 5.35 runs/game. Who upped the average, and who lowered it? Our fabulous 3 Jim Thome = 9.15 Jermaine Dye = 8.77 Paul Konerko = 7.53 More than pulled their weight Ross Gload = 6.03 Ozuna = 5.83 Joe Crede = 5.70 Almost average AJ = 5.21 Iguchi = 5.26 Mack = 5.31 Offensive deadweights Brian Anderson 3.35 Juan Uribe 3.69 Pods 3.88 Cintron 4.24 No one else had even 100 plate appearances. So what conclusions should we draw from this?? Re-signing Pods for even $2.9 million is a lack of foresight and a mistake. Ross Gload should be our starting left fielder next season -- with Mackowiak backing him up -- unless someone can emerge that can hit nearly as well as he can and field better than he can. Ross Gload created 6 runs/game last year. And the other year he got more than 150 ABs, he created 6.41 runs/game. That is pretty damn good, considering Joe Crede comes in at 5.70 runs/game. It wouldn't put him among the LF leaders in this category, but it would be respectable. And Iguchi followed by Gload followed by Dye would be so much better than Pods/Iguchi/Dye that it wouldn't be funny. Gload is a prototypical #2 hitter -- high average, low strike outs, left handed, bunts well, hits lefties and righties equally well -- whereas Iguchi is being shoe-horned into that role. But I've given up hope that logic will prevail here. Ozzie Guillen has to be chirping in KW's ear about needing speed, speed, speed. To hell with speed. With Dye/Thome/Konerko being the best 3-4-5 in baseball, just get someone ON ahead of them. We dont agree on a lot, however I entirely agree with this. Ross Gload should be our LF and hitting 2nd. With Tad leading off. Prancer should not see the light of day, he should be a pinch runner at best.

QUOTE(SoxHawk1980 @ Dec 1, 2006 -> 01:09 PM) With below average hitting and pitching, it kind of makes one wonder how we won 90 games. It also makes me wonder if we should expect better from the 2007 team if we essentially stand pat. Well, the offseason is far from over... After the allstar break we went into lift and pull mode as a team. AJ went from hitting well over 300, to hitting in the low 200s. He was the most telling on changing his approach at the plate. Something needs to be done about this teams lack of smarts in the 2nd half when the pressure gets on, and the temp heats up. Every person we bring to this team, becomes Mr. Homer. The part plays to home run strenghts that is true, but you dont need to become a lift and pull hitter to get that to happen. If you put a good swing on the ball, it will carry out. You dont need to hit it 400 feet to have it leave. Yet everytime in crucial situations, we had hitters swinging for the fences, How many times did we see AJ who was clutch all 1st half, falling over trying to hit a dong when all we needed was a single to drive in the run from second. If this team hits what is given to them, they can lead the league in offense. If they get into pull only mode, then every single team just like the last few years will start featuring only low and away pitching and will shut this team down. Remember the formula for years was throw low and away and bounce a breaking ball in the opposing batters box and you will 2 hit the team through the 5th inning.

Great another year of Prancer. Just what I needed to see. He will never get subbed unless its a tough lefty, because Ozzie loves his diminutive speed guys with no tools up at the top. The only thing worse would be to sign Timo Perez.

QUOTE(LosMediasBlancas @ Nov 30, 2006 -> 01:36 PM) I love the KW translators, gives me a good chuckle. The KW giggle is the real giveaway.

QUOTE(supernuke @ Nov 29, 2006 -> 09:19 PM) I get the feeling that Ozzie isn't thrilled with Bmac so Kenny is looking at Santana to make Bmac expendable. I would have no problem seeing Bmac sent to the D-rays for Crawford but I think TB will be looking for a package that is at least the equivilant of what the Yanks got for Sheffield. If we get rid of a cheap good pitcher because Ozzie isnt too thrilled, then Ozzie needs to be canned along with anyone who listened to him. I guess everyone just really wants the good ol days, when we had a great offense and so so pitching. Yeah maybe we can keep fighting the royals for 5th in a few years with that mentality. f*** Crawford, get pitching pitching and more pitching. What in the name of god do you think that he is going to do when he gets into the cell. Do you really thing he wont go for hte long ball. Come one, your fast, great all around player will bulk up and become another corner OF.

QUOTE(Rex Kicka** @ Nov 29, 2006 -> 04:28 PM) So, he's a nutjob. Established. But he's an established nutjob with a good point in this letter. Here is another nutjob, a bit before most of our time. He made similiar wonderful nice speeches about being friends of his neighbor, and how he wanted peace. Very similiar to what the Iranian nutjob is doing right now.

QUOTE(Vance Law @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 10:02 PM) At least Chavez didn't win the Gold Gl..........Chavez won the Gold Glove. Nice. http://baseballmusings.com/ Boras has this in Crede's future prospectus file for his Free Agency bidding process.

QUOTE(South Side Fireworks Man @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 10:10 PM) Everyone wants (should want) cheap quality pitching. Annibal Sanchez young cheap quality Josh Johnson young cheap quality Dontrell young not so cheap, but could get a kings ransom if they spin him this year Then there is petit, olsen, and the rest of their army of young cheap arms. This is one of the organizations that has a bevy of what everyone wants. Where they lack is in position player development. They spin pitchers off for position players. Which is what they will do with Dontrell. Now on the other hand this is a team for sale, why would they send of arguably their best offensive player, who is still affordable.

QUOTE(South Side Fireworks Man @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 10:02 PM) OK, here's what the Sox do: KW trades Garcia and Crede to the Angels for Figgins and Santana. Then he flips Santana along with Fields and Anderson to the Marlins for Miguel Cabrera. Figgins in Left, Sweeney in Center and Dye in Right along with Cabrera at Third, Uribe at Short, Iguchi at Second and Konerko at First. Pierzynski Catches and Thome at DH. McCarthy moves into the rotation. Sox get faster, younger, cheaper and arguably better. You realize that the Marlins are swimming in cheap pitching right now. So they really dont want Santana.

QUOTE(TheBigHurt @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 09:33 PM) Yeah, I know. I realize this. I guess it's just a hard dose of reality trying to set in. I want to see Figgins, but IMO, he's no comparison at all to Crede in terms of value to our club. He's been a key component , and call me pessimistic, but I can't see the Sox doing nearly as well without him. The sox give fair offers to their players, however guys like Boras always and I mean always go with the highest bidder. So lets just say if Boras was representing Kong last year and we went to FA, Konerko would be having a banner season as Palmero's replacement in Baltimore.

QUOTE(TheBigHurt @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 09:17 PM) I want to see Figgins, but I don't want to see Crede or Freddy go, honestly. I could deal with seeing Freddy go, but frankly, and call me stubborn if you want, I am against any trade that has the name "Crede" strapped to it, and I don't care what anyone says. I'd hope there would be some way to get Figgins without giving up Joe. Maybe trade Freddy and simply put B-Mac in the rotation as apparently is planned. Well with what money praytell are you going to pay Joe when Boras gets him to Free Agency. Take a look at the contracts. Konerko will be asking Joe for a loan when all is said and done. Well that is if he keeps playing like this, if he goes back to being Joe who hits 240 to 250 then pretty much you turned down a top flight pitcher for medicore with good defense, or you get a nice 1st round draft pick from a team that is probably a world series contender so basically all the good stuff is gone.

QUOTE(soxpride77 @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 04:39 PM) Looking at Crawfords splits, he doesn't have great numbers leading off anyway. How unbelievable would that be to have the top two base stealers at the top of the order, followed up by our power at 3-4-5? It would be unbelievable. Hopefully KW can find a way to make this all happen, and still hold onto Santana AND McCarthy in the process. With our lineup you dont need speed guys. You need someone on base period. Give me a line drive with a high OBP over a speed guy, who's OBP is mirrored with his BA and doesnt walk a lot. We need guys to get on, and we need our thumpers to drive them in. And that doesnt mean try and hit homers all the time. Just drive the ball. If we do that we are fine. I still think Mack in LF and leading off over Pods and we win a crapload more games last year than having him out there to be an out.

QUOTE(103 mph screwball @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 04:27 PM) Curious. Could the Sox ask for a player to be named later that is contingent upon if Freddie signs an extension or resigns with the Angels next off season? Might a deal be worked out with Freddie renegotiating his contract before the trade? Freddie would be far more valuable to the Angels if they knew he was going be with them for more than one year. KW was willing to give up quite a bit for Freddie because he had a hunch that he would stick around. Also, if hypothetically rumors do come true, who would be the better CF Figgins or Crawford and who would lead off? Anyone know how to make a hot stove smile? I have seen some deals where they have a window to negotiate with the player and the deal is contingent on that. But maybe they just need fastball Freddy for this year and this year only. They could have a stud ready to go in AAA, and just dont want to have a hole in their rotation. They could see if his fastball rebounds before resigning him. I dont think Freddy is the key to this deal.

QUOTE(VAfan @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 03:53 PM) Figgins is worthless. His OBP sucks, and he has no power. In the 2005 ALCS, did he even get on base more than once?? Pods, as bad as he is, played circles around him in 2005. As for Ervin Santana, people are acting like he's Francisco Liriano without elbow troubles. Sure, he has a live arm. And he's relatively cheap because he's just starting out. But is he going to be a dominant starter? Is he a #1 guy? Will he ever be a #1 guy? I don't think so. As bad as Freddie Garcia was last year, he still managed to win 17 games, and lose 9. (Santana was 16-8.) Sure, I'd take Santana for Garcia straight up because of the age difference (though I know the Angels wouldn't make that deal), but I don't think Santana will be that much better of a pitcher over the next 3-4 years, frankly. I think Freddy's arm is going to come back, and he's got enough guile that he will remain a winning pitcher into his late 30's. Mark it down. But the deal buster would be dumping Joe Crede at this point. You might as well add a half run to the team ERA if we eliminate the vacuum man from 3B next year. Especially if you are talking about replacing him with Josh Fields or Chone Figgins. If you want Joe Crede, you'd have to offer me more than Ervin Santana. We don't have our first WS trophy in 89 years if we don't have Joe Crede at 3B. So far, I haven't seen any deals that make a lot of sense for the Sox. We really need better offensive production from LF, SS, and CF, plus a solidified bullpen, and, most important of all, better production from our starters. But it is not easy to fix any of those issues. Which starters do you keep, and which do you trade? Should we give up on Brian Anderson after only one year -- when he was rushed too soon to begin with? Should we abandon Juan Uribe, whose defense is stellar, and his tremendous SS power?? Is there a good option in LF that costs less than $10 million/year? You are the one who wants to consistantly stay with what we have, throw the bones and hope for the best. So We Willie Harris got into scoring position for the series clinching run. Should we have kept him, what about Geoff Blumm. If you want Joe to stay, give him a call and tell him to fire boras and take a decent offer. As far as resigning these people, LOL. How much money do you think we have. We are already at over 100 million dollars. Lets put this in whats going to happen. Freddy and his fastball will still get a lot of money no matter how bad he is. Crap is getting 8 mill a year this offseason. Joe Crede will run towards FA, like the titanic sailed towards the iceberg. Nothing will change it. He will get jackpot prices. And Mr. Boras doesnt believe in a hometown discount. So kiss him goodbye. See you. How much will Jermaine Dye get next year. Gooch is gone after this year. So again, how are we keeping these guys all together. Oh yeah, we trade some people who are near the end of their contract so we can infuse the team with new talent. This is how the WS was won in the first place. We traded Carlos Lee, whom Scotty Pods couldnt hold his jock with the bat. Magglio who is a nice hitter, he gone. Jose Valentstatche is also gone. This is called turnover. It happens.

QUOTE(southsideirish @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 03:02 PM) I don't see where this is a bad deal for the Angels. We should not be asking what more we can throw in, we should be looking for more from the Angels. Chone Figgins and Ervin Santana is not enough for Joe Crede and Freddy Garcia. I am sorry, it just isn't. The Angels desperately need a 3rd baseman. Joe Crede is a proven all around talent at 3rd base and plays at a very high level. Freddy Garcia is a proven workhorse pitcher and big game pitcher. If they throw in anything less than Brandon Wood or Erik Aybar then this deal is not getting done for me. At the very least they must give us Brandon Wood/Erik Aybar, Chone Figgins, and Ervin Santana for Joe Crede and Ervin Santana. If not, I walk away. So basically we are either jacking up payroll to 135 million to support our aging expensive pitching staff and boras clients, or we are losing Crede and getting a draft pick. I think you overestimate our players value.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 02:18 PM) Jeesh, where did you get the lcd? As for Stoneman, I am confused. I understand he loves his prospects. So what you mean is he would have no problem dealing Figgins and keeping Aybar, correct? So I guess the answer is you believe it would be easier and cheaper to acquire Santana and Figgins rather than Santana and Aybar? Microcenter in Westmont, 37inch Olevia LCD 1080i. They had 42inchers for 799. Stoneman is very attached to his prospects. With their system they could of made some big splashes at the trade deadline and chose not to, because he really likes to keep his system intact. Figgins makes a few bucks and is more expendable with Matthews signed. Matthews can hit leadoff. Now the question is, will Ozzie want to have KW keep Pods in LF and put Chone in CF so he can have his mini-mee speed lineup and put Tad further down the lineup. Who knows. It could also spell that Pods gets spun off for something.

QUOTE(tonyho7476 @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 02:00 PM) oh, then you punch him in the face. I waited for hours in the cold for a 37 inch LCD for $499. It on my wall, and making fun of him here > getting kicked out of line and the satisfaction of beating the flub fan. QUOTE(iamshack @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 02:03 PM) I wonder what it would take from our side to make this happen? I wonder if they would consider dealing Santana/Aybar rarther than Figgins? Or if something such as Crede/Garcia/Phillips for Santana/Figgins? Stoneman will have no problem ditching Figgins over Aybar. Stoneman loves his prospects and has a hard time getting rid of them. He has the anti-KW philosophy on it.

QUOTE(tonyho7476 @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 01:45 PM) You should have put on your Cubs Suck shirt Actually it was cold as hell outside waiting for the store to open up, but when we went in I did take my coat off and did proudly display my "Hey Cub Fans" shirt with the middle finger with the world series ring on the middle finger. 2 hours of hearing attendance crap, socio-economic garbage, and just plain poo that the usual warped cub fan spews.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 01:40 PM) "Reports are saying that the White Sox are in talks with the Angels for some young pitching.....Speaking of pitching, the cubs reportedly will land Jason Schmidt!!! The cubs quest for a ring is almost complete" Rock you kid and all, but I was in a line for Black Friday last week and some dolt in a cubs hat was giving me a 2 hour diatribe on how this is their year due to Soriano alone. I had to control myself not to choke him out.

QUOTE(knightni @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 01:32 PM) Here we go... And of course Moiph took all off 30 seconds to spin this into cub talk. LOL Odd maybe that writer should have Stoneman read soxtalk. Because he didnt see the big steal for the Angels like everyone does here. Stoneman might balk because they dont want to give up young pitching. Doesnt he realize that he needs to throw in at least 2 top end prospects for Freddy alone. I seriously hope this gets done. This would be the best option for young starting pitching coming back. I like him better than Danks or Pelfrey.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Nov 28, 2006 -> 01:21 PM) I understand that. And I realize they have Nick Adenhart ready to step in in a few years as well. But it seems to me that they have had an awful lot of position players who were highly touted prospects begin to fade. McPherson, Kotchman, and now Wood struck out 150 times last year and they think he isn't as far along as they thought he was. I don't know, it just seems like they should be dealing some of their position prospects if they really need a bat this badly, not Ervin Santana... How long does it take for a position player to learn how to hit in the majors? Their guys are good, and they have great prospects, but how old is Vlad and Garrett. What is their window. The angels rely on getting a lead, getting to their bullpen and getting the game over. Take a good look at their lineup, and tell me what they are missing. That would be real protection for Vlad. To beat the Angels, you basically pitch around Vlad. Garret provides some of that, but he is hurt a lot, and is older. They could go right with vlad, left with garret, and then right with Crede. Thats not a bad 3-4-5 punch right there. They can score more for their good pitching staff. They are offensive starved and need that more than anything.