southsideirish71

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:59 PM) Randa is hobbling at this point. KW will make a move that significantly improves the position. He's not going to go for a guy who's a slight upgrade and has injury concerns already. Randa won't help us win anymore games with his injury concerns and his inferior glove. Too early to pull a trigger. You'll see a trade in late June. Inferior Glove? I know you are the guy with the Crede's Crew sig and I dont expect anythng but love for Crede but come on. Slight Upgrade? LOL

QUOTE(JimH @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:50 PM) You commented that 3B have reached their potential by 27 or so, and Crede is regressing. Again, when did Randa blossom? Please let us know. I will comment if you don't want to look it up, but since you're looking the numbers up I presume you can see at what age Randa blossomed into a consistent offensive player, and don't forget to put that year he hit .254 in there. Hint, he hit his stride in 2000 and has been fairly consistent since then. MLB experience is what I am talking about. Joe has been up in the show for the last few years. There is a difference betewen Randa making the jump from the minors running instead of Crede who cant hit at all. There is a difference between Randa having a bad year, and Crede having a bad career.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:46 PM) Randa's a .270ish hitter while Joe is a .240-.250ish hitter. That's not a HUGE jump especially when team chemistry and defense are taken into account. I'm a big Joe Randa fan but Kenny is going to look for a big upgrade not just Joe Randa. Randa over the last few years. 2005 .291 BA 2004 .287 BA 2003 .291 BA 2002 .281 BA Yeah I see how that and Crede are almost the same. And again can you review the defensive stats before you blindly just say his defense is better than Randa's.

QUOTE(JimH @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:35 PM) Go look at Randa's career stats and see when he blossomed. Now you are reaching. Crede has been in the majors for more than a year. Only 2 times Randa batted under 280. In his first 2 years he batted .303 and .302. When Crede has any track record please let us know.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:32 PM) Sounds like adding Joe Randa wouldnt help us out much then huh? Frank is the best hitter to ever put on a White Sox uniform. His OBP is still stellar and he will get hits. If you think that adding him wont help our lineup then you are blinded by your rage. I agree, Konerko is an automatic double play, but as you said before, established offensive players will recover, and he was on a mini tear there for a while. We need to get used to the fact that we have some of the streakiest hitters on our team. How many people on this board were raving about Crede reaching his potential when he was on a tear when the season opened, now the same people are wanting to trade him. Dye was worthless until a few weeks ago, Uribe still cant hit s***. The question is, can they get it dont when it matters? Our record speaks for that right now, and I think KW will do something to improve it if it needs be. Are you serious? Do you feel that our offense is ok and you are ready to stick with it. Is that the same record that went under 500 over the last road trip. How many runs should of we scored yesterday with bases loaded 2 times with no one out. How many runs should of we scored with men on 2nd and 3rd with less thant two outs. We got lucky yesterday with some heroics in the bottom of the 9th. Mark should of had a lot more run support than he had. Washburn did everything in his power to give the game to us. We did everything in our power to mess it up. We need more than one spark in our offense than Pods-Gooch-and Rowand.. Our record is cute and all, but we havent been very good over the last few weeks the minute we start to play better teams. Our pitching has been great. My hats off to our staff and the greatness they have done, but come on we need to score more that a few runs to win even with our staff. People were raving about Crede because they thought he had finally turned it around. However we all found out that the hot start was the abberation and this comes back to how he hit last year. You remember his offense last year.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:27 PM) Don't take this as a jab at you -- but, did the realists also see how bad Jon Garland truly is, too, for the past four-five years? Garland is a young pitcher. They mature about 26-27. Crede is a 3rd baseman, he is at the point where he is supposed to be a finished product. He is regressing if that is possible.

QUOTE(JimH @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:27 PM) Sure, let's just start trading our starting position players when the team has gotten off to this awful start and are mired in third place. It works both ways. Have you read or heard any of the quotes from Guillen or KW about them showing faith in these players? What does that tell you? To me, it says they're going to have faith in these current players, and make any moves if needed closer to the deadline. I have also heard the one that says that KW will do whatever it takes to win. This is the guy who traded our starting young catcher and number 1 rated prospect last year early. KW will make a trade, if you think that this team will stay the same throughout the year then you are too much of a literalist.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:23 PM) It seems to be working nicely right now. If you can consistently score 4 runs a game and hold the opponent under that, you will win, simple as that. If this was a dire situation I could understand how furious you are at the offense, but fact is, we are still in first, have the best record in the MLB, and just got our best hitter back. Check out our record for the last few weeks and tell me how the offense is working out? We are barely in first. 4 games up in May is not something I would trump myself on. We got our best hitter back, a 37 year old guy coming back from a major injury. If you think he is just going to come back and the offense will switch you are too hopeful. Frank walks yesterday. Bases loaded no one out. Paully GIDP's. Now I understand that everyone had this misconception that Paully will not GIDP even though that before frank got back he GIDP in the same situation. One man doesnt make an offense when so many are struggling. They will pitch around Frank to get to Kong. Its going to happen.

QUOTE(JimH @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:17 PM) Again, holy smokes. I presume you saw the part where I said I'm frustrated with Crede's offense. It is not all "good" and not all "bad" when it comes to these players. Crede has done the job a few times this year with situational hitting and a couple of sac flies, things which do not show up in the stats. He needs to learn how to get down a bunt better though LOL. Of course we are trying to win this season. The Sox mgmt. team will give this current cast every chance to show what they can do and cannot do ... as I stated and KW stated just recently, they went through and made all these decisions in March and now 60 days later they feel it's more important to show faith in players who are mostly veterans vs. spinning around like a top and making trades. The other point about Randa is the bad foot, if we are talking about winning this year and this guy is hobbling on a bad plant foot ... that can be a problem. Neither of us know the severity of the foot problem but Randa is a gamer and it's kept him out or at least in limited duty. I think you will just have to get used to this ... as long as this mgmt. team is in place, they will show faith in their players, give them every opportunity to perform and contribute, and look at the big picture. The big picture almost always does not include trading one of your starting position players by May 31. Feel free to holler for a trade, it's every fan's right. But don't expect it. Guillen, KW, and the coaching staff are on the same page and that page is sticking with the decisions they made in March for a little more than 60 days. Sure lets just stick with the same lineup and offense that barely gets a few runs and hope and pray that the pitching keeps lights out. Nothing like putting that much pressure on the pitching staff, its not like pitching your ass out only to have your team score 2-3-4 runs a game in the AL will do anything to mess up chemistry. Lets stick our heads in the sand and stick with the same formula and maybe it works out.

QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:06 PM) You act like Crede has been good for the White Sox. He hasn't. We are seeing the same Cruddy that we have always seen. He can play defense but he can't hit a lick. Yes, he is still young and he may improve (although, I think it's unlikely after watching his ugly ass swing for a few seasons). But we are trying to win THIS SEASON. We can't afford to wait and see if Crede ever pans out. He is a hole in our lineup right now and he is contributing almost nothing but defense to this team. Do people forget that at the end of last year the sox were really getting frustrated with Crede and his stubborness to change. He has the same swing. For all the batting cage time, new resting the bat on the shoulder, voodoo tricks he still flys open early and cant hit the low and away pitch. Maybe h can hit, but obviously its not here. Boras is his agent. If Crede hits 20+ homers what do you think Boras in crazy land will think his value is. Arbitration will be fun.

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:57 PM) If you ain't getting Chavez, don't bother. Methinks that you should start working on Fields Fan Club because Crede's Crew is an endangered species.

QUOTE(qwerty @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:52 PM) I am sure we can find someone in that list to hit 220 and catch a few balls. Its not like we are replacing someone who has proven themselves.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:49 PM) it doesnt look good for re-signing Kong, without his salary there would be some nice wiggle room, and a huge hole in the batting order. Huge hole. I wish he would find a hole to hit the ball at. But again all you have to do is watch how the 3rd baseman gracefully fields the GIDP ball that Kong pullls over when the bases are loaded. Kong is too inconsistant to give the kind of money he will require.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:46 PM) And you clear payroll from where??? Randa is making 2 mill. So I dont know where we have to clear payroll from.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:43 PM) Lets say this goes through. What in the hell do we do next year in the hot corner?? Fields is NOT ready. I am sure that Randa has another year in him enough for Fields or someone else to come in.

QUOTE(Frankensteiner @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:42 PM) A subsequent question needs to be asked as well: Is Joe Randa even bad defensively? From what I can tell, he's a very nice fielder. For the record, I would welcome him with open arms. In a lineup dominated with pull hitters, a smart player like Randa would be terrific. He's 35 and on a one-year deal, so I doubt it would take very much to get him. You hit that one on the head. Not only is this guy have some good pop. He also doesnt pull the ball like a mad man. Another GRINDER in our lineup.

QUOTE(fathom @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:36 PM) The Reds have had all sorts of problems at 3rd base over last few years. Brandon Larson was supposed to be their 3rd baseman for the decade, but he was a massive bust. I'm willing to bet they would jump at the chance of hopefully making adjustments to Crede, and letting him be their 3rd baseman for the next 8 years. I'm guarantee that the main reason Crede hasn't been traded, and likely will not be, is that KW doesn't want to get rid of him. Well after him getting the batting cage, working all offeason to work on his swing, having "well documented" issues with being stubborn and resistant to change. And the fact that the whitesox used the number 1 pick for a 3rd baseman. I dont think that Joe Crede is on the magical 3 year board in KW office.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:32 PM) All speculation though. When it comes down to it, if you are the Reds GM, and your team is floundering, and your fan base is turning against your moves the past two years, do you make a trade straight up, and how does that help your club. You are taking Crede, who has Bora$$ as his agent, and has not performed well in the majors. Or you could hold on to Randa until the end of the year when a contender will give up alot for a good 3B and a bat going in the stretch run. It doesnt make sense to me. We are going to have to agree to disagree. Because I think, if KW makes a move, its going to be a big one that DRASTICALLY helps the club. KW makes moves early. KW also makes moves that help the team. I have a feeling that KW will get someone to help with this. Randa makes sense. He is a vet who has played in the AL Central. He is a good 2 strike hitter.

QUOTE(I-HATE-CREDE @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:30 PM) Still, you'd like to have proof that you witnessd it. The clutch hits last year all happened due to Crede hitting a breaking pitch with two strikes on him. This was due to the hitch in his swing, they would get two easy fastball strikes on him and then would get too much of the plate with a down and in curve. His hitch and his slow bat were perfect for these types of ptiches. This year they are going up the ladder on him or are going away with the slider.

QUOTE(JimH @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:26 PM) The Reds would jump all over a straight up Crede for Randa trade. The White Sox wouldn't. And no, I am not a big fan of Crede. I appreciate his defense but he's a mess offensively. The reds are trying to clear payroll. Crede as a B prospect gets it done.

QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:23 PM) Well, the question you guys have to ask is... Does the difference between Randa's bat and Crede's outweigh the difference between Randa's glove and Crede's? I think it does. I dont understand where people get the idea that Crede is automatically a much better defensive 3rd baseman than Randa or others. Yes he lays out for a ball from time to time. But I go by fielding percentage and RF. Randa is better in both. That plus the stick make this an open and closed case.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:15 PM) Aramis is a horrible defensive 3B, his fielding is bad on a slow infield and his throws are only saved by a gold glove first baseman. As for Mora and Blalock, I would take either one over Crede any day of the week of course. LOL, Anus Ramirez has a better fielding percentage than Cruddy and a better Range factor.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:13 PM) Im just saying, that as far as improving the team, there are other areas that we could readily improve if you want more hitting. Im just saying that our #8 and #9 hitters arent the problem if you are looking for more offense. Every team in the league has less offense at the bottom of the order. Adding Joe Randa doesnt rank at the top of my list. As for adding players, and ideas. If we get to the All-star break or later, and we think that this is the year that we are going to make a run for the whole damn thing, then we should trade the farm, and I mean give up anything for an all-star, but at this point, with the best record in the MLB, adding Joe Randa doesnt seem like much to me. 3rd basemen historically are not the number 8 or 9 hitter. However because its Crede and he cant hit he is put down there. This offense needs consistancy through the lineup. All of the hitters that are struggling at least have some history of hitting good. Crede however does not. His bat is slow and he is a rally killer. Drop him for a bucket of baseballs and call it a day. Get someone Polanco/Randa/etc anyone that can hit above 240.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 12:02 PM) Another insightful post from an exciting new member.... :headshake Crede's fielding is underappreciated, he makes tough plays look easy and makes alot of plays that other 3B dont even look at. Look no further than the other side of town to see how terrible a fielder a 3B can be. As far as chemistry, see our record this year, and our double play count as compared to other teams. We turn more of them, and one of the reasons is that the infielders work well with each other. How much difference would getting Joe Randa make? WE would give up alot for him,and be bascially replacing our #8 hitter. As far as where Joe fits into our lineup, being that he is an EXTREMELY reliable fielder, and a good #8 hitter with power, I dont think its neccessary to replace him. Unless you are talking about Chavez, Crede will be our 3B the rest of the year. His fielding is great. His .148 BA in May is bad. In fact that would be about right if he was a pitcher in the NL. He is an auto out right now. So with your comment about chemistry. We should not make any changes as it may affect chemistry? No improvements just keep with this team as it is. Do you see this team having enough batting to contend as is?

QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 11:33 AM) I'd rather have Crede. I appreciate his fielding, and his chemistry in the field with Juan. I think his hitting comes at good times, and he fits nicely into our lineup. Unless it is Eric Chavez, count me out. Cruddy fits in nicely with our lineup. When has he ever hit besides for a few weeks this year. His track record is terrible. If that wasnt the case we wouldnt of drafted Fields last year. Move him and pick up someone who has a stick. Randa has a decent glove also .976 fielding percentage which is better than Crede and has a better range factor.