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I think the main point of what Grifol told him is "be ready IF we need you out there. Continue to work on your game as always. Do not think of yourself as a useless guy only capable of one thing. Be prepared to be more even if we don't think that's where the best you is. The best you is staying in the lineup as a hitter. That's what will help the team most." Grifol is all about positive reinforcement and encouragement but if he doesn't see you trying to be the best you possible he will get on you for your lack of effort in the tough love way that every parent should have inside them. Probably much the same way he raised his girls. Kindness with expecting firmness of resolve.

JR could be back loading contracts to also dump as much money as he can on a new owner along with what you said about the current team payroll. He seems like a guy fixated on nickel and diming or a saving a million here a million there into the near future where there is less money committed. By the time Benny's contract is over 3/4 if not more of the current team won't be under contract.

There are areas that you do not want to get that stuff on !

Better get it by the 5 gallon drum !

You are right.Even with reasonable health you still have to get some career years from guys like Eloy and Robert to get favorable outcomes. Kopech, Giolito, Lynn, Clevinger are all guys who can be much better or total blahs. Anderson has to field better and still hit. Grandal could be feeling 100% better and screw up his back in the 1st week playing in bad weather. He better be rubbing the Tiger Balm or Icy Hot or over his damn body. Maybe the rest of the team should too, all over their hamstrings, obliques, shoulders, elbows, quads, calves, groins (be careful with the IcY Hot there). Go out there smelling like an old folks home.

That's why I wanted Colas up at the end of last year. A lot of people were against it and still want the Sox to gain the extra year. We know rookies struggle. It would have been nice to get any struggles out of the way at the end of the season. Now if he struggles it'll have to be when , after they hold him down to get the extra year ? People also got sick of me mentioning Outman, another rookie, but right about now he's looking better and better as 4th OF, but the Dodgers are themselves thin in the OF so it's highly unlikely they trade him. Duvall will cost probably closer to $10M than $5M ,maybe right in the middle at $7.5M, but right now, as fans ,we are in the unenviable position of not knowing if they spend any more or how much if they do. Spending another $15M could get them what they need or spend $7/8M and make a trade. Hahn doesn't seem to want to trade any of our top rookies so that doesn't leave much to trade with unless you find takers for Sheets, Burger, Yolbert Sanchez, or Cespedes.

When exactly are teams supposed to work in a hot rookie when he's perfect for the opening they have ? By the time Colas started playing, to the people who do the rankings, Colas was just another older Cuban prospect, just a 45FV . By the time the season ended he got ranked in the top 100 and went from A+ to AAA and never slowed down. You saw how Montgomery slowed down once he got to Birmingham 19 yrs old and he was tired . Colas was a beast but yes, as of now if you count 2nd base they are counting on rookies . Maybe they rely on Sosa or Romy which is not quite as exciting. But I suggested Andrus , you didn't want him, I agreed that Tony Kemp might be a good option, Escobar would be fine, Gleyber Torres great !. Who do you like at 2nd base ? Did you agree or disagree they might have to trade Hendriks ? Do they trade minor leaguers ? You can't just keep crapping on everything. The Sox had 4 position players with 2 or more War last year. 3 of them barely clinging to 2 War and the top guy walked with 3.9 War and the other 2 WAR guy also walked and you don't like him.

As of now though he's the backup OF in CF and in the mix for starting at 2nd base with Romy and Sosa. A career War of 1.9 playing 10 years isn't really good . You have super subs putting up 1 War per season or more depending on playing time. There's a chance a lot of guys play with minor injuries . The grind of baseball does that to you. If you play, produce, if not, go on the DL. Negative War isn't helping the team. At that point you're better off playing just about anyone else . Well maybe not Romy was a negative War guy too. This is the reason why I want Andrus or really anyone else in the black hole of 2nd base or some guy who can play CF as the 4th OF. I've been talking about more OF since the Off season began. Outman would look pretty good right about now. But I'm pretty sure the Dodgers will hang onto him. Contenders do not go into a season witha bunch of negative War from the previos season. Vaughn's negative War you can let slide because he's no OF. Last Year the Sox had only 4 position players at 2 fWar and above and 2 of them are gone; Andrus 2, Anderson 2, Robert 2.1 and Abreu 3.9. They need a whole lot of health and raised performances to even come close to winning the division and real live breathing depth is huge.

I used to stick up for Leury because he was my adopt a prospect but Leury Garcia is a poor excuse to have playing most positions. He should be a getting his minor leagues and NRI contracts after last year. ANdrus got DFA by a non contender w 1.8 war because they no longer wanted to pay him more money when his bonus kicked in after 550 AB. He shouldn't be getting any games. The Sox should have a versatile 4th OF and a decently versatile INF who can provide way more than Leury does. I'm totally mystified by anyone being OK with him on a team that's supposed to care about winning.

definitely more offensive upside but he's basically a LF now and not good at any other positions defensively.

well sure is you think 3.5 fWar is equally sucking to a -1.1 fWar. I don't care how far you go back or go into the future Leury could never do that. He'll be out of baseball when he's 34.

This all makes sense and I agree wholeheartedly with most of it. However depth pieces usually cost more than a $1M contract at least on good teams who are serious about contending. 4th OF is definitely the biggest priority but also if you don't want Leury , Romy , Hamilton or Reyes at 2b or in the OF, then depth will cost you. You can trade for Kemp I suppose , but then again you're going to have people equating him with Leury without the versatility of being bad at all positions. I didn't suggest the Kemp idea but I agreed with it because there are aspects of his game that are more of a sure thing . But that poster didn't start a thread for it to be scrutinized by the Leury's Lovers or Andrus Doubters ,however you wish to categorize them. Just like with Duvall the highest bidder will get them. I am doubtful Andrus is around to receive a generous Sox offer of $1M and I am also doubtful that Sox DFA Leury . My case for Andrus is more about depth then it is power , defense , stolen bases or a savvy veteran who does the little things and plays smart baseball. No matter how you slice it he had a very good year and he will probably get paid for it. How much he gets is unknown but I would imagine somewhere around what Harrison got last year from and Harrison wasn't coming off a 3.5 fWar season with 17 HR's. However unlikely he is to repeat that performance , it is the most recent sample we have. Leury's most recent sample was -1.1 fWar. People whined about the McCann signing too but he stuck around for a 2nd year in which he did well too. They are always going to whine about guys who appear to be who we thought they are. Most of the time they are right except for the recent string of good luck with McCann, Rodon , Cueto and Andrus. McCann turned back into a pumpkin once he left the Sox. Rodon turned into one of the best pitchers in baseball for 2 years. It remains to be seen how Cueto and Andrus do for another year. Just like with Rodon they would rather thank them for their service for the year and send them on their way with the righteousness of the odds being stacked against them due to injury concerns or the ravages of time and the most recent performance overshadowed by previous performances.

LOl so now you are afraid to speak because I used your arguments against you. 2022 Leury Garcia negative 1.1 fWar as a substitute. Elvis Andrus as a starter 3.5 fWar and + 4.6 more than Leury in 2022 ! 4.6 dude ! But hey keep carrying for Garcia ,one of the worst players and lowest Baseball IQ's in baseball in 2022, to get another 400+ AB's on the 2023 Sox. It's a stupid argument to try to eliminate Andrus good starts with the Sox. He played a whole season and streaks are a part of that. He had a great season and did extremely well in all facets of the game for the Sox. LOL imagine someone carrying water for Leury Garcia and people saying "attaboy SS2K5 show him how much Garcia is equal to the guy who had 4.6 more fWar than Garcia did last year."

There is some advantage beyond playing him a full season. Sosa could be on fire in AAA and if Andrus regresses to the mean. Sosa would then likely be called up to start. I don't expect Romy to put up numbers like Sosa will in AAA . Then Andrus backs up Tim which is surely a better option than Leury at SS. Or Tim again gets injured and Andrus at SS and Sosa at 2nd base. Surely any scenario not involving Leury is much better. Popeye hasn't even started AAA yet but did well in the 2nd half of the season at AA. But he needs even more seasoning than Sosa. Please keep in mind that we are trying to field the best team possible in 2023 within some constraints of management. . It's not a given the Sox will even entertain the notion of signing both Duvall and Andrus let alone Duvall who is needed even more. Much like the Sox finally got around to taking Eloy, Vaughn and Sheets out of the OF , they need to get around to not putting Leury, Payton , Hamilton , Reyes or Popeye in pivotal roles in 2023.

But he already said he would play 2nd base so that would go for any team that signed him. I'm sure he'd prefer SS but the friendly confines of The GRate seemed to suit him well.

Ok 43 games is a small sample size so lets eliminate 1.7 fWar from Andrus 2022, it would also eliminate his fWar his 2020 29 game -.3 . Let's also eliminate Leury's 2020 16 game .5 fWar in 2020. SO we eliminate both Leurys and Andrus 2020 due to being less than 43 game sample sizes for both. 2022 Andrus with the A's 1.8 fWar. Leury -1.1 fWar that's plus 2.9 fWar for Elvis 2021 Andrus 1.6 fWar , Leury 1.8 +.2 for Leury. 2019 ANdrus 1.9 fWar, Leury 1.7 . +.2 Andrus. 2018 Andrus 1.2fWar , Leury .7 +.5 Andrus 2017 ANdrus 4.4 fWar, Leury 1.0 +3.4 Andrus. Winner the last 5 years of non small sample size Elvis Andrus by 6.9 fWar You might not think this was fair but I was just going by your definition of small sample sizes which eliminated 2020 for both and so I had to add 2017 to replace 2020 in order to see if your claim that his last 5 years were on par with Garcia. But you also said "even with the hot streak" his last 5 years are on par with Garcia so let's eliminate 2017 and include all of 2022. 2022 is a fWar advantage now of 4.6 for Andrus over Garcia and 2020 .8 advantage for Garcia . So either way you slice it, With small samples included Andrus has 7.7 fWar more than Gracia and eliminating the small samples of 2020 and Andrus 43 game sample in 2022 it's 6.9 more fWar for Andrus. Take your pick 7.7 more fWar "even with the small sample size" as you said or 6.9 more fWar without small sample sizes. I'd hardly call that on par. @Squirmin' for YerminIf he's Leury minus the defensive flexibility. I could say Andrus is a better hitter and better defensive infielder, better base runner despite his lack of speed compared to Leury. I mean, come on Leury might be out of baseball when he's 34 which is when Andrus had a 4.6 f War advantage over Leury's age 31 season. Leury could be DFA'd or traded and Duvall and Andrus both signed, or Kemp or, Romy and Sosa. I don't care, but I thought we were all sick of the dependence on Leury Garcia to play a crucial role . But if you are really trying to say Leury Garcia is more valuable to the 2023 Sox than Andrus would be that's (to use your words) stupid. We still need a better replacement CF than Leury and a better IFer also.

It's a dead period here at Soxtalk as we try to figure out if the Sox have any more money , trade or stand pat from here on . We know Adam Duvall is an ideal candidate for 4th OF mainly because of his defense and power. We also know that for the Sox to do well this season that they need more power than last year. The problem with that is the Sox need career HR years from guys like Robert, Eloy and Vaughn who are now their main HR threats. 2 of those 3 have problems staying on the field. It's incumbent on the Sox to increase power without sacrificing defense at the other positions and from the bench guys. Colas could provide a good amount of power but as much as he is already a personal favorite of mine I cannot deny that he'll have to be very good almost from the beginning to provide as much power as perhaps Vaughn will. It would be very helpful but it's still expecting a lot . Plus if he hit's 15 he's replacing Sheets power production. Moncada and Grandal could also provide some power but they are a mystery to most of us when it comes to what they'll provide offensively . Benintendi hit 5 last year and is capable of perhaps 15 but will he ? The same can be said of Anderson. 2nd base is also a mystery both offensively and defensively plus there is not much available can can power both defense and offense. Sosa is still very young and has great promise.Romy Gonzalez is 26 and wasn't even a great Minor League player. Expecting good results from him is one of the longest shots the team might take if he's the opening day 2nd baseman. Now I know all the arguments against Elvis Andrus. Expecting him to repeat what he did last year in his 43 game sample last year is also expecting a little bit too much when he'll turn 35 August 26th. He's been going downhill too long. We've heard Grandal says the Sox lost a lot when they lost Anderson but did they ? Let's take a look at what Andrus did in those 43 games with the Sox and also the A's. The Sox tried Leury and Sosa before Andrus came to them. According to fWar Andrus had a very good 3.5 . I can't determine how much of that came with the Sox and how much with the A's but it seems pretty even. He did have just about twice as many PA with TX than with the Sox. For a guy who is not that fast any more he stole 18 bases least season and was 11 for 11 with the Sox. He also played very good defense with a 4 OAA. Those things should tell you he is a smart base runner and good defensively. He also has said he would be willing to play 2nd base. He seemed to find a fountain of youth with the Sox. Slash line .271, .309, .464, .773 . 116 OPS+ 17 HR, 9 with the Sox despite half the PA's he had with TX. He actually was the Sox best 2 way player down the stretch when it seems many of the Sox players gave up. This is why we hear Andrus name come up to play 2nd base but to also provide depth at SS and even 3rd base. Remember we no longer have Abreu HR's . Sheets shouldn't play OF but we are losing his 15 HR's and just replacing them with hopefully a few more from Colas. Also losing Andrus 9 HR's. Having Andrus would also give Sosa some time to work on things at AAA in his age 23 season. Probably will also lose Jake Burger's 8 HR's since there's no room for his fielding at 3rd base nor his bat at DH. The Sox have been luckier than usual in picking up players for cheap. Rodon, McCann, Cueto and Andrus. It's always refreshing to see a new player come into our park and play well. Maybe there is something about his game that just fits our park. He certainly seemed at home with his lift and pull approach even though his GB% went up slightly and his FB% went down compared to his time in Oakland in 2022. The Sox need more power, good defense and opportunistic base running either starting at 2nd and on the bench. Is he really a worse option then Romy or Sosa at this point ? I know he costs more then them but for a very savvy veteran maybe out best chance to get 2 fWar from a guy at 2nd base is from the guy who had 3.5 fWar last year and flourished here.

I miss Alex and Ursula Snelius, our Lithuanian, $64M IL Lottery winners, HR sponsors. May they rest in Peace.

Yes Eminor nailed it. I've been super critical of the Reinsdorf regime . I temper that with optimism each spring because "hope springs eternal" and all that good stuff to prevent myself from being angry or sad about the Sox. I never felt like I was broken but rather just accepted that this is what being a Sox fan under Reindorf is. It wasn't any better under any previous owners in my life . While I am privately optimistic my posts are hyper critical because we've seen so many examples of how JR operates and we conveniently forget most of it when things are looking up. Now is an example of a temporary up time. Clevinger, Benintendi, new coaches all saying the right things. Hoping for best seasons from a lot of guys and Grifol the miracle worker all in the name of continuing to dangle the carrot but hoping our hunger will make us forget how bad they truly are again. Hell I'm still holding out hope that they do something about 4th OFer and figure out a way to find more power while not sacrificing defense. These little slap hitting types and waiting for Robert, Eloy and Vaughn's best seasons and pumping the hype on the new coaches is a huge fucking carrot if I ever saw one.

One year in the minors is really fast for some people especially without much AAA time. He got stronger and stronger as he progressed and did all that while not playing much the last couple of years. The reason I wanted him called up last year was to get a head start on this year. It was apparent that his 1st season was a spectacular success in every way advancing from A+ to AAA all in his 1st season in the states. I wanted him to have a trial run and was getting pretty sick of the OF defense. I thought it best for him to get a feel for RF at home and give him an introduction to MLB pitching. I thought it was pretty apparent with the need for LH power and better defense in the OF that he was a perfect fit for RF and the sooner he can get acclimated to MLB the better. Now if he is held down for the extra year his growing pains will be from May through July or longer instead of perhaps August and September of last year . It also would have got Robert out of the lineup and allowed him to heel.Giving him time last year would have given him a jump on this year and given the Sox some idea on his readiness. The new coaches could've studied tapes on him in MLB and developed an off season plan for him. But Colas is currently working with assistant hitting coach Mike Tosar with Romy Gonzalez in Miami so that's a good sign. Tosar was in Atlanta when the 3 aforementioned ( in previous posts) Brave's rookies did their thing. Any way here's an article about the triumvirate of Sox hitting coaches. https://soxmachine.com/2022/12/jose-castro/

I think you are hearing Duvall so much because he can play all 3 OF positions pretty well and Robert always seems to miss a lot of time. He would also be the biggest HR threat off the bench which would make him a top priority who, with extended playing, time could reach 20+ HR's. Profar has a nice bat but defensively at least last year he was primarily a LF . Didn't play CF or 2B at all while starting 147games. If the Sox didn't get Benintendi , Profar might've been in their sights. If the Sox didnt already have Leury, Profar would be fine. But he doesn't really fill the CF or 2b problems. He was pretty bad last year. He hasnt played SS or 3rd base since 2018. Since 2019 he's only played 27 games at 2nd base. We think of him as being versatile but his defense doesn't track in very many positions now. It's just not good enough. You want a Switch hitting LF /1B man that's what he's becoming.

It's worth celebrating because there's playoff revenue and our favorite team is now in contention to win a Championship however unlikely you view that. If you go back the last 11 World Series the AL Central has been in 4 of them while the East has been in 3. SO always a joke doesn't apply. Doesn't matter how many time the Yankees ousted the Twins because the Yankees didn't get to the World Series either. You can't tell the players it's not worth celebrating when they're all dancing around the clubhouse drinking champagne. They work hard for a goal like that. Plus if they do win the central a lot of things went right and maybe they are btter than we expected and the other teams got some bad luck. False hope is one thing but expecting disaster once in the playoffs depends entirely on what went right with us or wrong with the other teams during the season.

I think your underselling him He brings more than $5-6M to the table. Harrison essentially got $5.5 M ($4M +1.5M buyout) and Josh wasn't capable of 20-30 HR's like Duvall . Still can play all 3 OF positions and has maintained his speed well. Gets good jumps and has an above average arm and good accuracy. He pulls most of his HR's and doubles but I saw at 4 to RF in 2022 on his highlights. Didn't see any to straight away CF which I like since it avoids the biggest part of parks. Perfect for a power hitting PH since there's no one else to provide that. Also can PR.

Kemp is not a bad idea. 1.5 fWar last year, 11 out of 12 in SB so LH speed guy gets down the line pretty quickly and should benefit from the shift and pickoff rules. Many here like the idea of Duvall . He's not far removed from that 2021 season in which he hit 38 HR's and 113 RBI . Definitely high K guy and low OBP but as far as defense and power he's ideal unless they want the 4th OF to also be LH. He's 34 now and some have suggested he'd go to a place to get a starting job or more playing time. But I think he'd get plenty of PT here. He has to know what he is at this point of his career and a part time job that he could potentially get 400 PA's should suit him. I think it'll come down to who offers him the most money. Not sure that'll be the White Sox . He's there for the taking right now. Maybe he's hoping to get $10M a year and willing to wait but something under that should get it done quickly unless the Sox are again pretending to be financially strapped. He'd have a crucial role here.

That's 2 people that apparently @Tnetennba didn't see.