CaliSoxFanViaSWside

I think you're wrong. Just because you think he's been jerked around and you think he resentful because you are doesn't mean he could get or deserves $200M at this point in his career. It's just one , not even full season of very good pitching .1/2 season of normal SP and 1/2 of limited innings starts. How many 25 years olds with 2 yrs of eligibility left with 1 year of non injury starting pitching have got a $200M contract ? In 2 more years, sure, the sky is the limit. Prove to me he's resentful about his previous treatment. Show me one interview where he expressed this. Theres plenty of video around that he's happy with his treatment and plan in 2024. So happy that he didn't want to deviate from it and risk going to another team unless he got assurances , by way of a new contract, that he would be compensated for risking his future earnings power. He doesn't hold all the cards however. He's had arm problems and still has 2 more years to pitch to show consistency in both his ability and health. A lot can go wrong or go right. Thats not even close to $200M at the present moment. No GM would give that to him right now. Check back in 2 years or when he gets an extension from the team he's traded to without pitching a single inning for them.

I did say only when there is no general consensus on which player to trade for or draft among players considered equally talented from the talent evaluators there can be ways to break the tie where certain opinions are given more value than others. It can be the top guy like Bannister, it can be a successful scout who has ID'd good pitchers before or an analytics guy with a good track record of doing the same thing. We're basically splitting hairs since picking young talent and developing it is more difficult in baseball than any other sport. I know heres a lot of emphasis on some coach or coaches along the way who unlock a key that makes a difference but ultimately it may come down to mental or physical maturation from the player along with various tweaks through the trial and error part of coaching . Who can say for example what made Crochet good in 2024 and why he didnt get injured again ? There's no general consensus on it. Among the Getz haters bristling and embarrassed about the loss record we hear Getz and by extension Bannister, who Getz hired,had little or nothing to do with it. It was all Crochet. Bannister has talked at length many times what their plan was to make Crochet a healthy and productive starting pitcher . Besides adding and developing grips & pitches there is a sports management team that made a plan to keep him healthy. Between all these people including Crochet's mental and physical maturation and rehab from injuries it all added up to success this season. You could argue he's a smarter ,bigger stronger version of himself which is what development is all about. Even if you think the previous regime held him back, abused him and Crochet is resentful and bitter about it as some fans are, it all led to where he is now. No one can simplify it down to one thing. Many many things happened on his path . Even if we think Crochet and his agent were wrong to demand an extension because it hurt our baseball sensibilities about being gung ho for winning a championship and team 1st BS you have to look out for yourself in this world . Once you are at your best and in a situation to better contribute to your teams success is the time to be the rah rah guy. We always hear about putting players in a position to succeed .Crochet didn't want to take any chances on being put into a position to fail. He took charge of his own destiny. However Crochet has also been very happy with the whole plan so much which was what led him to do what he did at the trade tradeline. Turns out everyone was so happy and did such a good job it bit them in the ass for a little while. Fans got pissed, they wanted shiny new toys for the Sox and Crochet spoiled the party. Many thought he tanked his value or teams wouldn't want him because he made a "me 1st" power play. Many were wrong. I just don't think it's anything to get hung up on. Go listen to Bannister talk. He's a very bright guy and in touch with modern pitching and player development. Anyone who wants to feel better about Bannister and Katz and educate themselves there are quite a few interviews with him before and after he was hired here .

Yes this crazy talk about Getz trying to get something for 2024 instead of some imagined good return for 2028 is ridiculous. He did need players for 2024. Getz got crucified for the having the worst team in history then the same guy says he tried too hard for wins in 2024. All he was doing was turning over the roster, dumping salary and starting over. Maybe u get lucky and end up flipping Soroka and Lopez .Didn't work out that way but Schuster and Soroka served a purpose. They ate innings letting prospects develop in the minors. Every single person on this board knew 2024 and beyond was going to be a dumpster fire long before the season opened. Lol So every player in a 5 for 1 swap should be great when the 1 player was Aaron Bummer ? Why is this still a discussion ? Who cares. He was a shitty relief pitcher and they they got some usable 2024 players, a former 1st rounder and a decent prospect back . I'm sure the Braves or someone else had a 6'3 215 lb. DSL MVP who was able to leap tall buildings in a single bound they were willing to trade for Aaron fucking Bummer.

Does a mechanic choose the cars he works on ? Of course he can , if given a choice, prefer one over the other if he feels he does his best working on certain engines. Just look at Bannister or any coach that way. If he has a higher success rate with a certain type and you're choosng among 2 guys, who , with most things being equal and no general consensus on who to choose , you go with the guy Bannister thinks is more moldable or pliable and adaptive to his coaching style. Trying to quantify the effect of coaching is pretty difficult. A coach who works with hundreds of prospects over a length of time you will have many more failures if success is messaged by quality MLB players. Let's say you have a 1% success rate and there's some industry norm where 2 or 3 % is considered great development. Choosing the right players who are highly adaptive and respond well to and realize the path to getting better is through patience and trial and error can make all the difference .If Bannister is the head honcho of pitching in the organization he should have a say. If scouts were so good at picking pitchers they'd be pitching coaches. Your scouts should at least consider the organization pitching philosophy which Bannister is the boss of. They should know what he likes . His input is obviously the most important part of pitching development right now.

I'm torn. JR will be 89 in a few months. Yes the Sox need offensive help .Trying to figure out the next competitive window and saying a 25 year old doesn't fit into it is really weird .He'd need an extension of course but a rebuilding team starting at ground zero needs to have a strength to operate from. Right now starting pitching and with some failed starters converting to relief like Peyton Pallette or others pitching in general can be a very good strength. I don't know if JR passing away will make things better .However I'm tired of thinking Crochet will get hurt. Treat him like the asset he currently is. I want to see great things for Garrett Nolan Crochet with the Sox. There are no fast answers to even getting to .500 now but you have to start accumulating young talent and keeping it. Maybe Crochet is dead set on becoming a FA and if that's the case then sure trade him but I'd be spreading rumors and making a serious, if only in words, push to resign him and talking about the way back to respectability is through our biggest strength right now. Let teams think he'll be unavailable. When you're desperate you don't get as much. I want to see "White Sox Making a Serious Bid To Extend Crochet" rumors flying. None of this "we tried but we failed" BS that deflates the fans. Resign the dude fast and build some momentum for the 20th Anniversary of 2005. Give the fans some hope. I don't care if he's traded after he gets extended. Sox need to create some positive buzz in the fanbase and that always starts with getting or retaining good players. Pitching will keep you in games. See what Jose Iglesias wants to have a starting role. Roberts needs to not feel isolated .A veteran Cuban player who has always been a great fielder and has found ways to improve his hitting will perhaps help Robert regain his form and have a strong 1st half. At this point I'd prefer to trafe Robert over Crochet. It opens up more money and he's had just too many serious injuries. Let's face it some part of the roster is going to have to suffer and it's going to be hitting because this is going to take some time . But having one strength gives you more talent and thus more tradable assets while keeping you in more games where even a few good players popping balls over the fence with a few guys who can take walks on base will get you some wins and let the young pitchers develop in the majors while hitting develops in the minors. With Crochet there's less need to rush Schultz and Hagen Smith. Withe a great 1st half and an extension Crochet can actually increase his value.

If the Sox thought they had a real good shot at getting Painter they might not have drafted Hagen Smith. Draft was like 2 weeks before the TDL last day.

Dick Allen was King of Chicago in 1972. That iconic Sports Illustrated cover juggling baseballs with a cigarette dangling from his lips. https://metalposters.com/featured/chicago-white-sox-dick-allen-june-12-1972-sports-illustrated-cover.html?product=metal-print

Phillies didn't want to give up Painter and Dodgers didn't want to give up Rushing.

I swear I know your posts when I read them without seeing who wrote it 1st. 😋

Haha. Bring it up again plenty will defend it. The process was right yada yada.

I was coached well in creative writing classes.Plus my daddy taught me how to recognize BS. Caulfield is a nice man who takes way more abuse than he should. I don't like people whose sense of humor revolves around making fun of others. It's wolfpack bullying garbage. The one time I got suspended on here was sticking up for a guy I thought was being picked on . Which was ironic being suspended because I felt compelled to agressively defend someone who was being aggressively maligned which is allowed but being an aggressive good Samaritan was not allowed.

Did you even read what I said ? I said Vaughn made a series of mental errors on that play play. A series of miscalculations on what to do on that particular play. He thought he was doing enough to get the out while keeping his attention on another base runner. That's the exact reason Judge missed that fly ball. Routine play gone awry because you try to split your focus and it backfired. Lots of times it doesn't backfire. People aren't perfect. They make mental errors and seeing lack of effort is just a bitter man's way of crying about how much money these SOBs make the least they can do is hustle bullshit. Of course there are plenty of times there is legit lack of hustle. Anyone's who's ever played any baseball slows down running to 1st base when it appears the out will be recorded . Sometimes the 1st baseman drops the ball on a routine catch.Sometimes you're tired and playing your 12th game in 2 weeks and your hammy might be feeling tight. Maybe you had a leg cramp sitting in the dugout. Maybe you fouled a ball off your foot or ankle a day or 2 ago and it's sore. Maybe youre legs are sore because you steal a lot of bases. Maybe you're on a long road trip drank lousy coffee, ate bad food . Pinning something on laziness is ,well, just lazy thinking and lack of empathy.

Did you put your ass on the line and make a prediction because you saw all this ahead of time ? Youre all over the place. They were sloppy ,bad base running and mental errors the whole year. No effort to play the game cleanly. Safely say the better coached team won. Of course when you win you can safely point out why. When you win you do all kinds of things better than the other team. Did Ohtani become the best hitter / runner in baseball because he was better coached ? Were Betts and Freeman not some of the best players in the world before the Dodgers acquired them ? How you play in a short series is largely dependent on some players getting hot while others are cold. Pitchers could make more pitches. Hitters could go into a funk. Maybe even luck comes into play like you say it did with Thorpe with your expert analysis of his season and future. You could make grandiose generalized statements about anything that a winning team did better than the other team and sound like you hit the nail on the head. How are you so sure from your cheap seat in the crows nest that all the coaching from all the coaches was better than all the coaching that the other team did ? Oh if only some great coach had told Judge to keep his eye on the ball for the thousand time he might have caught that ball. Even very talented players have flaws in their games that show up at inopportune times. I can safely say that the team that makes the least physical and mental errors at the right moments in space and time usually win. Which Major League team are you working for again ? You're scouting and analytics skills most surely have been recognized by now.

My goodness. Some crazy takes in here about what a new manager says and judging how much effort someone gives. You called it loligagging but not everyone sees through your eyes. I see it as a series of mental errorss. He clearly misjudged how much time he had. He took his eye off the runner going to 1st base and kept his eye on another runner. He also could've tagged the runner going to 1st. For the less talented or rookies we often hear about how things move much faster at higher levels which require you to speed up your thought proceseses, increase your preparedness, train harder, eat better, sleep better. It's not enough, you just can't do the right thing often often mentally or physically to get to that level. You could make a massively long lowlites reel of bad play for every team in baseball. Did Judge want to screw up a routine fly ball in the biggest baseball stage in one of the most important days of his life ? That whole inning was a s%*# show. There are mental and physical errors, concentration lapses, plays that you make while doing things wrong, and errors you make while doing things right. They play through pain that slows them down , they may have a sick family member. Yet fans get on here and think they see lack of effort through body language. When you lack talent you look bad against the more talented .It weighs on you, it brings you down . Sometimes the less talented win because they are all better than 99 % of all players wordwide so even the Sox can beat teams far more talented on ocassion especially in a sport where pitching can dominate and make you look bad.

A new manager like Venable basically takes the job because it coincided with his family and career taking steps forward while he espouses positive vibes about the future. I hope it's not the end of positive steps forward for his life. He could hold this job for quite a while as part of the Getz plan to claw back to respectability.

Apparently it'll also take an act of JR charity to sign more than 1 guy to a Fedde like contract. We can't even spend our way out of the garbage dumpster let alone anything resembling a big money contract. It's pretty much going to be the same as last year only without those guys we kept thinking would be leading the parade.Bye Moncada, Eloy, Kopech. Is there anyone left of the old core ? Robert maybe Vaughn. Both venturing into Eloy and Moncada levels of ineptitude. Can't wait to hear Venable explain why he took the job. I'm sure we will hear positive platitudes that he likes certain things that we'll all snicker about. We'd like to think with all the restructuring going on that its steps in the right direction. But JR is still the Ringmaster of this circus. ( I took a break from calling him the puppeteer.)😂

Best case scenario is TB. They never won a WS but they compete while always trading their stars. They are able to do this the only way possible which is an ultra strong infrastructure based on scouting and development prowess domestically and internationally, solid coaching, sticking to the types of players they've identified that fit their system. They can't put finishing touches because they don't spend but they make the most of what they do spend on.

Damn who wrote this , his press agent ?

Happy 42nd Birthday Will !! Good luck. Guessing u got a nice raise and making at least $1.5M for at least 3 years.

I don't see why Thorpe is the object of such derision not only from you but others . He had 5 straight starts as a 23yr old rookie of at least 6 innings while giving up 3 hits or less and 2 runs or less. I think that was something that no rookie had ever done before in the history of the franchise. I guess it depends on your perspective how impressive that is. I mean I see a guy who despite his youth and relative inexperience pitching against the best hitters in the world and doing better than any rookie in the history of a 125+ year old franchise in those 5 consecutive starts as a very good thing. After all the bulk of his experience the year before was in A+ ball. But maybe that's just me who truly believes that prospect talk nonsense about development not being linear so he could also have periods that weren't so good especially when those not so good results ended with a forearm flexor strain and bone spur elbow surgery. But maybe you don't like the prevailing opinions that because he lacks "stuff" that his command has to be perfect for him to succeed . I guess it's a fundamental difference on how you view prospects and development and being a pitcher vs a guy with a 95+ MPH fastball and pinpoint command needed to keep hitters honest and off your outstanding changeup. Maybe you might also feel it was more of the league figuring him out rather than injury or the variance in performance inexperienced pitchers tend to have. I suppose it's reasonable to have doubts about such things just as it is for me to see hopeful things.

Seems like a very comprehensive list of knowledge required including , knowing Spanish and moving for some $15 /hr and housing stipend job. How the hell does one go to college and understand everything listed and still be young enough to be able to work a temp job while upheaving your entire life plus part of the job application process is giving them free advice to show you know your stuff ? It doesn't even mention job benefits like healthcare. Is this really how you get quality people in R & D /Not Analytics ?

More ex Sox. Following the WS game, USC vs. Rutgers football game comes on and Jason Benetti announcing.

Ex- Sox cost Yanks Game 1. Cousins can't get enough guys out. Boone elects to bring in Cortez who hadn't pitched in a month rather than brining in ex Sox Tim Hill. Got 1 out on the catch in the stands that advanced theruners to 2nd and 3rd because he made the throw from the stands ( out of play). Intentional walk to Betts to load the bases and BAM ! Freemn crushes 1st pitch no douter. Took me back to 88, Gibson walkoff watching the game while visiting Chicago at a friend's house. Also in game 1 and a walk off Dodger winner.

I know I saw that. But apparently seeing him and not seeing anyone else gives him a leg up.

You pretty much thought for sure it was going to be Schumaker.