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What's wrong with Beavers? He's 22 LH CF with a good eye, nice arm. If he doesnt stick in CF he can play RF. He might be a year away so maybe you can get a final look at Colas in 2024 if the Sox ever think he can make some strides. Or they can trade Colas. 55 overall scouting grade same as Kjerstad and 2 years younger. Cowser is a 60 and 23. Turning up your nose at a guy like Beavers tells me your expectations from Baltimore are misplaced. Hold Cease for what exactly ? Till the All Star break ? Too risky. Who exactly do you think the Sox are going to get that would beat a strong Orioles package of LH's and a pitcher . Ortiz, Beavers and Hall would be a pretty strong package. That's 2 up the middle guys and their best pitching prospect besides Rodriguez .

Yep Baltimore will be trading Santander, Mullins and Hays son so their young OF prospects can step right in. Santander needs to go asap. Does Holiday jump right in to replace him or does Kjerstad or Cowser. I don't see many here suggesting LH OF Dylan Beavers as a potential trade candidate. He's considered a 5 tool guy. Id be happy to take him if Kjerstad and Cowser are next in line for the O's outfield. I'd consider Beavers a pretty good headliner. And who wouldn't love a prospect named Beavers ?

I loved your analysis. Very well thought out. Extremely basebally and gutsy. I'll always give you a lot of credit for putting yourself out there. Evaluating prospects is difficult. Rankings sometimes means very little like with Busch. He's still rated as of one the top 2 Dodger prospects at 26 yrs old and without a glove only because of his bat. The Dodgers have absolutely no use for a player like that. Look at the guys they turned from nothings into somethings. Outman, Justin Turner, Max Muncy. The one thing they all have in common is that they all can play the field and fairly well . If you can play the field ,hit HR's and walk the Dodgers like your potential. They don't care about K rate if the other 3 are solid. And that's worked for them. I also think think being LH is very important to them. It's easier to fix those guys. LH's are ideal strong side platoon guys when you get to face opposite handed pitchers a lot more than RH hitters, Muncy and Outman can all play multiple position. Outman all 3 OF positions and Muncy 3 infield positions. I think it's very important that the Sox come away with a strong fielding LH position player , maybe even 2 of them. That Dodger package doesn't have that. I like Pages but he's RH and coming off a tore labrum. Pitchers are even harder to evaluate. Sheehan hasn't had many minor league innings. I think he's ready to pitch 125 innings this year based on his total of 122 last year but I wouldn't push him to go above that Inning total from last year given it was his 1st time pitching that many innings. Ideally you want to see an innings increase but maybe its best with SP to get the arm used to a certain amount of innings rather than continually pushing it higher . 2 straight years of 125 and then an increase. I don't know if any teams currently handle SP prospects that way so it's my own personal recommendation. Teams havent exactly figured out how to prevent TJS so maybe they are pushing them too hard too fast. I'd rather get a pitcher, with all other things being semi equal, a guy who has a few years in a row with a better minor league track record involving IP and durability. I'd have to do a deeper dive on the multiple mid 20's Dodgers guys to see who fits that bill. Gavin Stone looks ready to pitch more innings. He's smallish as a pitcher and he didn't impress in his call up last year. His fastball can go 98 but doesnt miss bats with it as much as he could. SO evaluating pitchers is really hard. So much can change from year to year. Add a pitch, better control, better command that changes everything. With all that in mind as I said I'll take the innings and durability among a bunch of mid 20's guys. Baltimore has a lot of LH prospects. I'd definitely prefer them as a trading partner.

I think Getz is going to want 1 or 2 of Frasso, Stone, Sheehan, Ryan, Hurt or Knack. Those guys are all 25 and Knack is 26. I don't think there's any way a Cease trade is completed without a starting pitcher. Pages shows a lot of promise. In his 2nd go round in AA he did very well but it was just 33 games. But he torn his labrum in his 1st AAA game on May16 and missed the rest of the season after surgery. Shoulder injuries impair his power stroke for a bit. He's RH and plays RF ( Cuban ,avg defender , strong arm, nice walk rate.) He could use some AAA time. Previously he was added to the Dodgers 40 to protect him in the Rule 5. I don't think there's a need to ask for Rushing. You might not have a true headliner because of Busch's lack of position or 1B only profile but there are worse things than a LH slugging 1st baseman. I suppose you could work with him at 3rd base and see if he can improve there. I still think Eloy has to be gone for him to play . You could alternate Vaughn and Busch between DH and 1st base. I think he'd be an instant starter for better or worse.

I still think it's an exercise in futility trying to project outcomes for oft injured and low OBP guys like Eloy,Moncada , Robert and Vaughn along with guys like Colas and Sosa. I know projections are probability based but until these guys can stay healthy and can tell the difference between a ball and a strike a little better it will always prevent them from showing marked improvements from year to year and reaching sustainable and expected level of higher performance. With the dumpster dives guys like DeJong , Lopez and Stassi what they contribute is almost strictly based on defense and helping the pitchers . Their offense completely negates their defense or positive War production. I don't think going from 29th to 28th in position player f or bWar means anything as far as wins and losses are concerned when you are still talking about somewhere around 100 losses. I could see going through with your projections if this team actually had a chance to improve by even 10 more wins but I'm afraid they don't. The pitching may end up the worst in baseball. DeJong , Lopez and Stassi can't prevent balls from flying over the fence or smashed all over the park. I don't need to convince myself that what Getz has accomplished so far is meaningful in terms of wins and losses in 2024. It isn't.

But for the good teams who take making the playoffs as a given it's the 2 post seasons that really matters. If Cease can bounce back from his 2023 season he looks a lot more attractive for 2024 and 2025 playoffs. I think right now a little panic about his value is just a part of the natural cycle when it's still mid December. You knew teams that you would suspect of wanting Cease still had other options on the SP market. You just have to wait that out and still hold the belief that he is very valuable. A lot of teams in the hunt still have moves to make. They are testing Getz's resolve as a rookie GM trying to make him think that maybe his asking price is too high. This is likely to go on for another month minimum.

Maybe then he holds Cease until the All Star break in the hopes he pitches much better than last year counting on his durability and others pitches lack thereof. Risky for sure given how the Sox players really haven't been able to sustain a consistent track record of success. A lot depends on how Bannister might be planning to get Cease to throw more strikes which despite his success has always been his biggest problem.

Yea would weird if it fell apart or ended up being a lot different.

Yup that $2M per year for Ohtani was a game changer if we were expecting the Dodgers to make a play for Cease because of financials.

Rays doing what the Rays do. They got 2 mid 20s guy who are solid if not spectacular players. Pepiot 26 has good command . Solid opener, long or short relief. FA 2029. De Luca 25, OF who can play all 3 OF positions and a very solid defender with some offensive upside. FA 2030. Pepiot likely to be good contributor going forward and DeLuca possible 4th OF candidate. DeLuca probably could've been the leading RF guy for the Sox as a 3rd or 4th piece in a Cease trade unless you prefer those bottom pieces to be younger. But an older guy with defensive quality with offensive upside and 6 years of control should've been right up Getz alley if he was looking for a potential starter in RF.

I don't think Pepiot is a starting pitcher though unless the Rays see that for him. That's usually why I usually didnt mention him about potential players in a Cease trade. He was more of an opener and 26 years old but has done well with the Doders. Doesn't really have the innings built up yet to be a full time SP. So he is talented.

This is the way.

People go to see their team win. The more you win the more people who show up. Eloy and Vaughn have been nearly useless to winning. You can go ahead and give me the I talked bad about Eloy , laugh emoji now Tray.

You would have to define " does the Sox no good " . There's a lot of good things that can happen before the 2026 trade deadline. How he performs in 2024 and 2025 could have good outcomes. By then you'll have a much better idea how far away you are depending on our minor leaguers performances over the next 2+ year. Moncada and Eloy likely gone. Benintendi closer to being gone. A bit more financial flexibility perhaps. Maybe even a new owner. If he established himself with 2 years of high performance now he's worth something in a trade. Maybe Robert is traded before Lux is and now the Sox have Montgomery,Colas, Sosa, Quero , Ramos and some pitchers and some better development luck and even more talent in the minors from the Cease and Robert trade. You start the Tampa Bay imitation game by trading away guys about to get too expensive to keep the influx of talent coming and now trade for some lower and mid level prospects. This way you are spreading out the prospects acquisitions over a 3 year period. Cease in 2023/ 24, Lux or Robert 24/25 and again Lux or Robert in 25/26. Such a thing to say about 3 years in the future confounds me. You must start with a vision.

While I agree with everything you said and it's a start in the right direction it's a long way from fixing drafting and developing and maintaining a steady influx of young talent that is so vital to successful teams. I am not going to forget that he's played an important role in developing talent in the minors that hasn't been all that fruitful lately. Perhaps he'll have more power as GM to do things his way .

He was injured all of last year so his value may not be as high as it might be once he shakes off the rust especially when you are surrounded by a lot of good hitters. I'm sure it helped Outman . But the Dodgers right now are tauting him as their starting SS to increase value , but he is likely a future 2nd baseman but Betts will be there. I think the Dodgers trade him before the other teams are reminded that his future isn't at SS.

I think I already answered this question in another post you didn't see yet . I'm just saying be open to acquiring still youngish higher floor guys like Lux , not necessarily Lux. You say he'd be the headliner, others say 3rd piece . These teams do have other options to trade their unwanted talent. Lux might not be the Dodgers starting SS in 2024 but he will be starting for someone, perhaps the Brewers. But he would be a good guy to instantly start at 2nd base for the Sox and he have 2 years to establish high trade value . Would be great if he could do it right away. In the first 90 games of the season in 2022 he was hitting .300 with over .800 OPS. Either way you'd be spreading out the prospect acquisitions over a longer period of time getting a chance to see which prospect of ours and other teams develop. This is a continuing philosophy that has nothing to do with winning a lot of games in the next 2-3 years despite the BS spewing from Reinsdorf's mouth or Getz calling it a retool.

I never said getting prospects isn't a good thing. It's a very good way to keep the talent flowing to the parent club. The Sox couldn't continue doing that thanks to being too good while they were rebuilding and not getting higher picks. The Astros at least tanked properly. Now you have the draft deck stacked against you because of anti tanking draft rules. So it actually may behoove the Sox to find other ways to acquire minor league talent such as flip candidates . Kelenic would've been a guy like that to take a chance on. The Braves ,as good as they are , still saw a need for him. We are not realistically 2 years from competing. There are no unnecessary steps when it comes to acquiring talent. How fast the Sox are looking to compete should be irrelevant now. They need quality and quantity because the talent on the 40 and in Charlotte is dog s%*#. Getz has been acquiring quantity to fill out the starting rotationan MI and C depth. But soon he'll have to start getting creative to acquire the quality . After Cease is gone it's pray Soroka or Feddes can establish value and Soroka has only a year to do it and Fedde 2. We shouldn't be adverse to acquring higher floor players with only 3 or 4 years of control when Robert getting injured for a lengthy period again may ruined your road to respectability by 2026 timeline. After Cease the trade candidates plummets unless you're counting on Eloy, Moncada, Vaughn, Kopech or Benintendi to really beef up their value by the trade deadline.

A bunch of prospects that turn into gold to bring the Sox back to .500 by 2026. They'll have no starting pitching and holes at just about every position.

Sometimes 3 years of a 26 yr old former Minor League Player of the year will work out better than a bunch of 23 -25 yr old prospects who may not have established themselves yet as AAA All Stars. Point being how do you establish who is better than Lux? I had people here tell me last year Outman wasn't ranked therefore guys like Busch and Vargas were better. 1 year later one had 4.4 fWar and the other 2 spent a lot of time in the minors again. 6 years of control of a guy who doesn't pan out means nothing whereas 3 years of another guy who has been through the struggles already to prove he can hit MLB pitching can end up being a better deal. These things are not easy to decide. I'm sure the Dodgers would love to dump Busch on the Sox. He has no path to playing with them. They aren't a team that keeps guys who can't field. They rather give up Busch or maybe Vargas ahead of Lux because Lux may start for them just like Outman was going to start for them last year.

Yes but some of us have learned to not take it all too seriously. Win lose whatever I don't have all the answers and neither does anyone gnashing their teeth. So I'm just saving my teeth and my sanity. It's really nothing to get worked up over. But it is fun to observe it. The whole Justin Fields saga is good podcast TV.

Lots of "ifs" as always. I'm good with seeing how the winter turns out and see how Getz is playing this. I'm not expecting it to turn out the way many of you expect or wish for . It's usually doesn't. I'll still be a Sox fan and hope for the best along with the rest of you.

I'm not sweating it out. I could give a s%*# about rumors. When it happens it happens. The Sox have a long way to go to become revelent again. When he is traded even if you are happy or displeased about the return why does it matter? We'd have to wait another couples years waiting for prospects to develop in a system not known for developing lately. It's a lot gnashing of teeth over stuff we can't control with an owner in charge who doesn't care about you or winning in any other way but his, which has proven to be a winning formula only for mediocrity.

So you don't think that if Lux comes back strong he wouldn't be worth trading for, then flipping and getting back even more than he's possibly worth now ? There are times to take chances on players . You cannot keep pretending that prospects acquired are going to work out. Most of them don't. Some assurance because of previous MLB abilities isn't a bad idea. This attachment to prospects only is silly. Contenders pay for quality not dreams when they need a bat or a pitcher when they have a chance to win. There are others way to get better than waiting for a bunch of prospects to all get good at the same time.

The Dodgers are smarter than MLB. I think they'd take MLB to court and win if you base it on the fact anything MLB does regarding that issue in the future could be seen as being aimed directly at the Dodgers especially if they try to make it retroactive.