CaliSoxFanViaSWside

I'm never overconfident. I state facts and figures. I try to present an unbiased referenced and informed opinion . I do have strong opinions that have been laughed at but in the end I'm usually right. I'm wrong about a lot of things .You can't talk baseball and especially about prospects and be right all that often. There is too much judging in the here and now . This is baseball not football or basketball . It's a sport that requires patience and analysis then more patience as players try to navigate their way through the constant stream of information usable for them and against them. I have been picking out LH players I thought the Sox should acquire for years now. Usually outfielders Outman, Nootbaar, Varsho some of the AZ kids. I've bashed the front office for many years. I wanted them to treat 2020 as a World Series type year and be aggressive at the deadline because just knowing the front office , I knew the possibility always existed for a fast downward spiral. Not many agreed with me and thought being over aggressive may ruin the decade long competitve window Hahn said he was trying to establish.

It's for whatever you feel about Burger. If you have perspective you realize there's room for growth which is the same thing you can say about Eder. Marlins wanted Burger for immediate offensive help . They know his current limitations and hope to unlock more positives down the line. 2 things to like about the Sox were Burger and Robert. That was it. One was taken away. If people want to be a little down about it they can. If they want to bash Burger they can. I don't see any point in raining on anyone parade that they will miss the player and person he was for the Sox. They need more guys like him who actually give a damn and strive to improve.

Well you should buy it. This happened last minute . If you listened to Ng talk on the Marlins telecast you heard her say there were about a dozen people all doing their specific jobs . They don't sit in their separate offices when things are down to the nitty gritty. They probably were in some war room where everyone could be consulted easily which includes initial input from scouts and analysts on all names that might have been bought up in any earlier talks. They have to check medicals and do due diligence like the Sox did or didn't do on Clevinger . JR more than likely has final say when certain amounts of money are involved. Maybe in a Burger for Eder trade he's ok with not being involved in that. Every trade has the same process but all are not done the same way . It's very hectic around the deadline. Maybe Hahn's phone is busy and KWs wasnt.Maybe on deadline day there's a line that is manned by multiple people that can't get a busy signal where someone yells out. I got Kim Ng here ! These things usually start much earlier and take time to work things out and work through the BS . Maybe this one didn't take long as far as the starting point and finishing point was concerned. Just because Hahn is the GM doesn't mean he has to be the starting point or ending point on every trade. I'm sure everyone involved got very little sleep the last couple of days. I know everyone wants the power struture all defined in a tight little package but it's a group effort. They all are to blame and no one more do than JR.

Pretty narrow minded thinking. Marlins as a team are tops or near it in batting average. What they lack is power to get those big inngs.Burger has combined more extra base hits than singles. They also realize that also he is 27 that he has missed 3 crucial development years and that he has room to improve. Why even bother talking about his weight and OBP when the thing they wanted was his power and work ethic and years to see if he could me more than that since she also said he had 80 grade makeup. I think both sides got what they. We'll just have to wait a bit to see if both Burger and Eder have more in them.

Vaughn has had a lot of time to get his act together at the ML level. Colas who knows. But I do wonder after spending so much time in the off season with the Sox hitting coaches if they tried to make him something he isn't. We all know he badly needs to be more selective but the weak contact is perplexing and lack of any power is also disturbing. Maybe it can be chalked up to inexperience but it hasn't been a smooth transition that's for sure. I still see him going live on instagram just a few days ago. Hate to think he's more like Mercedes than someone who actually cares about baseball enough to take it seriously.

Since Hahn declares the Sox were trading from an excess of RH power Seby is the only RH HR and run the Sox have scored.

How long was the kid the Sox got for Burger (Eder) out ?

Plus it might have been Liam's idea to go out there and pitch. Maybe it wasn't a good idea whoever 's idea it was with a body weakened by cancer. One side or the other just should've said no. Good luck Liam.Enjoy your post surgery life not on the Sox.

Burger 2/4 with a walk as Marlins try to come back n the Phillies again in the 10th as they did in they 9th.

As as usual you have no defense for your idiocy and bluster.

You mean look hard at the entire year of his 1st attempt at playing a full season in the big leagues ? He must be been really good to have crashed so hard and still have 115 wRC+ and 1.4 fWAR . Was he up at 175wRC+ or 2.5 fWAR at some point ? Wow tell me more .

Mainly because they need health from TA , Eloy and Moncada to jack up the returns. They also need a stronger season from Cease to extract the most value for him . They also need Vaughn to show a pulse. If Baltimore fizzles in this years playoffs because of pitching maybe they come back to Cease. Also Sox will get better looks at their own minor leaguers and another year to assess the other teams minor league players. They also might pick up guys in the off season that they think might be good flip candidates. You can't do everything in one trade deadline.

I think he'll opt out or the SOx will.Never underestimate how alleged wife beating and child endangerment accusations will effect his FA .

I brought up that possibilty yesterday or the day before since they will need starting pitching desperately and Clevinger may not exactly want to test Free agency . But then again he's probably an egotistical bastard who has an inflated sense of his own self worth.

Yesterday I did say Hahn doesn't want to utter the R word just to fool Jerry. But unless JR has lost a lot of his mental capacity I'm sure he knows it's another rebuild. Maybe he just doesn't care anymore . Maybe the Sox made money during the rebuild so he's not against having another one. It'll be his son's problem eventually.

They did act pretty rationally at the trade deadline. The New Rebuild. This time we'll get it right !

I almost came in year to say the Sox would be shut out tonight but I thought why bother ?

No they won't pick it up. Why would they ? Cease will probably be gone. Grandal and Clevinger gone after this year. Cease and TA and Eloy will all be traded. Vaughn may be the only one left with the hopes he can have a big season and then he'll be traded too.

This is a rebuild plain and simple. I know it's being disguised under the pretext of competing next year but what on God's green earth makes any one think next year won't be as big a disaster as this year ? Clevinger and Grandal will surely be gone after this year and Moncada will be gone after 2024 and if it is a rebuild why would they just turn around and give most of that money to Eloy for 2025 ? Cease and TA might be gone by then too. I know you haven't addressed any of these things but anyone who thinks any of these guys are going to be around in 2025 is sorely mistaken.

He also had a July OPS of .865 and led the team in walks, HRs, SLG, RBI, runs scored and games played. If he was such a bad hitter and such a bad fielder how the heck has he managed to accumulate 1.4 fWAR and and have 115 wRC+ ? I understand there are a few fans who hate the trade because it was Burger traded. I think it was a good trade. I'm just wondering if Vaughn or Eloy could've gotten him instead. At minimum the Sox have Eloy for 1 more year or maybe it's worse if they have him for 2 or 3 more years @ $42M and he never can stay in the field. Will have to revisit this more than once in the next few years not only to see how Burger,Eloy and Vaughn have faired but also Eder.

Actually my hypothethical was if it was you and and you had your choice of trading Eloy or Burger for Eder ., who would you choose ? You really think if Eloy has a another major injury again in 2024 and misses lets say 50 games or more, that they pay him $16.5M despite not being able to stay on the field for 4 straight years (2021-2024) ? I know it requires a lot of ifs including who is actually in charge of that decision after the 2024 season.

Maybe you could have replaced him with Jake Burger. Besides what is there to replace for the last 3 years ? He's basically averaging 1 fWAR per year since 2021. He might make it to 1.0 this year if he doesn't hurt himself again. If Burger manages to get another.3 fWAR for the rest of the year he'll tie Eloy's career best. If he hits another 5 HR he'll tie Eloy's career high set way back in 2019

You totally avoided my hypothetical but that's ok ! I realize that this could be a career year for Burger but I don't think so. I also know he could end up being as injury prone as Eloy but 5 years even at being 27 is still better than the real possibility of Eloy being gone after next year or if he manages to stay healthy for a year and actually has a full season for the 1st time since his rookie year that they pick up the option and he gets hurt again.

It was a good trade and a good time to trade him. Given that, people might be glossing over the small sample size OBP just as much as the people who are glossing over that he's had 500 AB's at the major league level and missed 3 very important years of development time. Let's not treat 88 games is the end all be all of his entire future baseball existence. It'll be very interesting to see who has the better next 3 years of their career Burger, Eloy or Vaughn while taking into account that Burger was by far the cheapest option of the 3 moving forward.

I don't want to put you on the spot but obviously a lot of Sox fans didn't want to see Burger go. And someone mentioned ( totally unsubstantiated) that the Marlins wanted Eloy and they offered Burger. Now there's your usual contingent of voices on each side of the issue claiming baseball smarts superiority over the other group . The issue at hand if the trade was Eloy or Burger for Eder who do you give up. I'm getting a lot of Eloy is a better hitter responses that never address the real issue. The real issue in my mind is and has always been Eloy's ability to stay on the field. If he misses major time again in 2024 it could be his last year with the Sox. Considering that since 2021 he has missed a lot of time every season it's not outlandish to think it could happen again. If it does there's a very good chance the Sox don't pick up his 2025 $16.5M option. Personally I think it would've been better to bank on the possibility that Jake is very self motivated to improve and that 500 sporadic MLB ABs after 3 years off with injuries is not enough evidence to pigeon-hole him as a low BA low OBP guy. I think I would've rather had 5 more years of Jake at cheap prices than I would have of a possible only 1 more year of Eloy. How do you feel about it ? He's going to be real expensive for an oft injured DH type if they pick up those 2 option years.