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QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 07:30 PM) I would agree that the stuff Ayers group did isn't nearly the same as modern terrorism, but it's still inexcuseable and awful and he still hasn't apologized for it. Alright so here's my last point. And this isn't intended as a "but your guy does it, too", but more of an explanation in why I don't think it matters. G. Gordon Liddy is friends with McCain. He took part in one of the darkest moments in White House history with ruthless abandon. To my knowledge from when I last heard him mention it, he hasn't apologized. Now he's an active participant in the political process as a radio host and commentator since he's calmed down from his craziness of the early-mid 90s. John McCain is friends with G. Gordon Liddy. Should I assume that John McCain then supports political corruption (aside from the Keating 5)? Does his friendship with Liddy raise questions to his judgment? Now, again, I don't think so, but I don't think so with Ayers too. John McCain was in Vietnam when this all happened, and probably gained his friendship with him after he became a million-selling author and political pundit. It certainly draws parallels between the two.

I think there are a lot of people contributing a lot to America that don't regret their rebellious in the face of some of the ridiculous activities of our government in the late 60s and early to mid seventies. They were bad american terrorists, they killed themselves, they didn't kill anyone else, they were self-righteous punks by all accounts. But years later he's a respected professor whose done wonderful things to help impoverished kids in an awful school system.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 05:50 PM) McCain should have just completely ignored the ad, and let people decide what they think of the ad and what is the truth. And if you are right about the clips in the video, than that is just stupid work by the people who made it. I was assuming the Obama people were upset over what was in the video, where they'd have no point in court to argue it, so my bad. No I was going to post what AHB posted, besides fox who "accidentally" broadcasted it, there is legal questions on that commercial, one is the use of footage and another I believe is something about its donors. I think it's going to the FEC. Stupid ad though. I don't think we can compare 60s terrorism of radical youth groups during the Vietnam war to todays radical Islamic terror. I mean, Obama ran against Bobby Rush in 2000, does that mean he's against the radical groups like the black panthers? Not really, it just doesn't matter. Ayers is now a key person in effective ways of reaching inner city schools. He's helping America. He's said those comments were distorted. That committee was to again, help kids in inner city schools. How terrorist, how rogue, how stupid.

Someone mentioned my biggest thing. Him being so scared of contact during DPs that has resulted in some mistakes is just wimpy to me. THis is the white sox not the... I don't even know

My friend is a hardcore hillary supporter, and I think from his point of view, he needed the closure, and he needed the reassertion of why he supported her in the first place and why he should vote for Obama. So in that regards, to us, two obama supporters and a conservative, the speech might have not been as pro-obama as we'd expect (not me I thought it was fine), but to the people it was aimed at pushing towards Obama, I think it was very effective.

QUOTE (lostfan @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 05:36 PM) Obama treats the Muslim claim like it's acid because it's thrown at him with the intention of being acid. You can throw it back as acid if you embrace it like I've only seen him do once. Assert that you are a Christian, but recognize that it shouldn't matter what his relgion is. We have freedom of religion in this country and recognize the hardworking Muslim population instead of the way he's done it, especially moving people from behind him with headdresses, give me a break.

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 05:31 PM) :notworthy Was i reading too much into the "radical Islamic government" comment? Or is there a subtext there? I think so, considering who actually runs Iran they are a radical Islamic government. I don't think we should be over there talking to Ayatollah, but from what we hear about the relative liberal culture of Iran's people, I don't think talking to their democratically elected leader with no preconditions is a bad thing or stupid thing. Iran is there, it's a threat to or allies, I understand the reasoning behind not recognizing them as legitimate, but I don't think it has worked. Nor do I think talking to them opens us up to weaknesses.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 05:28 PM) Not an exact parallel, but I've found it quite interesting how little coverage there has been of the Republican Congressman the Dems had speaking on Monday who endorsed Obama. I was really frustrated by coverage of that speech. People basically lambasted it as being boring and the pundits were like "why is this on" (like their talking is oh, so interesting) when Leach had a very academic speech about the qualities and contributions of both parties. It hit the theme of unity and transcendent politics that Obama would want, but because the guy talks like kermit the frog he was made fun of as boring. What a joke.

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 05:14 PM) I'm not the stupid one for a change. SWEET! hehehe 2 MAJOR problems with the ad other than the obvious out of context stuff: 1) As was pointed out to John McCain, Ahmadinejad is NOT the leader of Iran. In fact, he hold very little power. 2) It says "radical Islamic government". Does that mean McCain wants to declare war on Muslims? Why would you bring that up? I am probably over analyzing on #2, but it brings up an interesting topic of discussion. In America, Muslim = bad, even if they are good people. Muslim = you are going to blow me up. So, to play to that fear is disgusting. I think #2 is important to me. In America, our Muslim population has been very hardworking and has gotten themselves relatively ahead. In Europe, they are among the poorest population, and isolated with terrible schooling and completely marginalized. The result is they've opened themselves up, as radicalization takes place so they can feel power in something. We cannot marginalize productive, patriotic Muslims in this country. Obama has to stop treating the Muslim claim like it's acid. Conversely, McCain's repeated talk about how mid-east countries are averse to our "Judeo-Christian" values is seen as setting up a religious war to uneducated peoples. Was this country founded on Judeo-Christian principles, yes. Is that the reason we are facing threats from radical muslim extremists? A small part. But if you push that to the front it is a dangerous precedent. This country has come too far to villify our own Americans, and immediately after 9/11 I think we did a good job of embracing our Muslim population. Do not perceive this as me advocating teaching the Q'uran in public schools or backing down at stuff like that, more that we should be careful about our language. Muslim has become such a dirty word, if people begin attributing the radicals of terrorist groups to hard working Americans we are creating problems at home we don't need and can easily be prevented.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 05:20 PM) Nope. Because it's not over yet. CNN had a body language expert to show that Hillary wasn't really supporting Obama, lol.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 01:08 AM) This does a couple of things - it gets the media to say SEE, I TOLD YOU THEY'RE UNITED, and two, it keeps the b****ing off the table. Let's see what happens, but I think the news here is that there is news about this - meaning, they're trying to put on the best front possible and get the media to sing cumbayah for the Dems. can you admit you were wrong on your media prediction?

I was going to say I don't hear the Arcade Fire in them, I suppose maybe in another band that uses a lot of instruments? I guess but, yeah, replacements pogues, clash-sure, (i hear a little GBV too)

the republicans are THRILLED with Chuck Hagel yeah

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Aug 27, 2008 -> 03:37 AM) Ya know, i got to thinking. My analogy might be a little "touchy" given what happened to joe Bidden, but let me try and put this in a little bit of a human perspective... Delegates are like a husband or wife. you give your time, money, and commitment to get one single person elected to be president of the united states. you are picked as a delegate because you are loyal. Then one day... the love of your life dies tragically in a car accident. It's sad. It's really really hard. You loved her. But, you have to move on. But how? In time, you might meet a new person and get married. but it's never the same as your first love. that is an awful analogy.

What a season for Gavin. So glad to blow them out tonight!

QUOTE (mr_genius @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 11:19 PM) You guys just totally overreacted to some joke Paris Hilton ad. But hey, I'm done giving the Dems advice. Go with the 'McCain = Hitler' thing for all I care. The last candidate who failed with a shallow attack strategy? Goracle 2000. He just looked like a jackass. The one ad, Messiah ad, Blaming Obama for the Oil prices ad, the william ayers ad... yeah, we went crazy over one (racially toned) ad.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 06:07 PM) TCQINAA...HIAG been trying too long...help.

QUOTE (lostfan @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 04:57 PM) I agree. She was a really effective campaign asset until then., and then the Jeremiah Wright thing broke out not too long after that so she started laying low. especially in Iowa and such I remember reading one of the democratic candidates was in a library to have a town hall the same time as Michelle Obama, and everyone went to see her.

QUOTE (DABearSoX @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 03:08 PM) The worst call I have seen him make was sending BA on Paulie's 9th inning single a few days ago...but look how that turned out honestly, it was a 3-2 pitch with 2 outs, how in the world wasn't BA rounding third way before then

this is not a response to you directly but that would've been funny if he guilt tripped america into electing Obama because of his cancer.

QUOTE (jackie hayes @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 03:50 PM) I don't want to stop the cheerleading, and I know I may catch flak for this, but I was very disappointed with that speech. His speech was standard convention boilerplate. I wanted something that only Kennedy could deliver. You have an icon of the party speaking at (in his words) his last convention, everyone waiting to hear from him. And he said nothing memorable. This is not to question that the moment was emotional. But because of that, his speech had a unique potential to affect a fractured party and the campaign itself. It feels like a missed opportunity. I could see it that way, but, he didn't even know if he was going to be able to speak, and to speak with fire and urgency while having a brain tumor killing him at the time was pretty special. And his urging that he'd be there fighting when Obama became president.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 03:41 PM) It's been proven at least three times in the last 30 years that economic prosperity in this country happens more when the top income earners pay less in taxes, and it's no accident. Now, here comes the cynical bunch of you "libs" that say it can't possibly work (LAUGHER CURVE LOLERZ!!), but the results show otherwise - investments that these "ricj people" make come back around to actually help the lower wage earners by new jobs, etc. It's pretty hard to argue with actual results and not some theory of why it can't work. jesus man it was a joke that's why the smiley face was at the end of it. Anyways, I don't think any of us has ever said or ever will say it can't possibly work, more that for the last 8 years the tax cuts haven't brought in greater revenue so they've been unaccounted for. So unless McCain is going to detail anything he's going to cut or decide whether he believes in supply side or balancing the budget, I don't see how we're supposed to take him credibly.. Because his laughable, "well, we're going to win the war, so that's 30 billion right there" stuff isn't real.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Aug 26, 2008 -> 01:53 PM) Americans would rather pay less in taxes doesn't mean they don't want other Americans to pay more though

THANK YOU BELTRE

QUOTE (LosMediasBlancas @ Aug 22, 2008 -> 07:48 PM) You get into a fight, by far he lands the majority of the clean shots. Bloodies your lip and puts a bunch of lumps on your face. You land one helluva shot and break his jaw. Who won the fight? The nigerian man who sweeps in to take the girls.