SleepyWhiteSox

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:24 AM) That's the smartest, most insightful thing that you've said all week. You're not even making sense anymore. It's been downhill since your American dreams and bombs speech... :headshake

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ May 31, 2005 -> 01:12 AM) God damn it, man. Can you read? I said that you build around defense, you start with defense. How can you even argue against something that is so obvious? Sometimes, I feel like I'm speaking a foreign language on here. You can build your team around Elton Brand while I grab a Top 10 paint defender (Chandler, Ratliff) and a Top 15 perimiter defender (Hassell, Bell) for less money than that one fantasy superstar who can only get it done for you consistently on the offensive side of the court. Then we'll both build from there and see where it gets us. You don't think that my team will take yours in a playoff series? I can't talk to you, man. :headshake

QUOTE(qwerty @ May 30, 2005 -> 11:50 PM) He is the same caseel of coaches. His players have never down a thing wrong or commited a foul. He has basically said the same thing van gundy did about the refs ( but nightly) and no one mentions anything because he is the almighty larry brown. caseel? Anyways, I'm shocked he took this long to go to a new team... Edit: Oh, i get it. I think same caseel = sam cassell.

Who in their right mind would ever state that teams are built around one-dimensional role players?

QUOTE(black jack @ May 30, 2005 -> 11:35 PM) I'd say serious patience not balls. it takes forever to get home after the game with the over crowded subway cars. I walk over to the Green Line if I am heading north after a game. I doubt you lose more than 10 minutes on your trip, but I will only recommend that for day games. I can't vouch for the safety of that area even though I went to school right there at De. But since I live on the South Side, I usually take the bus down to the 35th/Archer Orange line stop. Either way, I almost always take the train instead of driving. As a college student, I have to take advantage of the student bus pass...

Do it. Ichiro and Peavy are studs, and Jeter is solid.

QUOTE(dasox24 @ May 28, 2005 -> 11:02 AM) Brian Bogusevic I remember him at De, if that's the same kid... Damn, he's that good now?

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ May 30, 2005 -> 08:24 PM) Actually, it wasn't a pushoff. And don't think i'm biased. I orginally thought that MJ had pushed Russell to get free. But after carefully watching the replay from all angles about 45747474374844 times, it's easy to see it wasn't a push off. It was a light tap on the butt. Exactly. And I will go with The Shot.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 30, 2005 -> 02:21 AM) Well, let's see how bogut does. It's far too early to tell. To be honest, I think it's quite possible he'll be a bit of a bust. But then again, I only saw him play a couple of times. We'll see...

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 30, 2005 -> 12:22 AM) Bogut >>> Curry. darko >>> bogut

QUOTE(Punch and Judy Garland @ May 30, 2005 -> 12:20 AM) With Big Frank coming off the DL I need to drop a guy. The candidates to drop are Ugie Urbina (my 4th closer), Luis Castillo, Felipe Lopez (riding him nicely now), and Craig Biggio. Not real thrilled with dropping any of those guys. To get a roster spot I am thinking of packaging Castillo and Urbina (losing his job soon) for Richie Sexson. I currently have just Nick Johnson at first. My offense has been nice lately but I am looking forward to using the Big Man at Utility next week and wondered if you think this is a fair trade. He needs a closer and has Lugo as his second-bagger. Thanks as always. Good luck with that trade. I'd let frank sit in the dl spot, assuming you're on yahoo, until the rust comes off and you're able to make a trade.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 30, 2005 -> 12:14 AM) So anyways how bout that Andrew Bogut. tyson's defense is a million times better. tyson >>>>>>>>>>>>> bogut

QUOTE(ZoomSlowik @ May 29, 2005 -> 11:33 PM) Please don't mention Ratliff and Mutumbo in the same sentance again. There is a MAJOR difference. Mutumbo absolutely shut down the other team's inside game and dominated the glass, and he was definitely a bigger impact on the offensive end too. Ratliff has been pretty good, but he's not on the same level. The difference between Wallace and Ratliff being on so many different teams is Ratliff was starting and in his prime when he was moved, Wallace wasn't. If he was such a defensive stud and a centerpiece of a team, Philly would have kept him and won something with him and Iverson. I won't argue that he wouldn't be valuable piece on a good team when he was in his prime, but there is no way you start your team with him. You need some other really good players around him to do something. With Brand, you have more flexibility inside and you could afford to use someone like Chandler for defensive purposes. As for Chandler, I've watched enough Bulls' games to know that he is not that kind of player in any stretch of the imagination as of yet. He isn't the kind of guy that can absolutely shut down the paint like Wallace or Mutumbo or Hakeem in his prime. I've watched a good number of middling post players put up close to 20 against us, and it isn't all Eddy's fault. He has "shown flashes" of excellent defense and rebounding, but that's quite different than doing it in the long run. I've seen flashes of talent from a lot of players that never amounted to anything, so I'd like to see more from him before I even consider taking him over one of the top 10 (I'd argue top 5) PF's in the league. I wouldn't complain about his offensive abilities if he were on the same level as those previous players I mentioned, but he isn't. Given the choice between a pretty good defender with no offense and a decent defender that puts up 20 a game, I'd go with the latter. You really need to be proficient on both sides of the floor. You can say all you want about how good the defense is on pretty much every team that won the championship, but pretty much every title team I can think of other than the current day Pistons could score too. The Bulls could put up 110 on any given night, and the Badboys, any of the Celtics teams, and the Lakers' dynasties were quite proficient on the offensive end too. That was the difference between the Bulls and the teams the ran over like the Knicks and the Heat: they could beat you at both ends of the floor. Realistically I'd hypothetically replace Curry with Brand before Tyson becuase Eddy is so one-demensional, but I'd still take Brand over any of our post players because he can help on both sides of the floor. Also, I won't argue that Childress doesn't have the potential to score 18 points per game, I just don't see him doing it next season. 12-14, maybe 15 but not much more than that, for the season seems to make more sense for the current state of his career, and the same for Smith. I was talking about his scoring in the context of a discussion about how having a PG like Paul would fit into their offense as opposed to a guy like Deron. Obviously there are other important facets to a player's game. As for claiming that the final four teams left in the playoffs is irrelevant, I don't really see how. These have been the best four teams all season, with none of them really doing any better than the other. You can argue that Ducan being hurt and Wallace's suspension were a factor in their win totals (which they were), but you could also argue that Shaq being out was a major factor. There are plenty of other teams that were decent-good on defense that got knocked out before these teams. This isn't exactly new to the playoffs either, at least one of the last few teams is less than stellar on defense every year. Yes, I know the Mavs get knocked out every year, but they have to go through the west, and they take weak defense to an extreme.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ May 29, 2005 -> 03:59 PM) Ozzie to Timo after the game: Nice K Timo. By the way, stand over by Shingo. KW needs to have a word with the both of you. Stand over by your luggage. STOP getting my hopes up!

Our record is still awesome!!!

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ May 29, 2005 -> 03:51 PM) Hmmm...Beverly Hills Cop II is on Comedy Central... You'll get more laughs watching the game...

Have I missed any bickering?

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ May 29, 2005 -> 02:29 PM) Sleepy, the half-court offense is not what got it done for the 90s Bulls. This is something that I won't even elaborate on. You were 10 years old when we won our first championship. You should have vivid memories of everything that went down. We killed teams with defense and points off of turnovers. Jordan wrecked shop in the half court, and that's it. '90's is too broad. Those were essentially two seperate teams, and I did watch much more of the 2nd three-peat. Those teams excelled at many facets of the game, including the ones you mention, but don't discount their half-court sets. The triangle offense didn't enter general basketball terminology for nothing. They were good on offense, and I am appalled that a Bulls fan is going to say that it was all just handing the ball over to Jordan. You're wrong. That wasn't just it.

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ May 29, 2005 -> 02:04 PM) You can begin to see why we won 6 championships in the 90s, no? Like I said, a good defense is a good offense, and not vice versa. The 90s Bulls in a half court offense? Not the most impressive thing I've ever seen, by any means. Jordan in isolation, oh yippee. Yeah, Jordan sucks on the offensive end of the floor. :headshake And it was called the triangle, not isolation... The Bulls offense throughout the 90's was one of the most impressive I've seen. Sit down and watch a a '98 game. I don't see how you could not love their offense or defense. I was actually watching Game 6 '98 at Utah last night, and I was loving every minute of it. I don't see how you, as a supposed Bulls fan, is now going say they are unimpressed by the Bulls of the 90's. :headshake

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ May 29, 2005 -> 01:59 PM) Sorry if I'm getting a little too deep for you, Sleepy. Chandler, Ratliff, Camby, etc are the types of players that you build around if you expect to field a team that can do deeeep into he playoffs. Why is this such a foreign concept? Is a goalie not of the utmost importance in the vast majority of cases? I wouldn't expect you to understand, though. Too deep... I don't speak bulls***. So where are the Bulls, Blazers, and Nugs? Deep in the playoffs, right? Chandler shined in the playoffs, didn't he? I get it. You love role players. I understand their importance, but you're glorifying them way to f***in' much...

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ May 29, 2005 -> 01:56 PM) Sleepy's obviously just bought into the new NBA hype of scoring scoring scoring, 3 pt shooting, fast break, f*** defense. Defense wins championships, keep preaching it hammer. Scottie Pippen. Michael Jorden. Why were they so great? They were as good, or in the case of Pip, better, on the defensive end as they were on the offensive end. Don't give me that bulls*** that I'm all about offense. The only dillusional person preaching one single aspect of the game is hammer.

QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ May 29, 2005 -> 12:09 PM) I meant Ratliff in his prime. He was something else, man. Best kept secret in the NBA, perhaps. Brand is a fantasy monster, and like I said before, he's a legitimate starting PF on a championship squad. However, he is by no means a guy you build around. You build around guys like Chandler, Ratliff, Wallace, Camby, Duncan, Garnett, etc. If they can score, it's only a bonus. A good defense is a good offense, and not vice versa. I know I ain't the only guy in here who ain't caught up in Western thought, the American dream. The bomb, the long ball, etc. People need to kick that capitalistic bulls*** to the curb. Guard your motherf***ing fort, you don't want to have a Pheonix Suns or Dallas Mavericks game plan. That's when your entire s*** gets wiped out. Your posts no longer merit valid responses... The very teams they are on or have been on have not nor will ever build around chandler, ratliff, or camby. That's just plain stupid. It just got worse when you went into the American dream, capitalism, and the bomb... :headshake Word of advice: Don't post while drunk or high.

What's a good place to download music of the unpaid variety?

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ May 29, 2005 -> 01:27 AM) I really, really, really, really, really wish I could go to the game on Monday unfortunately I got some dumb family dinner so I have to settle for Tuesday, can't wait to see Frank back in the lineup. loser j/k Damn, I'm just excited to see Frank. No need to take your time to adjust, Big Hurt. Just get in there and do what you're capable of...

QUOTE(ZoomSlowik @ May 28, 2005 -> 11:07 PM) As for the Brand/Tyson/Ratliff/Wallace comparisons, I don't think it works at all. Wallace and Brand both are on another level. Brand is basically Eddy Curry, only he can rebound and block shots. He might not be an elite defensive player, but he is definitely better than average. The Bulls would be an entirely different team if he were still here. He's an elite post scoring option, which would drastically improve the Bull's consistency in offensive production without hurting the defense all that much, if at all. There's no way I take Ratliff over him. Ratliff has never been an elite rebounder (the guy has never hit double figures despite playing 30+ minutes virtually his whole career) and is about Ben Wallace's equal on offense. Basically he blocks a few shots and takes up space. If he really had that much of an impact on his team he wouldn't be on team #4. As for Tyson, he might eventually be an elite option, but he's not even close yet. He's a solid defender and rebounder when he's healthy and on his game. Unfortunately we never know when that is. He doesn't always play the way he should and gets beat by guys he shouldn't on the defensive end way too often. Also, his offensive game, or lack thereof, is absolutely depressing. He has no shooting ability and no post moves. Basically the only way he scores is off a rebound or on a dunk from a nice pass. He drastically needs to improve in that area. Given the choice between an inconsistent 22 year old get that has had some injury problems and a 26 year old All-star that has put up around 20 points and 10 rebounds his whole career and more than 2 blocks per game the last four years, it's a no brainer. Take a look at all of the teams left in the playoffs. I'd say only two of them play well above average defense, while all of them have at least one player averaging close to 20 points per game and at least two other players that can get there on an above average but not stellar night. I can't say that about the Bulls. Even assuming Curry is gone/done, replace Tyson with Brand and the Bulls would still have above average defense and at least 3 consistent scoring options in Brand, Hinrich, and Gordon, with Deng doing fairly well also. Good post. It's nice to see that there are people who can see how ridiculous some of those comments were. I was starting to worry that everyone was agreeing with that bulls***. But...but...but...defense! theo has awesome blocks per 48 min.!!! Look past how he sucks at everything else! Role players are a million times more valuable than stars! defense!!! :headshake