ptatc

QUOTE (Charlie Haeger's Knuckles @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 11:23 AM) I was watching the game last night and he was cruising until that pitch... after you could see how swollen his arm was, and it wouldn't surprise me if there was something going on in there that caused it to break when he threw the pitch. I've just seen pictures and written description but it looks nasty.

QUOTE (Charlie Haeger's Knuckles @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 11:17 AM) Joel Zumaya's most significant injury was a separated shoulder resulting in AC Arthrosis (which I have and it SUCKS). Was never able to throw a ball again. As highly doucherous as he was, I will always "respect" him for how he injured it.... evacuating his parents from their home that was under threat of wildfire. After looking it up, his career was ended by a non-displaced fracture to his olecranon that needed a screw for stability. They decided to replace the screw which means that healing did not occur properly and may have been misaligned, which could explain why he never recovered properly. That really is more of the stress fracture that I was referring to unlike Floyd's that is obviously displaced.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 11:00 AM) Guess I don't see eye to eye with you guys on this. The telling situation was when KW went to JR with two plans one year (I can't remember the year). He said there was a plan to increase the budget and continue to go for it and another to begin the re-tooling process by beginning to trade the veterans, cut the MLB budget and start investing in the minors. According to the articles, JR chose the increasing the budget plan. It is an organizational philosophy and the whole organization was in on it.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 10:34 AM) Tom Browning as well, but pretty rare. Right. These were all humerus fractures, none in the olecranon/ulna.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 10:31 AM) He had a tumor in his humerus that needed to be frozen and removed. So his arm was weakened to begin with. The other one that comes to mind is a pitcher for the Marlins and Angels, I think. Was it Joe Saunders or Tony Saunders. Something like that. Others have had stress fractures like Bobby Jenks and had screws inserted to strengthen them but not true displaced fractures like this one.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 10:17 AM) Dave Dravecky is the only thing that comes to mind. He had a tumor in his humerus that needed to be frozen and removed. So his arm was weakened to begin with. The other one that comes to mind is a pitcher for the Marlins and Angels, I think. Was it Joe Saunders or Tony Saunders. Something like that.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 08:29 AM) (I loved Kenny Williams and everything he did and continues to do, but if you think he and Hahn would have had this same vision towards the future, you're motherf***ing crazy) I think Hahn and KW are very similar and would do very similar things. KW always said that there was a time when the Sox were going to have to re-tool and start trading veterans for prospects. However, with what he deemed the core players still doing well he was sticking to the "go for it" plan until the organization felt iut was time to switch philosophies. I don't think it is a coincidence that once the organization decide to "go in a different direction" that KW stepped aside for Hahn. KW did his time and didn't want to go through the "re-tooling" process. He went back to what he always said he liked the most' scouting. I have no doubt that if KW had stayed the GM that he would be on a similar path as Hahn. Maybe not the exact same moves but a similar philosophy. Remember who the primary scout for the big players is for Hahn, KW.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 09:26 AM) Again, I agree with most of it, but I wouldn't see it as a very slim chance he goes #1 or #2. He was the consensus number 1 prospect heading into this year, had a year which was seen as relatively disappointing and still was considered by most as the #2 prospects, sliding to #3 after a surprise pick at #2, in what was considered a good draft. In fact, the fact that his leverage is way lower as a senior makes it even more likely he'd go #1 or #2, you'd get a premium talent and the probability of an underslot deal. I'm nitpicking really, I agree with the premise that he should sign. That was my point. Working with the MLB staff on his change would be the advantage and he could develop it.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 09:27 AM) Interesting. Is it possible a reconstruction can be too strong, causing something like this? No it wouldn't be the cause. It would be that he would have torn the ligament again with whatever he did. However, because the bone was for whatever reason weaker than the ligament the force went to the bone. I have never seen or heard of anything like this. The only fractures from throwing I've heard of are humerus fractures where there is a tremendous amount of rotation torque.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 09:13 AM) I'd rather we paid overslot than included a deal to fast track him to the bullpen. By all accounts he needs to work on his changeup to become a truly effective starter, and after a year of barely using it at NC State, I wouldn't want him straight in the bullpen and working exclusively fastball-slider. That is pretty much what everyone does. Most relief pitchers go with the number 1 and 2 pitches exclusively. Most of the time that is why they are in the pen. The obvious advantage here is that he could work with Cooper, Thigpen and Salas on the change up if he was with the Sox.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Jun 20, 2014 -> 09:09 AM) I agree, which disappoints me that he didn't sign for slot quickly and include a spot on the 40 man roster or something. At least that way Boras could spin it that he did something for the guy. With the longer he hold outs, in my mind the less likely he signs for slot because what the hell was he waiting for then? He is trying to get every penny he can. The thing most people aren't looking at is what if he sucks as an MLB pitcher? Starting his clock early makes no difference if he is no good. You get all the money you can because you don't know how you will be later. This needs to be the mind set right now.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 10:05 PM) Ah.. did he get hit on it. It's usually either that or a fall on it. Thats an odd look for a fracture, right on the tip of the olecranon. Just heard that he fractured it throwing a pitch. That is one really strong reconstruction when the bone fails before the replaced ligament does.

QUOTE (Leonard Zelig @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 09:48 PM) Hawk just its a broken elbow. Ah.. did he get hit on it. It's usually either that or a fall on it. Thats an odd look for a fracture, right on the tip of the olecranon.

Going to Denver in two weeks. Added a trip down to Mesa Verde and the cliff dwellings. This is new for us and should be excellent.

QUOTE (Baron @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 08:33 PM) Yeesh Olecranon bursitis. I've seen them get near baseball size.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 10:26 AM) Pitching for pitching. Walker projects to be an ace, is major league ready now. I think Walker could essential replace Q in the rotation with upside and is cheaper. But I am not the biggest Q fan on here, I know. True, however it's projected to be an ace with and injury history. It's taking a chance and could be worth it. I just don't think I would take that chance.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 09:43 AM) Alexei Ramirez and Jose Quintana for Taijuan Walker, Nick Franklin, and Erasmo Ramirez. The Sox already have a depleted pitching staff, why would you trade the #2 pitcher on the staff? The Sox will need pitching over the next couple of years.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 19, 2014 -> 09:16 AM) Of course they do, but Redskins is a much different from the names you mentioned. For some reason, people were upset with the Chief in Champaign. He was eliminated. It didn't hurt Illinois athletics. How much of a bath did Marquette take changing their name? St. Johns used to be the Red Men. If a Redskins fan goes to another team because of the name, he or she wasn't much of a fan anyway. Unless we are American Indians, we probably don't know exactly how offensive the name is, but apparently many find it very offensive. Is there really a huge amount of people that like the Redskins just because they are named the Redskins? I really doubt it. They lost all support from this graduate. And I'm sure it's really hurt them!

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 08:18 PM) Danks ranks 83rd of 96 qualified pitchers in FIP, 95th of 96 in xFIP and 89th of 96 in SIERA. He has greatly reduced stuff and has a relatively large contract. You absolutely listen to any offer you get. As for the wishlists above, come on, ask yourselves: if you were a GM of the Mariners, would you give up anything close to Walker, Guerrero, and Wilson for Alexei? Never trade a quality mlb pitcher unless you get at least some pitching in return.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 03:36 PM) Why couldn't they just pull him at 101 pitches after 6? It's not like he was dominating. Ideally, you want him in the 115 range as much as possible to keep the endurance up. That's the only reason I can think of.

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Jun 18, 2014 -> 10:20 AM) I thought the detached lat injury was a freak thing? I heard it never has happened in baseball before, so why would that a result of his mechanics? There is no way to know for sure. However, he uses an odd follow through and deceleration. With the way it "recoils" after he releases the ball, it makes anatomical sense that it adds stress to the anterior part of the shoulder where the lat attaches. Usually, a pitcher flexes his trunk during the follow through or deceleration phase to dissipate the forces of throwing. Peavy stands almost straight up and never flexes. Rodon does a similar thing.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 10:29 PM) What I have seen has move more towards the left handed batters box than the right. It has looked like Buehrle's change. That is feasible especially if he turns it over a bit. The lowered arm angle will take the ball more side to side instead of up and down.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 09:33 PM) Scott Merkin ‏@scottmerkin 1m Danks slightly lowered his arm angle and that has seemed to make an enormous difference That makes the ball move differently. It'll run in on the hands of a RH more. It will be interesting if he can adjust once the hitters have seen it a few times.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 10:00 PM) Detroit's front office has to be scared to death at that contract. From my untrained eye, he's not throwing hard and he's throwing meat up there quite often. So we add Verlander to the list of a guy signed to a contract and the team almost immediately regretting it? My god, baseball owners are so dumb to pay these long term deals. Doesn't Verlander make something like 24 million a year? He is still throwing hard. It's just now he has to overthrow to get it there and it is straightening out. He used to throw 96 with movement. Now the 96 is straight. He is going to need to learn to throw at 93 with movement and take some of the breaking pitch and change.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jun 17, 2014 -> 10:07 PM) Several scholars have been arguing for years that the USA and Iran have very good reason to be allies with one another, due in large part to their mutually strong interest in Iraq's stability The enemy of my enemy.............