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QUOTE(daa84 @ Dec 5, 2007 -> 03:05 PM) nobody is saying its too late to assemble the team, the frustrating part is that many of the pieces people envisioned on the 08 team are gone because either we 1.) got out bid or 2.) have finally seen that 5 years of deteriorating a farm system without replenishing it is finally catching up to us hopefully the changes in the scouting department will help this. The scouting and development of players is the greatest weakness in this organization.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Dec 4, 2007 -> 05:06 PM) The Dodgers were going to offer Jones a contract until Boras threw out a few numbers. They didn't bother. I am on record as saying the White Sox signing Andruw Jones would be the most shocking signing in team history. I agree. I can't see KW going the 18 million or a long contract with him.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 10:59 PM) I'm not too familiar with the injury. How and/or will it affect his swing? I would guess at the very least it would zap some strength that would need to be built up over time. Could he be at full strength by opening day? He will be at full strength. The labrum is a piece of cartilage which surrounds the shoulder socket to make it more stable. The bicep tendon attaches to the superior potion of it which is why pitchers tend to injure it also. During a swing the humeral head in the shoulder will rise, spin and compress this area. So this area hurts and the batter cannot fully raise up the arm to follow through with the swing. It is a piece of cartilage like in the knee. The MD in this case will tack it down and tighten the area a little. So it's not a matter of strength as much as healing time and regaining normal motion. He should be ready around ST and for the season

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 10:53 PM) I can't see the Sox having any interest for Luke Scott unless of course they are trading Quentin elsewhere. That would be more than fine value though, its just its not a need unless Sox could get a 3rd team involved. I like the idea of Burke as a bench guy who will be around a couple years and has the talent to start (really was awful last year though). I just think Crede can get you more than that. Back problems with players under 30 really scare people, regardless if they are currently doing well so value will not be there in the eye of the receiving organization.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 10:52 PM) According to an article posted at SouthSideSox, he had surgery in October. I'll double-check immediately after posting this. If that's the case then he should be ready or very close to it depending on the doc's protocol. Especially since it was his non-throwing shoulder.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 10:42 PM) Sox still don't have the pieces to get him, but if there is anyway to bring him to Chicago, you do it. could this be the genesis of the Konerko to the D'Backs scenario. We trade for Cabrera then trade Konerko to the D'Backs to clear the money.

QUOTE(South Side Fireworks Man @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 10:36 PM) So will he be able to play in ST? I didn't ask that, I just wanted to know how the surgery went and how it was doing. When was the surgery? That type of surgery isn't anymore than 4-6 months on the very conservative end. From what I've heard he is progressing very well.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 09:27 PM) Hopefully Quentin is 100% and will be able to really turn things around. I also want the Sox to be patient with him. I'm also exstatic to hear they would consider moving Paulie. Afterall, there are almost zero bats out there (Cabrera is an amazing bat, but aside from that teams would have to give up a ton of cash for Jones or Rowand and neither of them are the consistent bat that Paulie is nor do I think he's a risk to be named on the Mitchell report like a certain SS from the Orioles that is on the market). He is. I called around to find out. By all reports he is doing very well.

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 10:22 PM) Do you know something? I don't doubt it only because Crede has a higher salary and is more injury prone Bob And his agent won't talk long term deal until he is a free agent.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 12:04 AM) //A diverting rant That's going to be such a joke. Baseball is going to be crucified. Meanwhile, is anything ever mentioned about Shawne Merriman being suspended for steroids? Nope -- hell, he's featured in that neat little commercial Nike (?) has out. It pisses me off the way the media perceives steroids/PEDs in baseball versus steroids/PEDs in football. I think alot of it has to do with the public perception of each sport. In football the only people who can play it are the big monsters so they are expected to take Steriods. Baseball is supposed to be the sport anyone, any size can play. There fore people get down on baseball. Also there is so much more gambling in football that many more people only care about winning at all costs and want their monsters on streoids. These are the expectations I get from working in both fields. Say Hi to Marquette for me

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 01:55 PM) We have 2 of those already in the big leagues under our control for several years and another potential one in the minors (Sisco) still trying to work through his issues. It'd have been nice if someone would have given us something for him, but if a team didn't have a spot for him on their 25 man roster next year, there'd be no reason to trade for him because they'd just lose him at the end of ST. I agree. I'm not opposed to the DFA but I don't think he is worthless as many seem to think.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 3, 2007 -> 01:47 PM) Phillips had near-zero trade value. Kind of like Andy Gonzalez, who we all hope comes off next (and should have come off for Hernandez). I still think Phillips will make a decent lefty middle reliever. Nothing special but capable.

QUOTE(Chombi @ Dec 1, 2007 -> 11:34 PM) IMO you are 100% correct. I was hoping we'd be the team making big moves, not the Twins. The Twins to me were contenders w/ Garza, Johan, Liriano, etc...Them selling off all these pieces isn't shocking but I thought'd they'd at least try to make a run. The Sox on the other hand are going the opposite direction and losing out in every direction we turn. We go after big fish and seem to fail. It paints the picture to fans, and other teams even, that we have a weaker system then percieved. We are very old and our lack of scouting doesn't show significant help anytime soon. We don't go all-in money for free agents or in trades. We refuse to do business with the douchebag who just so happens to be employed by most of the good players in baseball and we refuse to do little things in the organization...like scouting! The Twins are dumping guys and revamping. They do it more often then I am saying we should but we definately should've done it this year or even last season. We have a chance to have a very good draft. We have a shot to make some huge moves with our vets and just don't. IMO guys like PK, JV, JD, Crede, Jenks*, and several others should go. *Watch what the Twins get for Nathan and tell me how dumb we will look at seasons end when we finish in last place with a 100+ mil payroll. Jenks could command probably one more 4-5 star prospect then Nathan, maybe more. We won't deal him though. Why deal the guy with weight concerns every year and a screw in his elbow. It'd be stupid to deal it before anyone else starts to have concerns. To me, this season has nothing to do with winning the WS. It has everything to do with EGO. KW is so into his moves and his "plans" that he wants to prove that 05 wasnt a fluke and that some of his moves can actually pay off. He put this baby together and will ride until the end with it (which is hopefully at seasons end). It's going to be a loooooooong season if things don't start shaping up soon. Maybe everyone did have concerns which is why we were able to get him when the Angles cut him.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Nov 30, 2007 -> 12:29 AM) I don't believe that that offer was ever made. And personally (not that it matters), I don't feel very comfortable with making any deal that includes both Danks and Gio in it. Along with Fields, you're talking about giving away what, 5.5 years of major league service time at the league minimum, and then a few more years at well-below market prices as they reach their first years of arbitration? It's just not worth it to me for one player, not with our current financial situation anyways. If we were the Red Sox, Dodgers, Yankees, Mets or Angels, maybe, but not with the way things look for us right now. I guess as high as I'd go would be Fields/Danks/Sweeney/Broadway. And if that doesn't get it done, so be it. I'd much rather go out and sign Andruw Jones and keep the prospects than give away so much young pitching. Isn't the infamous Boras the agent for Jones? This means the Sox will not sign him. The concept should be dropped now. It will not happen.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Nov 30, 2007 -> 02:01 AM) The Sox were willing to go 5 years for Hunter, but not for Rowand? That's absolutely ridiculous; Rowand's the better bet to age well and stay healthy over the duration of a 5 year deal, not Hunter. If that extra year keeps Rowand from signing, I'll be a bit upset. Look at the injury history. Age is the only advantage Rowand has over Hunter. I would give Rowand a 5 year deal.

QUOTE(29andPoplar @ Nov 29, 2007 -> 03:55 PM) Fine by me, although I am not entirely sure what this means so if you could PM me I would appreciate it. Posts 13 and 14 got it rolling and I found it interesting there was no response to post 20. Further let it be noted I have asked more than once for the poster in question to seek other posters to converse with, as I suspect there are hard feelings about me asking the poster in question to refrain from swearing in responses to me. Those requests have gone unheeded as can plainly be seen. There is a long running "discussion" between the "stats" people and the "scouting with my eyes" people. The stats people will back up their "discussions" with "facts" and say you can't be right. You have no proof except your eyes. It's just the way it is here. Take it for what it's worth but you will be bombarded with all sorts of acronyms to make sure your wrong. I fall in the middle but lean towards the scouting side because of my background.

QUOTE(G&T @ Nov 25, 2007 -> 02:48 PM) He's had sciatia since 2006. So technically that's not a back problem. It's a nerve problem. I knew there was something. Link to a site from 2006 sciatica is usually a back problem. The sciatic nerve is a combination of nerves from the lumbar and sacral spine which runs down the posterior part of the leg. Most often it's caused by a problem in the back such as a disc or stenosis. Sometimes it can be caused by a muscle impingement from the piriformis which is a muscle on your posterior hip. As I recall the sciatic problem was preventing him from completing the follow through without pain. This would indicate a back problem. I believe he has epidural injections in the lumbar spine to relieve the problem.

QUOTE(Lemon_44 @ Nov 24, 2007 -> 06:37 PM) I know there is a reason,but i can't remember what it is, so i'll ask? Why do the Sox/Reinsdorf refuse to deal with Boras clients in free agency. I know KW thought Boras used him in the Arod negotiations back when he signed with Texas but that can't be the only reason. I also seem to remember them having difficulty with Boras draft clients but that shouldn't be the be all,end all to not negotiate with his ML level free agents. I was just wondering if there is a specific incident or is it just an accumulation of past dealings where they won't talk to him anymore. I think it's a bad policy on the Sox part even though i can't stand Boras as well. You are taking yourslef out of the hunt for alot of the top players if you refuse to negotiate with him. I know Bobby Seay was one of the "loophole" players that were drafted and Boras got declared free agents. Also, Boras just as KW puts it "highly overvalues his clients" compared to the Sox view. Boras basically has lied to the teams about offers his clients get from other teams and has them bid against themselves ie. Rodriquez in Texas. The GMs cannot discuss whether or not someone did offer the contract because that would be collusion. His bluff was finally called with the latest Rodriguez contract. This is why many teams dislike dealing with him. I believe that KW went so far as to have someone in the organization negotiate the latest Crede deal to avoid arbitration.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 21, 2007 -> 12:53 PM) Like 99% of the American population. If he was interested in a tradition of winning and a proven track record, he'd be in New York chatting with the Yankees. With Free Agency, absent of the money issues, we'd see every great player in the Bronx with pin stripes or LA soaking up the sun and speaking their native language. Maybe it has more to do with being in a city you and your family like and one that is affordable. I'm not sure if Hunter is a "city" or "country " person but if he doen't really care for living in big cities Chicago is a better option than LA or NYC. Face it, 14 mil a year will carry you a long way anywhere.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 20, 2007 -> 03:46 PM) So, wait, Bourgeois is not on the 40 man so he's rule 5 eligibile...and now the 40 man is full so it's impossible for us to sign anyone without dropping a player first? I thought this was odd also. If the Hunter signing is imminent, why would they fill the 40 man. Either it's not imminent or there will need to be a trade for someone on it (Crede/Uribe) first. Doesn't sound like the Hunter deal is as close as some thought.

QUOTE(bschmaranz @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 04:20 PM) Summer Sanders blows them all out of the water One of the best assignments I've ever had was to massage Sommer before her event in Indy when she was there for the world championship. That was a very loooong and detailed massage!

QUOTE(fathom @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 07:27 PM) There's enough members of the media that despise Clemens that there's no way they could cover his name up. You don't think that whoever provided this information wouldn't tell someone in the media if all the names they mentioned besides Clemens are reported? I doubt you'll ever see his name linked to steriods, it would be similar to the NBA admitting Michael Jordan's hiatus was a "voluntary" retirement to spend time with his family.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 06:37 PM) Speaking of the conspiracy we talked about earlier: Roger Clemens retires. Say he isn't named, rightly or wrongly. Take the fact that Clemens has basically retired. A "plea bargain" perhaps? A coup d'tat? That was just something that came to mind as I thought about MLB covering up and then someone said, "Maybe Pettitte's named!" and then I said, "Clemens, hmm." 'Cause, you know, Pettitte and Clemens are homies. It's all speculation of course. This is the "big player" for whom MLB covered up a positive test, at least that's always been the scuttlebutt.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Mar 27, 2007 -> 05:36 PM) This place often feels like a baseball prospectus "MLB" message board instead of a white sox fan site. I don't think there is anything wrong with being upset or something, but the vicious way that people on this site hate the players, manager, GM, team is a little out there. There are many times when I forget that I'm on a White Sox fan site. On my college message board, people get pissed at me because I'm pessimistic and negative. Go figure. 91 or so. But there could be a huge variation. COuld be 10 more or 10 less than that. It'll be interesting to watch, as long as I stay away from these boards as much as possible. i agree. Everyone has the right to be pessimistic of the team's performance due to the awful spring. But the hatred and viciousness targeted at indivduals KW, OG, GF ( hey, that's the opposite of Freddy Garcia maybe that's why KW traded for him to be the anti FG) is just out of control. It's not a site for white sox fans it's a site to hate the individuals that comprise the team. The enjoyment of the board is pretty much gone.

QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:18 PM) FWIW, from whitesox.com "If you don't want to get hurt in baseball, I'll be sitting with you in the pressbox," said Guillen, who mentioned getting Hall at-bats and a little work at first base was discussed during the morning staff meeting. "The only way to keep him sharp is to play him every other day and find him some at-bats." "I love it over there," added Hall, who listed Sunday's injury as a subluxation, or partial dislocation, of his right shoulder. "I was anticipating a play like that anyways. I happened to land wrong." If the labrum was torn severe enough to have the shoulder sublux then it isn't a minor tear. I'm sure they will try rehab first to see if the shoulder muscles (rotator cuff) are sufficient enough for stabilization. Odds are that they won't be and he will miss about 3 months before he can start to throw. The advantage here is that he is not the starter. If he can rest and rehab betwwen starts depending on playing time, he may be able to tough it out.