ptatc

My game worn jerseys are: Gray-Roberto Hernandez Black- warren Newson White-Wilson Alvarez Green-Chris Snopek

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Mar 23, 2007 -> 11:06 PM) It makes Philly look awful. I would assume there is a heavy amount of scouting that goes into most any trade, and this was a rather major one. Everyone and their mother knew Garcia lost a good amount of velocity off his stuff. To not have an MRI or even a physical done on the player in question is just irresponsible. i'm very surpirsed they didn't do a physical. However, not doing an MRI is routine if the pitcher has not had a history of arm trouble. An MRI will only find major things. Under surface tears and small things are rarely found with this. There is no reason to be suspicious of FG having arm trouble because he hasn't missed any starts despite the heavy work load the last two years. He may have been tired and worn out but no significant injuries.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 23, 2007 -> 10:59 AM) At least based on the reports last year, Freddy developed that splitter about half way through the season. As you point out, his velocity drop started well before that, from mid 90's with Seattle to Low 90's in 05 with us to high 80's in the first part of 06. It might have something to do with it now, or he might have been working on the pitch before press reports claimed he was, but I think the timing argues against the splitter itself being the sole cause of his velocity drop. iwas thinking that maybe it was the source of the current shoulder trouble.

QUOTE(StatManDu @ Mar 23, 2007 -> 02:31 AM) The old park ... LaGrow ... Kenny Williams ... Julio Cruz ... what a day ... check out the whole thing plus a trivia question at www.whitesoxalmanac.com ... ENJOY! SOUTHSIDE HITMEN GET THEIR CLOSER 1977: General manager Roland Hemond pulled off a beauty of a deal when he acquired Lerrin LaGrow from the St. Louis Cardinals for Clay Carroll in a swap of right-handed relievers. LaGrow went on to have one of the best seasons ever by a Sox closer. The Phoenix native posted 25 saves, the third highest total in franchise history since the stat became official, while becoming an integral part of one of the most significant seasons in club history. Carroll, meanwhile, made his way back to the Sox for the end of the 1977 campaign after appearing in 51 games for the Cards. POURING OUT THE JUICE 1987: The White Sox released Julio Cruz, cutting ties with one of the sparkplugs of their 1983 American League Western Division title team. It was a great beginning but a sour end for the affable Cruz. The second baseman hit .251 and swiped 24 bases after being acquired from Seattle June 15, 1983. His acquisition is often pointed to as one of the main reasons why the 1983 Sox went on that second half tear and won the division going away. Following the season, the Sox signed Cruz to a six-year contract. That turnedout to be a colossal mistake. “The Juice” was never the same after the magical 1983 season. His release on this date concluded one of the most bittersweet careers in team annals. I've often wondered how this board would have reacted to the Cruz acqusition that year. "Hemond called Bernazard our heart and soul and now he trades fora player to replace him in the middle of the season." "There is no loyalty, he was my favorite player and the most fan freindly." Tony was a good players and oneof the best guys around the team at the time.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Mar 21, 2007 -> 11:46 PM) Believe me, if there's something wrong that's going to keep him down, and they feel he came over as damaged goods, they will inquire. I don't think the White Sox would be obligated. I saw him last year and figured something had to be wrong. I would imagine they examined him. If they did, they missed it, tough luck. If they didn't they were fools, tough luck again. his velocity has been down since 2004. Remember the discussion about him giving up velocity for control once he came to the Sox. Who knows if there was a problem or when it started. My friends tell me he's never complained of any problems. Another thought is about the splitter. The was a decent article in Baseball weekly discussing how pitchers who pick up the splitter or forkball later in their careers have a high incidence of shoulder injuries. The question is did the pitch cause the injury or was the career going down so they tried a new pitch which didn't help. If it is just bicep tendonitis, it should be easily remedied. However as another poster said, sometimes this can be an indication of a glenoiud labrum tear. The labrum is a ring which deepens the shoulder socket to increase the stability of the joint. Pitchers inherently have loose shoulders so it moves around more. This can cause a fraying of the labrum and cause a SLAP lesion. This means Superior Labrum Anterior to Posterior tear. The bicep tendon attaches to the superior portion of the labrum. So if the labrum frays or tears it may show up as a bicep tendon pain. A great story of this is injury John Elway. He got a SLAP lseion during the playoff game before the first Super Bowl he won. It was gettingin the way of the joint and he couldn't throw. Since you don't throw as much or need to be mechanically correct in football, the doctors decided to disconnect the bicep tendon. They took off the tendon from the labrum and attached it to the bone out of the way. After he played the Super bowl the doctors re-attched the tendon and he did the 6 months rehab after the game. He would have missed the Super Bowl to do rehab earlier. I've always thought Elway was annoying but this showed me that he was one tough SOB.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 21, 2007 -> 06:42 AM) Ah the young pups... Anyways, it seems crazy to think that Kris is only 24. He might be an interesting candidate for a big time sleeper season, though usually it take another year for the arm to get back to full strength and capability. Even at 25, he still has a very nice shot at making something of himself. No kidding. How many remember when Doug Drabek was a Sox prospect?

QUOTE(Beltin @ Mar 18, 2007 -> 08:02 AM) Was the Bill Simas inning against Cleveland in 1996 (I think that was the season although it could have been 1997)? Sox again clinging to a 4-2 lead and were in the midst of winning like 22 out of 24 games or something to that effect? I seem to remember Simas coming up huge and striking out one or two of their most feared hitters. I could swear Mr. Thome was one of them as well. FWIW, I recall that as the greatest regular season Sox run I had witnessed since the second half of 1983. i remember that inning. It was when the Indians were playing well. It was in Cleveland I believe. The bases were loaded with no one out and he got out of it with no runs. That was amazing. Has to be up there with the best inning ever. Cleveland had a great offense at the time.

QUOTE(shoota @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 12:30 AM) It's acceptable for person X to error because persons Y and Z errored also? It's not an error because what the coach says goes. You from the outside looking in may disagree with him but a coach is in charge of the team, period. Players and fans do not run the team. If you don't do what the caoch expects you deserve to be in the doghouse.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 03:55 PM) David Riske would have been a class A free agent last year I'm told. All of those guys should be squarely in teh A category. Link. Thanks

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 02:05 PM) I'm just going to throw this out to everyone -- what do you believe wouldl happen if our record this season is -- as BP predicted -- 72 - 90? It'd just be interesting to me because I don't believe there's any question our payroll would drop. I'm not talking a substantial decrease, either. Just maybe 10-15 million. Not enough to cry poor, but enough to completely alter our offseason. Is Iguchi resigned? Is Ichiro pursued? I know the posts I've made concerning a run at Ichiro have assumed the payroll remains over 100 million. What about Crede? Hell, he may be traded even with a World Series victory. Iguchi may be re-signed depending on what other teams offer. No way we sign Ichiro. I don't see KW tying up 1/5 of the payroll to one player. As to your points in the previous post. I read some info about how the compensation picks changed with the new CBA. How will that effect players such as MB and JD vs. Iguchi?

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 01:17 AM) and Thomas actually had to go through like a crazy treatment where I think they just made like a million microfractures in his foot and it healed up. I'm hoping ptact can help me on this one, as I recall him talking about in not that long ago. Thomas actually wasn't healthy and won't be. If you look at his numbers he either hits an HR or a single because he can't run. His doubles and runs scored are a fraction of what they should be due to inability to run. He has just modified his game to be one dimensional. Earlier he wasn't willing to do this and it was understandable. Luckily for him that one dimension is outstanding and will keep him in the game. As for his treatment there was alot of different interventions done to the navicular bone in his foot and it seems to have calmed down the pain enough that he can hit. Although pain killing injections can do wonders.

QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 02:17 PM) How long on this board was "Trade Jon Garland" every other topic because he was not even a worthwhile starter. Last I checked Floyd hasnt pitched in 1 meaningful game for the White Sox, so who cares about ST stats? Maybe he will be great, maybe he wont be. But to throw in the towel at this point is crazy. But....But... he sucked in Philly in 100 innings, so can't be good.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 01:28 PM) Because some of our fans give up on players so damn early and it's just a reminder of that fact that some players do indeed take time to develop. Thank You

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 01:24 PM) http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/press...sp&c_id=cws I was impressed with what I saw of Phillips. He will be in the majors. Maybe only as a 2nd lefty out of the pen but I think he will be better than that.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 12:31 PM) Let me clarify my point: If Ozzie doesn't like you, you basically don't have a fair shake, I hate to say it but it's the truth. A lot of these players that Ozzie seemingly doesn't like are young players as he obviously has 0 patience. Brian and Brandon rubbed Ozzie the wrong way and one is in Texas while the other has basically been given up on after what...400 ab's? Ridiculous. I agree but isn't this pretty much true for most manager's and coaches. If they don't like your work habits, attitude, tlaent or whatever you aren't going to play. This isn't only Ozzie. He seems to give most players a shot before he goes this route. It's up to the player to change what the manager perceives as " the problem." The problem I would have is if Ozzie doesn't communicate to the player what the problem is. But he seems to do that even if people don't always agree with the method. He is the manager, they are the players. Until he is no longer the manager they need to do what he thinks is best.

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 10:57 AM) They weren't established veterans with years of service, but they were in fact the established starters at their respective positions. They didn't have to win the job. So because Ozzie didn't come to the Sox his first year as a manager, and dump the third basemen the team had been grooming and the shortstop they acquired, is your argument that he likes young players??? I'm not on either side in this "young player" arguement, but this is kind of a stretch. My only arugment is Brian should be the starting CF. I can give a s*** if he is young old or whatever. I don't know Ozzies reasons so I won't pretend to, but if BA is in the minors this season...our D is in trouble. Weren't alot of people trying to trade Crede because he just wouldn't hit enough? Alot of people were also skeptical that Uribe could be an everyday player because of his wold and inconsistent offense. Also with Garland while having logged MLB innings was trying to be pushed out because he could make it past the 5 or 6th inning under Manuel. Guillen stuck with these guy when alot of people wanted to run them out of town. We have short memories here if people don't remember this. These players were succeessful because Guillen stuck with them for whatever reason. These players were not rookies but were all young unproven players when Guillen took over.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 03:57 PM) Ian, The only issue that I have with Mack in center today, is that you have 2 kids fighting for a job and you want to give them the best opportunity for success. Having someone play a position that they are not comfortable at with 2 contact pitchers on the mound is not the best for success. Its not a big deal in the long run, but you just want to evaluate it with the best light. Maybe Ozzie wants to see how mentally tough the pitchers are to pitch over mistakes made by fielders. Sometimes this can be a good mark for a pitchers. Do they hang their head? Do they glare at the feilder. Do they fall apart and give up a big inning>

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Mar 12, 2007 -> 09:48 AM) Well history does show us that comedians are rarely "funny" in real life, and are often the most tragic of people. Lou Costello and Bud Abbott had more than their fare share of demons (I believe it was Bud that was reknowned for his HUGE Porn collection), as have almost all of the big guys. Chris Farley was an absolutely funny guy in college. I used to go out drinking with him. He was a great guy. I heard the drugs and such changed him when he hit it big but I really enjoyed hanging arounmd with th guy.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Mar 9, 2007 -> 10:40 AM) Well of course. People are still under the false premise that a .350 OBP guy who goes 50 for 65 in steals is better than a .370 OBP guy (which Erstad isn't obviously, but i'm making a seperate debate) who goes 18 for 20 in steals, when in reality guy #2 is much better. Many people still believe it because it has a valid point. Statistically in the Bill James element it doesn't. But what it does take into effect is the pitcher's mind set. Players with speed on first base bother pitchers. MB commented on this earlier in the spring. During one of his first outings there were people on base and he said it was distracting him and making him work harder. This is the advantage. It won't show in stats so you won't agree but if a pitcher needs to work harder it will effect them later in the game. The player who steals may not score more often but I believe it effects the pitcher and is an advantage over the game and over a season. QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 9, 2007 -> 10:58 AM) Personally, I believe dealing Logan is a mistake. He has shown immense talent in the minors and could be a fixture in our bullpen for many years. If Williams is intent on trading several AAA players (Rogowski/Tracey), why not search for a similar to situation to ours where a player (CF) is blocked? If it doesn't work out, who cares? I'd rather take this risk than preventing Anderson from playing another season because Rowand is back. And everyone here knows Rowand will be given ALL the time to hit out of slumps. I agree. Although, I've been impressed so far with Phillips. I think he may make a decent back of the rotation guy or a reliever. I think adds to the potential depth of the lefty pitcher pool for the bullpen if nothing else.

QUOTE(Palehosefan @ Mar 8, 2007 -> 12:46 PM) http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/news/...12steroids.html I was really high on Valido when we drafted him, and thought for sure we had drafted our future SS. But the steroid case, and subsequent injury have turned me completely off of him. Would be great to see him come back with an assumed steroid free good year and retake his place as our best infield prospect. I guess I want to see him prove that he can play without help. He's still young enough to turn it around. I would not let the steriods issue cloud your view of him. It is very common to get positive tests from over the counter supplements. This is why you get second chances. The kids in the minors take something that their buddy said helped them to get an advantage with weight lifting or something. Even though you warn them not to take anything that isn't on the MLB cleared list, they do it anyway. If his performance does't improve, that's a different story. Give him another chance.

QUOTE(Hideaway Lights @ Mar 8, 2007 -> 01:00 PM) I like the idea of having three starting vets and a couple of kids that we develop, I just like Mark in there more than Vaz. Hopefully we'll find a way to get Mark done, but I don't think so. Your basic premise is correct. I would rather have MB than JV. But there is no way MB will sign for anything less than double the value of that deal. That would be about 5/14mil or so. He''ll get it but I would not lock a pitcher up for that long. It's a good deal for the flexibility in the pitching staff as others have stated. We keep him as a veteran innings eater if the kids have problems. If the kids do well, it's an easily tradable contract.

QUOTE(FlaCWS @ Mar 7, 2007 -> 07:58 PM) Maybe I'm totally blind but I haven't seen Owens' name in the box score the past couple of games. I ask because Anderson continues to hit like crap and, while I'll probably get slammed for this, I truly believe Owens is the better long-term solution in CF. I realize Anderson has only had one year and now a spring, and I'm not totally ready to give up on him, but I am just not that impressed. Yes he's a great glove but he's been a total liability at the plate. Owens looks like a guy who could hit for a good average by slapping the ball around and getting a bunch of hits on his speed alone. Besides that, he could be a leadoff hitter and basestealing threat a la Podsednick in '05 - and as a bonus could mean we don't have to rely on Scotty anymore (letting Erstad keep the seat warm for Sweeney in '08). Even if we want to put Erstad in CF and Jerry in LF, I'd love to see him win the roster spot over Brian. Thoughts? (ducks)... Nooooo. Not a guy with speed. Speed is useless. Ozzie will mismanage him. He'll only play because Ozzie loves speed!!!!!

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 7, 2007 -> 06:51 PM) How exactly did Williams use all available information before trading for Floyd? Because, when I look at his minor league numbers, I don't see anything of value. I completely agree that using everything -- from statistics to scouting -- should be considered for player evaluation. However, when one of those options seem to portray Floyd as an enigma; now you're counting on your scouts to notice something that nearly everything quantifiable suggests doesn't exist. There should be some level of agreement between the two factions. Such as the scouts noticing Floyd has a great arm, and the numbers -- at some point in his past -- indicating as much. Sure, such a risk is acceptable when signing someone to one year deal; but it shouldn't be when attempting to collect the largest cache of talent for a departing starter. No doubt it was 'gutsy' acquiring Floyd when perhaps an additional arm, or another player more projectable, could have been included. I've said before, I believe if Fabio Castro were included in the deal Philadelphia would have approved it. His upside is, at the least, equal to Floyd. At worst, he replaces Logan in our bullpen. If Floyd is unable to win the 5th starters position this spring, that'll be enough evidence to prove acquiring him was a mistake. I'm almost certain that Williams' plan after the Garcia deal didn't revolve around Floyd pitching in AAA, perhaps replacing an injured/ineffecitve starter in 2007, only to ultimately be in the bullpen for his White Sox career. This is where I could see him heading if his spring training doesn't end well. I think the target of that deal was Gio. People still seem to think KW went after Floyd and Gio got thrown in. I think it was the other way around. So for the secondary pitcher in the deal it is worth the chance. Yes, Floyd is closer to contributing but is not the best pitcher in the deal. There is no way I take Fabio Castro. He will be nothing more than a decent middle reliever. He have plenty of options for relief in that role. He went for a starter with unrealized talent. Could be big could be a bust. This is type of player many people think we should draft. Big talent/big risk. He is 24,he was worth the risk. Even if he is in AAA for awhile, the payoff could be worth it.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 7, 2007 -> 12:06 PM) This is my belief -- he's refering to the methods used to evaluate players. By suggesting he does things differently, he's refering to scouting more than statistical data. Why else would Floyd be on this ballclub, afterall? KW has stated this before. While he looks at the stats he believe more in what he and his MLB scouts see. He his evaluations aren't driven by pure statistical data. He brought this up in regards to Iguchi when they signed him. The comments were (paraphasing here) "We were worried about signing him because nobody saw him live. We thought we saw enough on video to think it is a good signing." This is one reason I like KW. Use all of the information available. Don't get caught up in only one aspect of evaluation. He isn't always right, nobody is. But he also make gutsy moves which you need to do to win. It's awfully difficult to win being conservative.

QUOTE(dasox24 @ Mar 6, 2007 -> 09:17 PM) Wow, you have no idea how happy you made me just now to see a thread entitled "Draft Plans/Needs." I absolutely love the MLB Draft. I guess it's probably b/c I'm such a "minor league" guy, and the draft is what restocks the system. As for this years draft, look for a change in philosophy regarding drafting pitchers. I think you'll see us take guys that have great stuff, but need some work. The past few years we've taken some solid pitchers like Broadway and McCulloch, but passed on the guys with the great arms. The positions mentioned above (C, middle IF) are extremely thin, but you won't see us draft for need. You draft best available player. Now, if the best available player at our spot is a Catcher or SS or 2B, then that would be fantastic. But, don't be surprised to see us take an OF or 3B, which while they aren't needs for the big league club, there are so many spots in the minors that you can find a great player playing time. Hell, whoever we draft will probably be used in a trade at some point anyway, lol... As for specific players, I have no idea about anyone that will be in this year's draft since it's only the start of baseball season. However, as June approaches, you'll be seeing plenty of stuff on BA.com and MLB.com I agree. I think the Sox got burned with guys like Jason Stumm. High schoolers with great arms but who wear out in pro ball. This made them gun shy. It will be interesting to see. They have upper level pitching depth with the newly acquired arms so I wouldn't be surprised to see them take some chances with High risk/high reward players.