Dam8610

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 17, 2014 -> 05:00 PM) Would we pay 4 years and $40-44 million to DeAza? Because offensively, that's the kind of production we're looking at. Markakis clearly has better fundamentals and fewer brain cramps and is beloved by Showalter (supposedly), but he's not going to be the difference-maker he was projected to be five years ago. If I had a gun to my head, I'd choose Cabrera, but not a big fan of either acquisition at these price points. If you don't value superior defense, striking out much less, or walking much more, then yes, Markakis is exactly like De Aza.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 15, 2014 -> 07:40 PM) They're unlikely to go after Liriano or Peavy again. You've got Volquez, Hammel, Vogelsong, Masterson, Brett Anderson, Floyd, Josh Johnson that would all be value plays. E. Santana, if they want to pay $10-12 million for three to four years. The argument over Santana has changed a bit since last year, although the odds of adding him with Danks still in the field aren't extremely high. Those guys one year away from fa like price shark and fister could be made available as well between now and midseason. Plus Maeda and Kuroda. I like the idea of Santana. Is there a reason no one has mentioned Billingsley?

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Nov 6, 2014 -> 07:25 PM) Really surprised to hear you say that. You talk of building the farm yet you'd be willing to give up a 1st and 2nd rounder over a 2nd and 3rd rounder only a year apart so it really makes no difference in the contention window but means very much in the talent level. Luckily I think Hahn knows that if theres going to be a large influx of talent this is the year to do it . If you need more talent next year, then at least Hahn's got more tradeable assets because right now we can get very little in trade unless we trade prospects and don't think Hahn will be doing that either unless he thinks he's fleecing someone. So basically thats 3 factors that say add as much talent as you can this year : 1. Protected 1st round pick 2. Low payroll 3. Lack of tradeable assets outside of the core and prospects. This is not an " All In " approach as some have labled it. It's just the most logical conclusion to come to when looking at factors that matter. Signing Victor Martinez is the definition of an all-in move, because not only are you committing a significant portion of your payroll dollars, but you're committing them to a guy who is highly likely to produce diminishing returns over the life of the contract, because players in any sport tend to age like milk after 35, with the rare exception that usually ends up in a Hall of Fame. Further, you're taking assets away from your farm system by signing him. Note that I am not advocating against signing free agents this offseason, nor am I advocating against a strategy that takes assets away from the farm system. My point is that the timing has to be right, and right now is not the right time.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Nov 6, 2014 -> 07:55 AM) Exactly. If the Sox wait til next years FA then its likely the Sox don't have a protected first rounder and then hind sighters come out saying the Sox shouldn't sign any top free agents because the last player they signed that cost a first round pick was Adam Dunn and we know how the song will go from there. If there's a year when the Sox should fill a few holes through FA, this is it. The more I hear about CarGo and his horrible contract, the more I like the idea of going after Rasmus who would give similar production, one year younger, cheaper and will not cost anyone from the farm teams. Rasmus AND VMart would add some very nice power from the left side and Rasmus is definitely an upgrade over Tank in LF. I would try to give the Yanks some competition with regards to Headley too. If the Sox aren't willing to spend on a few quality free agent bats and a reliever or two then they should stop with the " we think we can contend" bs because there's no friggin way they will without spending the money. Then comes another season of excuses starting with " attendance is down and the whole bleeding heart bag o bs. The only player on your list I wouldn't pursue is Martinez because he has a QO, and he's old and will get WAY too much on the Free Agent market.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Nov 6, 2014 -> 06:53 AM) Next year our 1st round pick might not be protected so if you want a premium hitter or 2 which comes attached with a qualifying offer then your giving up a 1st rd. draft pick. If we get a premium hitter or 2 this year. we give up a 2nd and 3rd round draft pick. Also if you target some of those guy above will it not impact the Sox ability to get those guys next year since you have now occupied much of the payroll flexilbilty ? If we're going to make moves for premium talent then this is the ideal year for it. I disagree. I think that because this team is at least a full season away from contention no matter what they do, they might as well stock up the farm system as much as possible this year while also building toward a contender. Yes, it means losing a higher pick next year in all likelihood, however, when you're shifting toward contention, building the farm becomes less of a concern, though it should still exist as a concern.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 5, 2014 -> 07:24 PM) I think the site is still battling on who to target this offseason. Yes, but I was asked rationally to defend my position, so I figured I'd oblige. Really this year should still be about finding value, while next year could bring splash moves and contention. That's just my opinion, of course.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Nov 5, 2014 -> 09:12 AM) For those of you who advocate not spending big now, but rather continuing to rebuild, with an eye toward 2016, exactly what would you do? Who would you try to acquire now? Who would you target for 2016? Glad you asked Q1) What would you do? A1) I would target players who didn't get QOs and try to get 75% or so of the value of the players who did get QOs with 50% or less of the per year money, and 25-35% of the overall contract commitment. In doing so, I also give myself another full year of building the farm system as I don't lose my second round pick and the related slot allocation from my bonus pool. Q2) Who would you try to acquire? A2) Markakis, Headley, LaRoche, McCarthy, Billingsley, Miller, Duke, and Hochevar are examples of players I would target. None have a QO, and all could make impact contributions in 2015 and 2016. Q3) Who would you target in 2016? A3) A lot of that would depend on how the 2015 season worked out, but likely a premium hitter, maybe two, possibly a pen arm, and defense. That is, provided, of course, that I got at least one hitter, one 3-4 level starter, and at least two pen arms this off-season.

Three points I've seen here that I'd like to address: -"If you go after Martinez, you can go after other guys with a QO." Sure, but I doubt the White Sox are willing to add $100 million to the payroll, and that's close to what it would take to get to a team that would be considered favorites for the division. -"If Martinez comes at the right price, I'm on board." Me too! In fact, let's just skip this whole "free agency" process and bring him on at 2/$20. -"Martinez will still be performing at 39." Really?! Well, hell, forget 2/$20, let's sign him up for 4/$30 (don't want to take too much risk). Glad to know we now have ways to predict player performance 4 years out, though.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 3, 2014 -> 02:11 PM) Are you really suggesting that you wouldn't sign a player like Sandoval because of Conor Gillaspie? Don't get me wrong, I like Sandoval and would want him on my team. That said, Sandoval is a left handed hitting 3B who struggles to hit lefties and whose performance has trended downward the last few years. Basically, he's Conor Gillaspie with a slightly better bat and much better glove. To me, that's a fairly marginal upgrade, and considering Gillaspie is a cost controlled asset and Sandoval is looking for $100 million over 6-7 years...I don't think Sandoval is going to be worth 3 more WAR per year than Gillaspie over the next 4-5 years. There are bigger holes to fill, like LF, 2-3 spots in the bullpen, and a mid rotation starter. For the price you'd pay for Sandoval, you could have something like Markakis and a solid pen arm or LaRoche and Billingsley instead. Like Balta said, if this were an 85+ win team, and 3B was the biggest hole, it would make sense to go after Sandoval. With this team, it makes no sense.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Nov 2, 2014 -> 01:22 PM) Have you noticed that the "top prospect" has not reached AAA yet and he has struggled defensively playing SS at A and AA levels??? I'm surprised no one else responded to this with all the prospect junkies on here. Anyway, Anderson fractured his right wrist in late June or early July, and still in his age 21 season mashed High A pitching to the tune of 120 wRC+, then AFTER the wrist injury, earned a promotion to AA where in a very small sample size (10 games), he mashed AA pitching to the tune of a 143 wRC+. QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Nov 2, 2014 -> 03:57 PM) So when do you contend ? How do you fill holes by doing nothing or spending on even riskier FA's or trading for the same types. They all have their baggage whether its, injuries or coming off bad seasons , or age. Get VMart , see if you can pry Michael Saunders from Seattle sign a starter and a closer put Bassitt in the pen or let him and Rodon start . VMart, fixed bullpen and a cheap Saunders seems doable . If you skimp anywhere let it be the starting pitching and look to build value with Danks, Noesi and Bassitt. The best way to do it is a steady building approach. In 2013, they won 63 games. In 2014, they won 73 games. You'd like to see a similar level of improvement in 2015, then move into full contention mode in 2016. Doing it that way will likely allow the team to hang on to its young, cost controlled assets and not make dumb decisions that they'll regret in the prime years of their contention window like giving a 36 year old a 4 year deal worth $18+ million per year. QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 2, 2014 -> 04:21 PM) Although I don't like the Martinez option...I'd very much prefer Martinez to Headley (and I think Headley is going to get a lot more than Martinez). Up until you said this, I'd agreed with pretty much everything you'd said. Martinez is going to get $18+ million per year, Headley should be $15 million or under, even with the Yankees bidding on him.

QUOTE (AlSoxfan @ Nov 2, 2014 -> 10:21 AM) I'd rather see the Sox spend the money on Sandoval or Martin or one of the big 3 pitchers than Martinez. I'm not a big fan of DH only players. Unless the team goes yankeesk an buys up all the top FA's with a 160/70m payroll, I'm out on Martinez. Rasmus might not be a bad pickup for a Yr. or 2 an Gregerson may not be good in our park but we do need bullpen help an he at least stays healthy. Aoki might not be a bad bet either. We really need to look for defensive upgrades an bullpen help. I strongly believe a better defense will make our pitchers better. If you sign Sandoval, you're practically committing yourself to trading Gillaspie since Sandoval is a better version of Gillaspie. Headley, Markakis, and Cruz would likely be my top 3 FA targets.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Nov 2, 2014 -> 08:59 AM) a)Do not trade our top prospects. We will be in the position we are in 2 years from now probably without a playoff appearance if we do that. The farm simply isn't there yet. It's improving quickly though. b)No rents that cost any talent to acquire - ridiculous for a 73 win team. c)No good prospects for veterans off of bad years unless at a severe discount. d)Get a good reliever(s). "Proven closer" Closer is not that important. Petricka and Putnam, both virtual rookies, have the stones to close and are likely to improve. Sox need 7th and 8th inning guys to get out of jams. e)Be wary of giving up top draft choices for a FA. The hit rate for #1s is higher than people think, if the club does a good job scouting. This actually is a good year to do it, if a player warrants it. Otherwise, looks okay. a) I think the primary talent acquisition route for the White Sox this off-season will be free agency, however, if, for example, the Braves are offering up Justin Upton for a song, I think you have to jump on that. b) see a c) see a d) Closer is not that important? I just simply disagree with that. e) The highest draft choice the Sox can lose is their second rounder. That said, I think I put together a fairly decent roster under my second strategy without signing a player who got a QO. Thanks for sharing.

This is more of a strategy than a prediction. It was meant to go in the Offseason plan thread, but that was closed, so this is the closest thing to that that I can find... If I were Hahn, I would target the following players in Free Agency, in order of importance, ranked in categories of hitters, relievers, and starters: Hitters 1) OF Melky Cabrera - He's a solid hitter, and would fill a hole in LF with a productive hitter who could hit near the top of the lineup and provide a tough out in front of Abreu as well as a little pop. He will likely go for a higher price tag than what I would have the White Sox give him, and Toronto will likely make a high level effort to keep him, but he would be a good bat to have in the lineup. 2) OF Nick Markakis - I've seen comparisons of Markakis on this board to Alejandro De Aza, and if you completely ignore the value in walking more, striking out about half as much, and having much better defense, they're valid comparisons. If you consider these things to be valuable, though, you can see why Markakis is generally the more valuable player by .5-1.5 WAR. Markakis is a solid bat with some power from the left side that is likely to hit the market and get something in the range of 3-4 years and $30-48 million, making him an affordable option. 3) OF Nelson Cruz - If you want to provide Jose Abreu protection in the lineup, there won't be a better 4 hitter on the market than Cruz. His 40 HRs would certainly give opponents a reason to give Abreu more pitches to hit, and he'll obviously get his own production as well. He likely will have a very high price tag, and Baltimore will be making every effort to keep him, but if they can get him on a 3 year deal, he would appreciably improve the White Sox lineup. 4) 3B Chase Headley - I'm not a big believer in Gillaspie, but I do think if his defense is not factored in, he could be a valuable piece. If you can get Headley, it upgrades the defense and provides a switch hitter with the potential to be a middle of the lineup bat, which at worst would be a 6 or 7 hitter. He'll likely get a contract in the same range as Markakis, which to me makes him affordable to the White Sox 5) 1B Adam LaRoche - The White Sox need left handed power, and LaRoche would provide that, though the downside would be that he would pretty much be the DH. If he can be had on a 2 year deal for a reasonable price, it wouldn't be a bad acquisition, and he could provide Abreu some protection in the lineup. Relievers 1) CL Francisco Rodriguez - The White Sox need a closer, and if they miss out on Robertson, K-Rod would be the best option on the market. His HR rate and declining K rate are concerning, however. 2) RP Luke Gregerson - He has either improved or stayed at the same level of performance every season he's been in MLB, and he has shown closing ability in limited use. Seems like the White Sox also currently have him on their radar. 3) CL Casey Janssen - Prior to 2014, has had some very impressive numbers as a closer, then his performance fell off drastically last year, though he was still successful in save situations. This might be a bounceback candidate that could provide good value. 4) RP Andrew Miller - Miller is a guy who might be able to close, and would definitely fill a need for a left handed arm in the White Sox bullpen. He has impressive peripherals, which likely means he will command a premium on the market, and while some don't see him as worth it, I think he might be depending on what the end cost would be. 5) RP Sean Burnett - Quality left handed arm that could work the 6th or 7th. It seems as though he could be had for relatively cheap as well. 6) RP Zach Duke - This is the type of player that can provide great value. He had a great year last year that pretty much came out of nowhere. This means that if he hits the market, he will probably get a "prove it" type of deal, which could mean getting 2-3 years of a low end cost reliever that could give you a much higher value, potentially even a late inning type of reliever. He also fills a need by being a left handed bullpen arm. 7) RP Tim Stauffer - Could be a very high quality right handed reliever, doesn't allow many HR (though Petco likely plays into that), strikes out a little over 9 per 9 and has about a 3:1 K:BB rate. 8) RP Tom Gorzelanny - He would provide a left handed reliever that could potentially be a late inning reliever. He has nearly 10 K/9, a good ground ball rate, and doesn't allow many HRs. He also probably won't get a premium contract on the market, so is likely a good target. 9) RP Luke Hochevar - Why not? He had TJ surgery, but that means he'll come cheap because he's an unknown at this point. If he can regain most of his previous form, he could be a steal. Starters 1) RHP Chad Billingsley - If he can recover from injury, he will likely provide 2 starter value at 3-4 starter price. T2) RHP Brandon McCarthy - He's a quality starter who can give you quality innings, even if he's not going to give you 200. He's worth a #3 starter contract for 2-3 years. T2) RHP Ervin Santana - He's put up #2-4 starter numbers for around 200 innings in 4 of the last 5 seasons. There's not much buzz around him, either, he could be a good value signing. After identifying the targets, the next step would be to choose a strategy. The way I see it, the options are: 1) Add a lot of payroll and attempt to compete for a playoff spot in 2015. To do this, I see 6-7 new acquisitions as necessary, which means an additional $50-60 million in payroll. 2) Make a few additions to improve in 2015 with the goal being consistently competing for the playoffs for 2016 and beyond. This would still take acquiring 3-5 new players and adding $30-45 million in payroll My ideal roster under strategy #1 (new additions in bold): Lineup CF Eaton LF Cabrera 1B Abreu DH Cruz/LaRoche RF Garcia SS Ramirez 2B Semien 3B Gillaspie C Flowers Bench - Viciedo, Sanchez, Phegley, Danks Rotation 1) Sale 2) Q 3) Billingsley 4) Noesi 5) Danks Bullpen CL Rodriguez Gregerson Miller Putnam Petricka Guerra Bassitt My ideal roster under strategy #2 (new additions in bold): Lineup CF Eaton 2B Semien 1B Abreu LF Garcia RF Markakis SS Ramirez 3B Headley DH Gillaspie/Viciedo (depending on opposing SP) C Flowers Bench - Sanchez, Phegley, Danks Rotation 1) Sale 2) Q 3) Billingsley 4) Noesi 5) Bassitt Bullpen Gregerson Petricka Putnam Guerra Duke Stauffer Danks Personally, I like the second option better, as I think it plays out better for the long run, and gives the team some flexibility in trading pieces like Gillaspie, Viciedo, etc. that might bring a decent return in a package without forcing the team's hand. Also, I've pretty much accepted that the White Sox are going to have to eat Danks's contract, and with Bassitt potentially being capable of being a quality starter, I'd much rather see if that can play out than try to dump $5-10 million of Danks's contract. If you sign Billingsley and he performs, you figure out Bassitt can provide at least 3 starter quality, and Rodon takes Noesi's rotation spot, that is a highly cost controlled, extremely effective rotation. Pair it with an offense that can put up decent numbers, a bullpen that doesn't consist of a gas can and matches, and a defense that can perform at at least an average level, and you have a postseason competitor. The above only considers free agency, mostly because trades are very difficult to predict. That said, looking at trades, my top targets would be: 1) Braves players - Apparently Atlanta wants to get rid of Justin Upton and Evan Gattis, and would be willing to listen to offers on Jason Heyward. All 3 of these players would look very good in a White Sox uniform immediately. 2) Reds players - The Reds are apparently looking to rebuild, and have several players that would be interesting in a trade. Jay Bruce, Mat Latos, Mike Leake, and Aroldis Chapman are all names I would be interested in being involved in a trade. I would say Cueto, but he is likely untouchable, or would require too much to get. Realistically, Chapman likely is similarly situated as well. 3) Justin Morneau - He can likely be had for cheap, looks like he's rounding into his pre-injury form, and would make a great LH power bat behind Abreu. 4) Ben Zobrist - Apparently Tampa wants to trade him, and his ability to play most defensive positions well and hit well from both sides of the plate are very attractive. Also allows some flexibility in trading Alexei and being able to bridge the gap to Anderson. Thoughts?

QUOTE (LDF @ Oct 24, 2014 -> 10:40 AM) as in my other response to your post, who will be the trading partner. Whoever you want. For example, a lot of people have mentioned Heyward and Upton, is there a (or several different) combination(s) of players there that could net that return in realistic estimation? Or the Reds, a lot of people have talked about Jay Bruce, and they also have a lot of interesting starters and relievers. Is there a package there that could get, say, Bruce and Latos/Leake? Or, even more (probably impossibly) ambitious, those two and Chapman?

So I asked about this list of players earlier as far as what they could get for a return if packaged: Conor Gillaspie Dayan Viciedo Carlos Sanchez Micah Johnson Chris Bassitt Tyler Danish Chris Beck Francellis Montas And this discussion of these Braves players is an example of why. Could any group of players off that list net the return people are looking for? Or perhaps an interesting group of players from the Reds?

Just out of curiosity, for this group of players packaged any way you would like to package, what do you think possible return(s) would be: Conor Gillaspie Dayan Viciedo Carlos Sanchez Micah Johnson Chris Bassitt Tyler Danish Chris Beck Francellis Montas

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 29, 2014 -> 12:53 PM) Chase Headley playing the majority of time in LF is not a solid idea. He is a GG like 3B. QUOTE (Vance Law @ Sep 29, 2014 -> 02:13 PM) The one thing he is best at on the baseball field is 3B defense. If we got Headley, he should be starting at 3rd. Conor then should be traded or part of a DH platoon and backup 3B/1B. You can hope for Headley to return to form at the plate, but if you're one of the people who was unimpressed with Gillaspie's offense, you're sure not going to like Headley putting up another .700 OPS at 3B. Okay, then platoon Conor in LF, stick Headley at 3B, and Viciedo and Gillaspie split LF and DH. Or if they get Markakis as well, Avi moves to LF, Gillaspie and Viciedo split DH and back up corner OF and corner IF.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Sep 28, 2014 -> 02:20 PM) The debate over V Mart is all about 1) his guessed cost, and 2) whether or how fast he will decline as a hitter. What seems to be missing is any discussion of the overall fit and what the alternatives might be. - The Sox MUST have lefty power. At the moment they have NONE. - The Sox really need someone to slot behind Abreu, to keep him from being pitched around. - The Sox would be better with fewer high strikeout guys in their lineup. V Mart fills all of these needs. And what are the alternatives on the FA market? For all those railing against V Mart, what other lefty free agent can we sign who is (1) younger, (2) just as consistent throughout his career, and (3) cheaper than V Mart? That player likely does not exist, or we would be debating him instead of V Mart. ************* As much as I want the Sox to take Victor Martinez away from the Tigers, the more important area of the team the Sox need to fix is the bullpen. Martinez's bat isn't going to make a 15-game swing in the standings. Nor would adding an impact right hander. But fixing the bullpen could. And if we DON'T fix the bullpen, it won't matter what else we do, because our bullpen will continue blowing games at an alarming rate. Nick Markakis or Chase Headley seem like better solutions to me. Both will be cheaper, both are younger, and both have the ability to hit for power. Headley is actually perfect for this team because he could take the starts at 3B vs. LHP and start in LF vs. RHP. In fact, I'd rather the Sox use $25 million per year to sign those two than use $20 million per year to sign Martinez. It will pay a lot bigger dividends both short term and long term.

raBBit, since I cannot quote your post, if you read the WHOLE thread, you'll notice that my FIRST example of an aging decline was Paul Konerko, and my SECOND example of an aging decline was Magglio Ordonez. To the naysayers, Konerko's decline was ONLY because of injury, and now according to you, Ordonez's decline was ONLY because he was a steroid user. So I am asking, how many good hitters do I need to find who fell off the face of the Earth performance wise before age 37 for you and all the other naysayers to believe that it's a trend? I think the fact that the first two I examined had an almost identical decline pattern speaks volumes on the issue, but I'm curious how many it would take to show that signing Martinez is a bad idea?

QUOTE (raBBit @ Sep 27, 2014 -> 07:08 PM) Your prime example for your point was an obvious steroid user. What's your point? Paul Konerko was an obvious steroid user? How many examples do you need before you will acknowledge it's a trend?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 27, 2014 -> 04:23 PM) Are you. Check out some of the names I mentioned earlier in the thread. To say every ages the same way is the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. If Victor has some sort of condition that would lead one to believe he cannot remain healthy for 3 seasons, then I would agree with you. But to say, Konerko fell apart after injury at 36, Maggs got hurt and dropped off a cliff at 36, therefore, everyone should drop off a cliff at 36 makes no sense. Look at Edgar Martinez's numbers. Look at Harold Baines' numbers. Look at Frank Thomas, Jim Thome....these guys were mostly DH's which is where Victor will mostly be. Show me the trend. You mentioned 4 guys who are at least borderline for the Hall of Fame. Thank you for making my point that unless Victor Martinez becomes a Hall of Fame caliber player, the team who signs him for 3/$60 is going to regret it. Also, please quit overexaggerating. No one is saying don't sign anyone over 30. Signing people over the age of 35 to huge contracts is a bad idea in general, which is and has been my point.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 27, 2014 -> 02:54 PM) .306/.373/.848 for his career. An average hitter this year is .251/.314/.701. I think he is a bit better than above average. He is a great hitter. His career split line and Magglio's career split line are almost identical. Magglio Ordonez Age 36 Season Slash Line: .303/.378/.852 Magglio Ordonez Age 37 Season Slash Line: .255/.303/.634 Magglio Ordonez Age 38 Season Slash Line: Not Available I'm sensing a trend here.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Sep 27, 2014 -> 11:44 AM) When talking about the free agent market?? What young FA are we gonna acquire? Because Russell Martin is a few years younger he won't break his Wrist and decline? It can't happen to Billy Butler because he's 29? If they go cheap on hitting and go big on pitching, none of those guys are at risk to tommy john or something like that? There's a risk in every player you sign. There MAY be a bigger risk in VMart, but there's also MAY be a much bigger reward. I don't care about the Tigers. I want the Sox to put out a team that can beat the Tigers, not worry about them having bad contracts. ...... Sox have Abreu for 2 more discounted years then he probably gets real expensive. Couple that with the Sale and Q contracts and the Sox are in a good position to take a "risk" on a guy like VMart. Even at 20M for the first 2 years the payroll is still only gonna be in the 80M range, and with an addition like Martinez I fully expect the Sox to go "all in" and the payroll to be back over 100M. Martinez wouldn't cripple the Sox at all. I said the same thing about Cano last year with a 25M a year contract. An injury decline is a risk that can't be mitigated, but an age decline risk can be mitigated...by not signing someone who will be 36 to start next season. Obviously there's a risk to every player that can be signed, but that risk increases with age and with dollars spent on the player. This is why I think it would be stupid to sign ANY 36 year old to a 3 year/$60 million deal. The risk factor is far too high.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Sep 27, 2014 -> 11:06 AM) That could be said about anyone though really. No, it can't. Not everyone has the age factor working against them. You want to affect the Tigers' ability to compete using Victor Martinez? Let them resign him and pile up more bad contracts.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Sep 27, 2014 -> 03:53 AM) Or have one small wrist injury and then it snowballs because of his age. I would have figured Paulie to age better than VMart, but as has been said everything people are saying about Martinez could have been said about Konerko. In the first half of 2012, Paulie looked like he had a HoF push left in him. 500 homers at the least. Then injury. And give me a break with bringing up Fisk. He's one of the all-time great catchers and a baseball legend. He is not the standard. Could not have put it better myself. If Martinez were 32, I'd be on board with signing him for 3-4 years. However, because he's 36, unless he ends up being a hall of famer, whoever signs him to his next contract is going to regret it. I don't really want the White Sox to gamble with $20 million of payroll for the next 3+ years that Victor Martinez will end up in the top 1% of the top 1% of players in baseball history. It's a safer bet than the alternative, especially since that $20 million can be spread out to 3 or 4 good players.