Balta1701

So they're quoting a guy talking about cheating who actually made Josh Donaldson correct when he yelled "it's not sticky any more" at him?

Nothing other than the risk of having no starting SS on the roster if Anderson gets a better offer somewhere else (or frankly, if he wants to leave and is willing to take less money to do so - and for a reminder this has happened to a White Sox player recently). This could lead them to having to sign a different SS, perhaps one they can't necessarily say "allows them to compete next year".

For Vaughn, yeah I don't believe there's a strong justification for moving him. His value right now is "backup 1b", you might as well wait to see if he does anything next year before we talk about non-tendering him after 2024. For Eloy, there is some potential benefit in clearing out the contract, and I do believe his contract is still movable.

Where is this new culture coming from?

I agree. Go to town.

You can say that if they have 3 losses. 1-2 with 1 game to play isn’t a pattern in this sport. The Braves went 1-2 against the White Sox with a ‘27 Yankees offense. If the team with the buy won 66% of the games, there would be plenty of years where they went 2-2.

Houston? Verlander’s shutout start?

We call this rooting for the meteor.

If you’re not going to open the roof when it is 76 degrees, with low humidity and light clouds, don’t pay for the retractable roof.

As is typical in the offseason, somewhere I think you're missing a few million, if Clevinger is retained and goes to $12 million I would have them at $123 million before the arb guys, (not counting $1 million for Abreu that was deferred in his last deal). This doesn't change the conclusion that they have money to spend.

Whether these items are related or just coincidence based on when he has been moved to this position I do not know, but I do find it worth adding that his career OPS as a DH is .739.

I will definitely admit this was a significant improvement and IIRC somewhere in this thread I was begging him to just throw the ball into the area of Moore and let him make a few plays so it's darn nice to see this happening. They have better weapons this year than last year, so he does need to make use of them. He's got to both keep it up and show up against better defenses though, if you want to think about this as a long term option.

This is a lot better than where we were 2 weeks ago, but there's a couple things worth keeping in mind: 1. We have seen Fields put up good numbers the last 2 weeks against teams that aren't particularly strong, both are in the bottom 10 defensively in yards/game, so the games against better defenses in the Saints and Lions later this year will be particularly telling. 2. The other factor to keep in mind if you have an opportunity to draft Williams with either of those picks is the contract extension. This offseason, Fields will be a free agent in 2 years, so either next year or the following year you are going to have to commit a contract extension to him if you aren't picking up someone else. The Daniel Jones model suggests that the salary for keeping a middling QB on their 2nd deal right now is $40 million a year. If you were to trade that pick and go with Fields based on this performance, you better be confident enough to extend him. If you're not confident enough to extend him, then trying to trade him to a team that thinks their close (Saints, Bucs, Falcons, apparently the entire NFC South it seems) and pick up a mid or late first round pick looks like the smartest option to me. You continue the rebuild with Williams and you let a team take a 2-3 year attempt to compete with Fields before they fully commit to extending him.

Are you counting Hendriks or assuming they opt out of that? If you opt out of Anderson, Hendriks, and Clevinger, they're at $102 million before pre-arb guys. If you keep Anderson (my guess is they keep him), they're at $115. I wouldn't be surprised if they found a way to turn Hendriks's option into a 2 year deal that keeps him around a little bit longer, and that might take this starting point over $120 million, but there's still a ton of money to spend here.

I can't say what they will do...but they absolutely do have room to add significant salary if they want to. Their payroll right now is somewhere close to $100 million, depending on exact arb numbers and such, and that's quite low for them. When they were "competing" in 2015-2016 they pushed to over $120 million, and when they were "Competing" in 2022 and 2023 they pushed their payroll to $190 and $180 million. I would expect something of a payroll drop since attendance, ratings, and presumably advertising sales have collapsed, but even a payroll of $140 million leaves them with tens of millions of dollars to spend.

I can't believe Crochet is already arb-eligible. They did not use his pre-arb years particularly well. Personally I wouldn't pay that for Toussaint either.

Pro side: Cronenworth has 2 4WAR seasons in 2021 and 2022. He is affordably under team control for the next 7 seasons. Is versatile and helps at positions of need. Cons: next year will be his age 30 season and he has 7 years and $76 million remaining on his deal so this would be a big salary dump. He dropped to a 1 WAR season last year so you are hoping your coaches can help him get back to form. He broke his wrist last year and people seem thrilled to use that as an excuse for poor hitting whenever they can. Verdict: if they think they’re competitive next year this is the kind of gamble that could work and they need some gambles to work out, also would do what Getz said and make them more athletic. If you believe me and they need to be looking 2 or 3 years down the road this type of deal would be a potentially big problem as you’d be stuck with a guy who has money lasting until he’s 36 on a team that can’t afford anything.

Part of the point in doing these "Tanks" is supposed to be that you get enough quality internal options who are cheap that you can afford the FA spending. The pitcher who they just threw - Aaron Nola - one of their "tank" pieces. They were able to afford guys like Harper because guys like Nola weren't FAs yet.

"Signs of life"? Come on man, Touki had an ERA near 5 and that almost perfectly matches his career marks. His WHIP almost matches his career marks. He is a guy who on a normal team is an 8th or 9th starter option, he fills in when your actual backup plans are used up because he's been hanging out on some team's minor league roster and he can be claimed or picked up easily and he has a bit of experience. Urena had a 4.1 ERA with the White Sox thanks in part to a .250 BABIP in 26 innings - he's in the same boat. They did how they normally do, give them enough innings and they wind up with an ERA of about 5 and your team doesn't fall apart on day 1 from them. But neither of them deserve anything other than the small paycheck they got for filling that role, there's no compliment to the pitching coach for 9th starters coming in and putting up ERAs around 5.

“Ethan Katz contributed to Joe Kelly being below league average” is exactly why I’m saying Katz’s time should end.

Benintendi hit .262 with 45 RBI, Grandal had 8 HR and 33 RBI in half a season, Moncada hit .260 with 11 HR in half a season, Andrus hit .251 with 44 RBIs in about 400 at bats, Gavin Sheets had 10 HR and 43 RBI in 311 at bats so he was on pace for 76 RBI when Vaughn’s 80 RBI was strong and solid. People seemed to like Remillard. Colas was crap sure, and Anderson, but these guys put up the HR, RBI, and batting average you asked for.

One more - if these guys were fine offensively because of batting averages and home runs and RBIs and Robert was elite (actually true) and Burger was the best thing since meat was put between sliced bread, how was the White Sox’s offense so bad the whole year?

After the last 2 years I'd say that asserting any player on the White Sox is not a clubhouse problem is a truly bold, bewildering statement.