TheHammer

Our offense was better last season than it was the first two months of this season. In June our offense has been excellent thanks mostly to Konerko and Dye and Frank hitting the cover off the ball. But for those first two months our offense was worse than last season regardless of the inconsistencies. We won because of pitching those two months, we had some clutch hitting too, but mostly the pitching is what we have relied on to win. We had a poor starting staff last season when compared to what it is this season. Loaiza wasn't good, Garland wasn't half of what he is now, and the 5th spot was obviously a loss just about every time out. The consistent offense is good but weren't winning games because of offense early this year. Also I would like to note that Carlos Lee was probably our most consistent hitter last season hitting over .300 every month except April when he hit like .265. Also why are we more consistent on offense this season? I think its because Ozzie is making us manufacture some runs more often so when we don't get the HRs we can still score and he has done it with the whole lineup, not just Pods. It has been something Ozzie has instilled with the whole club and we would be more willing to manufacture regardless of who is leading off. Pods has literally given us 56 runs (from scoring and driving in, kind of an unorthadox way to look at it I know) and has 2 SHs. The runs he has literally plated is 5th on the team and 2 SHs is average. Really Pods has been kind of an average contributor to us scoring runs as it has turned out. He doesn't grab a lot of total bases so he isn't efficient in driving in runs even when they are out there to be driven in. Even if he hit .400 with RISP he wouldn't drive in a ton because singles just don't drive in runs in large amounts. So why doesn't he score a ton of runs (He is on pace for like 90 which is solid but nothing great). Well he has a .363 OBP but effectively he has about a .325 OBP because he has been CS/picked off 9 times. So he isn't on for Everett, Konerko, Aaron, or Frank to drive in as often as some people think. Then you might say well he has 36 steals, well those steals are great but look at the guy below him in steals, Figgins who has 23. Figgins has 13 fewer steals but he has 5 HRs, 6 triples, and 11 doubles. Podsednik has 10 doubles and no other extra base hits. These steals are making up for the fact that Podsednik hasn't produced crap for extra base hits ( I'm guessing he is last in the majors among starters who have say 200 ABs or so). Pods has 77 total bases, thats pretty bad but the amazing thing is of the 5 guys in the American league with 77 total bases Pods has scored 16 more runs than the next highest. And obviously this is because of his base running ability. Not only steals, but just being fast enough to take extra bases that other players don't have the physical ability to take. Pods has the potential to be such a dominant player. If he could start getting some extra base hits like he did in 2003 he would cross homeplate so much more often than he does. But until he reverts back to his 2003 form he can't compare to what Carlos Lee does for an offense. Even considering how his threat of stealing has helped Iguchi.

QUOTE(danman31 @ Jun 24, 2005 -> 12:42 AM) Wow, I'm sorry you live in a square box where HRs is all that wins ballgames. Pods is more valuable to this team than he was the Brewers and visa versa for the Brewers. Just because the Brewers benifitted from the deal doesn't mean the Sox lost on the deal. Our team is winning because of pitching and clutch hitting and an aggressive style. I have been a little disappointed in Pods because I was hoping he would revert to his 2003 form and he has not. He only hits singles it seems. Fortunately he has done a very good job just finding ways to get on base. I knew he would steal a lot of bases if he was run a lot, that shouldn't be surprising to anyone. If we could trade Pods for Lee and keep every other player the same we would be better this season I believe. Don't forget that Lee is a very good athlete and could steal 30 bags in a season if given the chance, plus the massive amounts of runs he produces that Pods won't. Now arguing the trade in terms of how it freed up money is a different story because you never know who we would have ended up getting if we didn't make the trade, but at least that is an angle with some real solid evidence that it could have been a good trade. HRs, btw, will win more ballgames than stolen bases for instance. If you get the pitching any style of offense can win ballgames. Carlos Lee produces more offense than Scott Podsednik and I think that is fairly obvious. If we had this pitching last season we almost certainly would have won the central and could have possibly won 100 games even with our inconsistent offense. Hell we won plenty of games earlier this season when our offense was consistently not very good. I think people look at Pods as kind of the poster boy for Ozzieball so the natural tendency would be to overrate his impact. He has been a good leadoff hitter, but is not the big difference in our team from last season to this season.

Well you can complain if you want you know. Carlos Lee is a better baseball player than Pods is so obviously some people will be upset with the deal.

Its also kind of pointless to add up all those winshares against Lee like we wouldn't have played with a catcher or 2B or another starter. We would have signed a 5th starter regardless and we would have probably picked up another reliever and starter at 2B or catcher. The idea that KW is willing right now to add payroll which I believe to be true also makes it seem very possible that we might have been able to grab all those players if he thought it would make us a playoff team. Of course if Pods would start hitting like he did two seasons ago, people really wouldn't complain about the trade.

Stop pretending like we wouldn't have signed any of those guys if Lee wasn't dealt.

No I'm not and that was something you could and should have asked privately. That was a b**** move. Especially if the person you are referring to isn't here because he was kicked off or something. I apologize for calling it a b**** move if that person you are referring to was revered like a god. I do not recall you asking this before, or at least I didn't read it. It is also subjective to say Michael Jordan was better than Stacey King. I am considering his career in Kansas City and this season. I will say Randa will be markedly better because he has been markerdly better than Crede since Crede became a starter. If you adjusted for park I am sure the difference would be much more profound. A second ago you took KW's word that he was not interested in swapping for a starter but would add a piece if it could help. Now you are citing someone who claims they made a lucrative offer for Chavez. You are right sports writers don't know what they are talking about. Anyway, since I am sure we don't know if KW would make the move so maybe we should stick to asking whether he should make the move. The you can't be serious is referring to the idea that he is somehow something less than he is because he signed with the Reds. Like a good player can't sign with a "Non-contender". I meant you can't be serious that the thought of no contenders wanted him entered your head. I doubt there is a team that would take him. But he obviously wasn't going to sign somewhere where he couldn't start. Crede has always had very limited range to his left, do you honestly not notice this? His range factor stats are average, Randa's are well above average and he has come up with big plays against us the last 5 years or so at the hot corner. As for the SS/3B relationship a good 3B is actually going to have more effect on the SS because any ball the 3B can get he gets taking chances away from the SS. Certainly the stat is not perfect and can mislead, but in this case it says Crede's range is nothing to brag about and that plays out on the field. And even in your example that only shows how range factor can underscore your range so even considering its imperfections it seems that it is probably accurate in stating Randa still possesses good range. Less realistic than this would be, claiming that Stacey King was better than Michael Jordan. Although it is subjective there is no good argument for one over the other. Is there a good argument that Crede is a better hitter than Randa? I don't think so. Is there a good argument that Crede is a better executer than Randa? I can't see a good one. Is there a good argument that Crede is a better defender than Randa? Maybe, this one is clearly closer than the other two. But I think the thing most are thinking is I know Crede is above average so Randa is probably not quite as good. I see two good glove men one who has good range and one has does not. I guess anything is debateable, but sometimes one side of a debate is obviously wrong. I don't know if we should trade Crede for Randa if given the chance but I do know that Randa is a better player and I am very confident he would improve the team for this season at least. I would honestly rather Crede just keep hitting .300 like he did in April and like he is doing now and not make the trade, but Crede keeping up his hitting seems unrealistic. I would also like to keep Crede for sentimental reasons. Now stop making me write long responses my fingers are hurtin for certain.

I guess techinically it is subjective, but lets be realistic, Crede has limited range at third and Randa has good range. The bad back and worse foot seem to be overstated from you as he is having a career year and has started 60 games. There really is no "he may not be." I think thats where we look at this differently. Randa IS a better hitter, he IS a better executer, and he IS a better defender. Right now all these things are true and they have played out to be true over throughout the years and this season. Thia isn't like taking a guy from Japan or taking a guy who looks great in the minors where its unknown whether they can play at this level. We do know that Randa is better, that is not a debateable point in my mind becuase I don't see these players as relatively close at this point in their respective careers. You can't be serious.

QUOTE(JimH @ Jun 21, 2005 -> 12:38 PM) Not sure if you have read the countless times it's been posted as to why it does not make sense. I will try again but I suspect this topic will come up over and over. There will be reasons for and against any trade, the key is to weigh them and see if ultimately you can make yourself better. I don't tsee as a trade that brings in Randa for Crede would disrupt chemistry at all. Crede is one player of 25. He is not a leader on this team, he is just a young contributor. He fits in well with this group but I can't see how our chemistry will really be damaged by moving him. I look at this as a non-factor. This is a valid concern. I sure as hell wouldnt want to be stuck having to start Ozuna or Uribe at third for long periods of time. Defensively Randa is Crede with much beter range especially to his left. It is an upgrade in my opinion. Also, besides hitting 45 points higher which is a big deal Randa probably is as good as any third baseman in the game in bunting, moving runners along and executing sacrafices. The advantage of Randa is performance of the field. There is no doubt about that to me. He is a better baseball player than Crede. I also would guess Randa would be a 20-25 HR guy in this ballpark as well and being a fairly good RBI producer, it was only a couple years ago that he drove in 100 and he is good for 80 a season when healthy. Also it absolutely matters if Randa is great in the clubhouse, a trade may be a disruption but its not going to stop this team. Unless Randa is an enormous lockerroom cancer chemistry will be fine. I don't know if what a GM tells the public is ever really the truth. Anything is possible in my estimation. Yeah there are bigger needs but KW has no problems making multiple deals if he thinks it will help. Randa wouldn't cost much. This I think would be my biggest concern. Randa is 35 and Crede is 25. If we think Crede is going to be our 3B for a long time we should try to resign him and make that commitment. If we think he will probably leave when his contract expires and go in another direction I think we should make a trade for Randa if one is possible. We would get a very good player who fits our style of play perfectly who can play for a couple seasons until Fields is ready or e can sign someone else. I think Crede could be a good player and his youth makes me want to keep him. However, I also realize this season Randa would be a big upgrade towards a World Series run.

QUOTE(JUGGERNAUT @ Jun 20, 2005 -> 11:27 PM) Umm .. no Joe Randa is no Joe Crede defensively. Let's cut right thru the crap in this thread. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fieldi...lumn=zoneRating 2005 ZR Crede .826 (#3 in MLB) vs Randa .804 (#7) DP Crede 14 vs Randa 8 A Crede 117 vs Randa 106 How many times this year had Crede failed to field & deliver an accurate throw for a DP? How often have those players ended a threat in an inning? The best thing that can happen to Joe is to call up BorASS & say sayonara. The Sox like Crede & are willing to sign him to a lucrative multi-year deal to avoid arbitration. It's only going to help him in the long run if he does that. Randa is a better defensive 3B than Crede and has proven it for years. The guy has good range compared to Crede's average to poor range and is just as steady as Crede with the glove and with his arm.

The Dodgers have a legit gribe with the umpires strike zone today. Plus that call. Nice to see some things out of our control go our way.

These guys suck at pronouncing last names of our relievers

McCarthy was playing with fire a lot during the CUbs game. A lot of balls were hit hard right at people and he was taken out of the game after 78 pitches because it was very apparent that the Cubs were about to break through, and they did plate 3 runs the inning he left. He has given up 5 home runs in 10.1 innings for a reason. He has the ability to be effective in the big leagues but with that laser straight heater he is going to give up long balls aplenty.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Jun 19, 2005 -> 04:16 PM) Horray for one dimensional players. What have you done for me lately? Oh yeah, hit .235 w/ RISP and .171 w/ RISp and 2 outs Well lately he has been very good with runners in scoring position. In He is a very good hitter and I am glad we have him. I think with him beginning to take so many more walks than ever before he will end up with the best numbers of his career. Quite an accomplishment because he was really having problems with his swing early in the year. As for Crede and Ventura, well Ventura is a boarderline all-star caliber player and Crede is an average to below starting 3B. There is no comparison there. One thing to remember hitting 20-25 HRs when Ventura was a Sox is a better season than it is to hit 20-25 now. I think Robin was better in all phases of the game to be honest. And to be honest I like Crede and I hope he will improve and develop into a fine player in Chicago.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Jun 19, 2005 -> 05:12 PM) Let's just say no matter where we are playing this game will be easier on BMac than facing Texas anywhere. I doubt he will have much of a problem with KC but that's JMO. Until he gets some movement on his fastball he is going to have problems with everyone

QUOTE(JimH @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 05:14 PM) About the only place it turned into a big deal was here. Must've been a 15 page thread about it. To be truthful I didn't even know it happened until I read the original post in this thread and from that I came to the conclusion about it.

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 04:40 PM) What did you think when Konerko said Uribe shouldn't have deked Derrek Lee? I disagreed with him, I don't mind seeing some good gamesmanship. But in the end that wasn't a big deal either.

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 04:32 PM) Would you lose respect for Konerko for saying it? I gained respect for Konerko for saying it. He knew Royce was going to be completely grilled in Arizona for what happened. Paulie stood up for the guy, he knows these things happened people has bad games or plays or stretches. There is no reason for Juan to be upset about what Konerko said, none at all, and I don't think he is.

QUOTE(marsh @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 04:30 PM) Helton career wise is much better than Konerko. Helton careerwise is better than just about every 1B in the league today. He is one of those HOF career under the radar guys. I sympathize with how upset he was about those ridiculous steroid accusations he had to go through, what a bunch of garbage.

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 04:24 PM) Once again, you're not Uribe. You don't know how he feels about this. You just don't. We can say he feels one way, and you can say he feels another. Nobody can prove either way, but neither can say the other is wrong. You are right that it can't be proved. But it is ridiculous to act like it is a toss up 50/50 that the comment got under Uribe's skin. The whole idea behind this thread is far-fetched boardering on some conspiracy theory that Konerko's comments are really hidden shots at Uribe. I will say that if Uribe is really upset with the comment I would lose a little respect for him. But I am confident that he doesn't care. I will sleep well tonight!

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 04:02 PM) But did he say something specific was marking the start or is he just the usual head up the ass ESPN type crap. head up the ass

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 04:14 PM) You saying something like that is just as dumb as us saying otherwise. I don't think so. I think for the season and a half Uribe has been here he seems like a good guy with a good head on his shoulders. He doesn't seem like the vindictive, jealous, arrogant, small-minded type. And that is the type which would care about the comment made.

Is Frank Castillo available?

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 17, 2005 -> 03:42 PM) When someone says, "_____ is the best at something," that means he is better than everyone else. I don't care if Konerko didn't say that word for word that that Clayton is better than Uribe, he said it. You don't say that someone is better than your teammate, you just keep your mouth shut. It doesn't even matter if it's true. It was very obvious that in response to being asked about Clayton's miscues that Konerko wanted to defend a guy who will certainly get ripped by a lot of people so he said Clayton was the best SS he ever played with and he was talking about defense. You can say people are better than your teammates as long as the context is appropriate and it was in this case, as long as you aren't bashing your teammate. There is no unwritten rule against implying your current teammates are not the absolute best players you have ever suited up with. I can tell you this much, Uribe doesn't care about the comment. Ever hear our the phrase making a mountain out a molehill? It applies here. This thread is like Sox fans trying to cause drama for their own team, very strange.

I just caught the end of this anyone see the whole thing?

Man you guys sure like to talk about Royce Clayton a lot in this place