Soxman72

Thank you. Agreed. Save the critiques for after they sign, please.

This very well could be a real scenario. It seems the FO was frusturated, per the last conference call, and we all know they like to keep things quiet. An agent blowing them up could be what pushed the Sox over the edge. Unfortunately, welcome to the new world of big free agent negotiating. "Stay out of White Sox business!".

The media discussed it during the boring Winter Meetings. Either a winter trade deadline or a free agent deadline. Both get opened back up again, but you have to put urgency into signing. With social media and what fans are going through, this isn't good for the game, IMO.

It will be interesting to see when the opt outs are for each player. With a labor negotiation on the horizon and a possible work stoppage, the opt outs will be important. I think it will be a tell on the agents part on what they believe the future holds. Speaking of labor negotiations, a lot of things will be discussed, but how about a deadline for free agency..........

This goes back to earlier posts, if you don't think Twitter and fan sites are monitored, you are crazy. It's not Rick himself sitting at a computer, but lower staff members are. I am sure it's not influencing, but still informative.

It's obvious that the player and agent have high expectations and to this point, they have not been met. I assume Manny and his agent are not in a hurry. Why should they be? As long as Manny reports to a team by the report date, no issues (see JD Matinez). As that date draws near, prices will drop. Still weeks away. For the franchise, they are under a little more crunch. Fan conventions, season tickets, marketing, and merchandising are huge and to have the player signed sooner, is big. In my opinion, we are at a stare down and we will see who blinks first. All the leaking is part of the stare down. I think it's done soon, but we could see February. The only people that know for sure are the ones in the room. Everything else is speciation and controlled leaks from each side.

And in other news, water is wet. The union and other players expect free agents to take the top offer, so they can set the market for future players. The Jay and Alonso acquisitions are back up, just in case the offers are extremely similar. With this report and the Passan tweet, I think we are seeing the agent starting to sweat over the offers on the table. Not close to what they were expecting and the agent is trying to create one last ditch effort to gain more. I bet we are close to a decision. Just my humble opinion.

Huh? I believe they are very much in the game because of leaking info to Nightengale. The last thing they want are crazy fake numbers getting out to the fans, agents, and other franchises. I will save my opinions on success and/or failure for after we see the players sign

People know that Nightengale is the mouthpiece of the Sox. There is history to show this. It's not Rosenthal, Passan, or any other national guy. Levine either still has a Sox source or knows this about Nightengale. I believe Levine needs to retire and he knows the relationship between the Sox and Nightengale. It's the Sox way of keeping information accurate, so they are not bidding against themselves or having another team throw "stupid money" at the player, that the Sox can not compete with.

That last paragraph is spot on. If that is so, they are not telling a lie, but doing what I said, it's a threat. That is what Boras did to the Rangers and won. He HAS to have another offer and that other offer could be $1, but it is an offer. My point is that he can't say "the Cardinals are at 300 and you need to beat that", if the Cardinals are not at 300. You can't claim an offer that does not exist, but can hint or threaten with "another offer". I do however believe Credibility does matter. There is a reason some teams will not deal with Boras. Those teams may be doing their franchise and fans a disservice, but those teams don't trust his credibility.

Sure and I agree. Thank you. I would never show my hand during negotiations to hurt my client, but I believe you can not say I HAVE THIS FROM SOMEONE ELSE, if it is untrue. You can drop hints, threats, or use certain phrases as leverage to gain the high ground, but I would believe you lose future credibility if you flat out lie.

If true, the balls that Rick Hahn has are huge. Good for him. The Sox have a long history of leaking to Nightengale. MHO, Machado wants to play for the Sox. If the Sox have not adjusted their initial offer, they know this. Machado and his agent want more money and I don't blame them. However, the Sox must know the market. The Sox would have been eliminated or adjust their offer, if this wasn't the case.

For the attorneys out there, can you lie during negotiations about a mystery offer? I know in my line of business, you can not. I mean, ethics still exists, right? Credibility?

There is a history of "Mystery Teams". Cano and the Mariners, Pujols and the Angels, ARod and the Rangers, etc. People did not see those teams as destinations. Now, general theme to those three listed, BAD. Overpaid and two didn't finish with the teams they signed with. I agree with you on the social media leaks, but I don't think you can immeadietly discount it. Especially if numbers aren't as high as originally thought. A team could have jumped in the last 48 hours and nobody would know. It has been eerily quiet, in regards to the number of teams, for a 26 year old with big numbers. If I was Hahn, I wouldn't bank on a mystery team during negotiations, but it has to be in your mind somewhere.

Could very well be right, but do you gamble that? If numbers and years are not as high as earlier thought (300 mil and 10 years), you may have a team (like the Cardinals possible hail mary earlier reported) jump in last minute because numbers are low.

Agree completely. Also, if the numbers aren't where everyone expected, why wouldn't a team jump in at an unexpected lower number.

Sure, but that doesn't mean the Sox are going to negotiate against themselves, like most teams do with Boras. New way of doing business does not mean blank check for Boras. The franchise has changed in regards to drafting, and international signings. I believe they will deal with Boras, but I don't believe the team will get wrapped up in an ARod Texas fiasco. I believe that is what we are going to see with Harper and the Phillies.

I don't think the Phillies will panic. I truly believe they are in the driving seat. Pressure, sure, panic, no. They have had a nice off-season , to this point and I believe they will get Harper or Machado. When their owner says what he said, that's hard to walk back, especially in Philadelphia. Phillies will be the team to overpay, but that's not them panicking. They threw money at Thome and got him (and he really didn't want to go there). Harper is the one I have always seen as a long shot for the Sox. If you look at the history, Sox have wanted Machado and Boras has long been a rival of Mr. Reinsdorf's.

I don't believe it is combative, just part of the game. You are negotiating for today, in good faith. You never know what tomorrow brings and you can say "take it or leave it" today. However, you have to not be stubborn enough to hold your ground the next day, if circumstances change. Today the offer is Y. Things could change tomorrow and the offer can go up to Z or down to X. It could stay right at Y. You are playing poker and we will see who blinks. It's like saying "Final Offer" and then an hour later saying "Wait, here is more". I negotiate for a living and I love hearing "final offer" or "Take it or leave it" from the other side and then getting more. Part of the game. Sometimes you don't get more. You have to know who you are dealing with and their history. If the Sox set a soft dealine, that isn't end all be all. If you are negotiating on emotions, you are in the wrong business. You have to do what is in the best interest for your side. The Harper meeting is VERY important tomorrow, for multiple reasons. For one, Phillies could get the vibe that Harper doesn't want to play in Philly. If that is the teams take away from the meeting, they could throw more money at Manny.

I agree completely with you. Luck does play a part and there is not a set blueprint, for any MLB team. I am just hesitant on the Sox handing over a record breaking franchise contract to a player that may not be a marketable face of the franchise. Win or not, there is value in marketing. I want to win, badly, but if you don't, you better have a player that is beloved and I don't know if that is Machado.

I am another Sox fan that is fairly confident the team signs Machado. This coming from someone still very torn on Machado. I don't discount the talent, but doubt the person. Is he really the face of a franchise? The person we see on billboards and national marketing? Is he a BIG draw for fans and sponsors? Can he deliver a championship? Biggest concern, contract would be largest in franchise history, is this what should be done? I keep thinking that Eloy, Machado, and Abreu are a sick 3, 4, and 5. That could win the division in 2019, with quality pitching. Not trying to be an ass or bring people down. Not my money, other than being a season ticket holder. Just curious if people want Machado because he is "one of the top free agents" or(and) this is the right move that will produce a championship? 2005 was an amazing year that I will never forget. Remember, it wasn't about signing BIG money, but extremely smart moves and spreading the money around to numerous players. Feel free to rip me apart. I am just tired and want this whole thing done.

The national guys are all quiet. It is going to be another random that breaks either Harper or Machado, that's just the world we live in currently. My only hope is that some #SoxTwitter person we all know gets the credit.

I have never posted that much, but this is bringing me back 15 years. Good to see some old posters.

IMO, Eaton is a great addition. The team had 4 left handed starting pitchers and somebody had to go. Sale is the ace, Q has a very high ceiling and is a steal financially, and Danks is coming off injuries and has a big contract. Hector is a very cool person, but he had to go. I believe the Sox sold high on Santiago and the D-Backs sold low on Eaton. Eaton (if healthy) is a legit CF and will hit well at US Cellular. The Sox fan base will love him, if he performs like he should.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 31, 2013 -> 02:53 PM) If Konerko retires, who would be next in line to be captain of the Sox? Ventura. I just do not see the need for a player captain. The manager is in charge and captain of the ship. Now, I do like to see players call each other out and set examples. I love to hear stories about Carl Everett and A.J. calling someone out when they did something stupid. It can grow old after a long period of time (A.J.), but works over a short period of time. Who is currently calling the players out for all their mental mistakes? I am a huge Konerko fan, but that is the one knock I have on him, if he is our "Captain". It does not seem like he will call people out or be "that guy" in the clubhouse. He leads by example, which is great, but does not always get the best responses.