WCSox

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 1, 2009 -> 10:26 AM) When they agree to a contract prior to the process. The Sox never go to arbitration with their own players. Honestly I couldn't even tell you the last time that it actually happened. I recall Ron Kittle's arbitration meetings with the Sox being a complete disaster. Reinsdorf et al. came out of that looking extremely petty, and it's probably a reason why they don't do it anymore.

Linebrink will most likely begin the season as the 7th/8th inning guy (I imagine that Thornton will be used as a LOOGY occasionally). His veteran status, long history of success at this position, and salary will keep him there. Right or wrong, that's the culture in MLB and Ozzie is about as old-school as it comes. I don't have a problem with this as long as they keep him on a relatively short leash this year. The Sox cannot afford two dismal months of Linebrink down the stretch again. If Linebrink falters and Ozzie replaces him with another 7th/8th inning guy (Hudson?), I imagine that he'll demoted to mop-up duty and he'll be dealt (with a large amount of cash) next winter. I hope that the latter scenario never comes to fruition. This team desperately needs Linebrink to stabilize the pen.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 27, 2009 -> 08:08 AM) I'd bet that we will see two relievers in the 2010 pen from our system anyway - Hudson (likely to the pen for the short term), and Nunez. They will have the first half to show their stuff, and if Linebrink or one of the other close/late relievers begins to falter, they will probably flip roles. This also allows other relievers in the system who aren't quite seen as ready yet (Santeliz is a possibility) to show what they can do in AAA, and then we'd know better who is ready. I would think/hope that Hudson would start the season out in AAA (to condition his arm for the 2011 rotation). But he's exactly the type of player who could be brought up to replace Linebrink, if needed.

I realize that Rongey gets a ton of "somebody, anybody!" phone calls from delusional fans during the post-game show, but I have to agree with shack that there are pitchers in the Sox farm system that could've done better than the 2.04 WHIP than Linebrink put up in August and September. The problem with Linebrink, that KHP pointed out here several weeks ago, is that he has had something like 5 straight seasons of horrible second halves. It's as puzzling as it is amazing, as it certainly didn't appear to be related to an injury or dead arm this year. I completely understand how Ozzie would be hesitant to demote a guy a veteran with a large salary and solid track record in early September after he put up a really solid April-June and a decent July. But as soon as it becomes apparent that 2010 will be Linebrink's sixth straight year of bad second-half pitching, Ozzie needs to put somebody else in his role. That doesn't mean DFAing Linebrink, but he can't be used regularly if he's pitching like that. If I'm Kenny, I'm thinking about this right now and will be working with my minor league coaches in the spring to identify potential candidates for the setup role in Chicago later in the summer.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 26, 2009 -> 08:17 PM) What the heck were you thinking letting her go? It was my friend's girlfriend, not mine. Very nice gal, but not my type. She hooked up my friend, myself, and another friend of ours with free tix to a Sox/Yankees game back in 2000 and gave us the VIP tour afterwards (I called the 'pen from the visitor's dugout).

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 26, 2009 -> 12:15 PM) Williams' job is more secure than Guillen's, of course, but the Peavy and Rios acquisitions were his riskiest yet, since the Todd Ritchie and David Wells moves in 2001/2002. I don't think that the Peavy and Wells deals are comparable at all. Peavy won a Cy Young two years ago, is still in the prime of his career, and Kenny gave up very little for him. David Wells was entering the twilight of his career, was getting cortisone shots in his shoulder the previous year, was in the last year of his contract, and the guy that Kenny traded for him never pitched in the bigs again. On the other hand, I agree that the Rios deal was a huge reach. This is a guy who has been trending downward for the past couple of years and was laughably bad at the plate after the trade. Rios putting up a .700 OPS for the next few years would definitely be a negative on an otherwise excellent resume.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Nov 26, 2009 -> 11:19 AM) JR put up with many mediocre years out of Schueler and never canned him, Schueler left on his own terms. I think KW will do the same thing unless something extremely out of character and dramatic happens with him. JR loves the people around him, and they feel the same way about him. An at-the-time girlfriend of a friend of mine worked in the Sox front office about 10 years ago. She described Reinsdorf as "grandfatherly" and a great boss. And it showed in the way that she put in long hours for a not-whoppingly-huge salary. I don't see why Kenny would want to go anywhere else any time soon (within the next 5 years). But if he does, my guess would be the Angels. He's a California guy and Arte Moreno is another outstanding owner with deep pockets and a rock-solid organization. I don't see somebody like Kenny working for the Steinbrenner trust fund babies and I don't see Theo Epstein leaving Boston any time soon. That would leave the Mets or Phillies, and both of those organizations are a step down prestige-wise from the former two.

This has to be the last year that Linebrink gets the "well, he's done it before, so let's run him out there again" treatment. If he gets hit hard again, I can't see him taking a spot on the 2011 roster. It might be worth it to Kenny (who doesn't normally pick up salary) to eat half of his $5.5M 2011 salary in exchange for a middle-tier minor leaguer. That said, his velocity was there last year and I'm cautiously optimistic that he can find his command again. And for the record, I was on board with Kenny over-paying for Linebrink and Dotel, especially after 2007. And it's not like those two were completely worthless in Chicago. They helped the Sox win a lot of games in the fist half of '08, and ultimately helped the Sox win the division that year.

QUOTE (Tex @ Nov 25, 2009 -> 07:17 PM) Not me. I love old catchers and young pitchers. Long walks on South Padre Island's beaches. Can he play left? If Paulie's gone as a FA next winter and there's no Adrian Gonzalez to take over at 1B, I'm wondering if re-upping AJ and moving Flowers to 1B might be an option. In this scenario, there would be the option of transitioning Flowers to C and AJ to 1B at some point. If AJ keeps hitting like he's been over the past four years and provides good veteran leadership in the clubhouse, why not keep him around for a few more years?

QUOTE (YASNY @ Nov 25, 2009 -> 01:34 PM) He may very well turn out to be an asset. I'm betting (figuratively speaking) that he'll still be an ass. We will see. There's probably a greater-than-50% chance that you're right. Still, I think he's worth a $500k gamble.

Wow, I like this. Dirt-cheap, can play RF (and CF occasionally), and big-time hitting potential. Way to go, Kenny!

QUOTE (WhiteSoxfan1986 @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 11:15 AM) http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20...sp&c_id=mlb Good stuff. The writers have gotten all of the major awards right so far. ^^^

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Nov 24, 2009 -> 08:21 AM) Nothing tough about this one at all. Two time MVPs with 500+ home runs and a career .300 batting average go right on into the HOF. No questions asked. Don't forget about the batting title in 1997 and the fact that he lost the 2000 MVP to a 'roider. Frank was the best hitter in the game for about five years (1993-1997) - out-hitting many contemporaries (Bonds, Belle, Sammy, McGwire, Juan Gone) that have been exposed as cheaters. If Frank and Griffey don't both get into Cooperstown on the first ballot, they need to blow the place up.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 24, 2009 -> 09:49 AM) I'm looking at it in regards to a 5 tier system, and 2nd or 3rd tier would put him right in the middle of the pack. That's mainly what I was referring to. If the "elite" tier comprises the top 20%, Jenks is roughly in the 60th percentile or bottom of the 2nd tier. That's average-to-slightly-above-average, depending on where the breakdowns occur in the hierarchy. Instead of only looking at raw performance, closers also need to be evaluated contractually. Trading for Soria or signing Valverde to a multi-year deal might put the Sox in a better position to compete in the short-term, but it's going to cost Kenny a heck of a lot more than the $6-7M that will be needed to keep Bobby in a Sox uni for one more year. I'll bet that the Omar Minaya would rather have Bobby's contract than K-Rod's right now.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 09:22 PM) Joe Nathan Mariano Rivera Jonathan Papelbon Jonathan Broxton Heath Bell Francisco Cordero Francisco Rodriguez Trevor Hoffman Joakim Soria Jose Valverde Andrew Bailey Rafael Soriano I would rate all of those closers as being better than Bobby Jenks. That is 12 closers, or 40% of closers in baseball. I generally look at 10%, but since it is such a narrow field, I will say that the 20% of closers in baseball are elite. That leaves Jenks right around a 2nd or 3rd tier closer, and probably much closer to 3rd tier than 2nd tier. If Jenks is as good or better than 60% of the closers in baseball, how does that make him "close to a 3rd tier" closer? I understand your overall point, but "3rd tier" doesn't exactly imply slightly better than average. If 20% of closers in baseball are elite (1st tier), wouldn't that put Jenks right at the end of the 2nd tier? I agree that the Sox are probably better off signing Jenks to another one-year deal and having the freedom to use Thornton in the 7th or 8th. But if the Sox are able to include Jenks in a deal for Upton, I do that deal and look for a setup man elsewhere.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Nov 21, 2009 -> 07:25 PM) http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/wh...T-sox21.article I dont have sympathy for Jenks here. He has a job that requires him to stay in some sort of shape, and all of the little nicks and knocks that bugged him this year, including the kidney stones, seemed to revolve around his poor overall fitness. Ozzie really didnt said anything different that he hasnt said in the past, I dont know why Bobby feels like he is being scapegoated now. I'm pretty sure that his kidney stones had little to do with him being overweight. That said, I agree that he needs to stop whining and start working out regularly. At the very least, he has ample financial incentive to do so.

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 11:55 AM) Hey Cowley. Even Jake Peavy said it. It speaks volumes that Peavy shares this information with a random fan, but not Cowley.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 04:14 PM) I mentioned above how I excluded deals that aren't going to be traded because the teams themselves don't think they are bad. Rios falls under that umbrella. We wouldn't have claimed the contract if we felt it was a bad one. The fact that Kenny picked it up doesn't preclude it from being a bad contract. At the very least, it's a dubious contract, especially in this economy.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 01:04 PM) If, hypothetically, Alex Rios put up a .770 OPS next season, that'd still be a major jump from what our CF's have put up since 2006. As such, that's still worth paying a premium for given that it's been a hole in our roster for 3+ years. BUT...also, expecting Alex Rios to put up a .770 OPS next next season also ignores the fact that while playing in a pitcher's park, his OPS the 3 seasions previous to last were .798, .852, .865. Thus...there are lots of reasons to believe he'll do better than .770, and if all he does is .770 in this ballpark that's a good reason to fire greg walker. Furthermore, on top of whatever OPS he does give you, he's probably good for 20-30 steals at a solid 80%+ clip. Of course, all of this assumes that he has his head screwed on straight he's giving 100% effort after the mega-contract that Ricciardi gave him. Perhaps the way that he crapped his pants in Chicago this summer rubbed me the wrong way, but many in Toronto seemed to believe that he cared more about his nightlife than his game after he got that deal. I completely agree that he has the tools to be a regular .850 OPS player with 30 SBs per season. But whether or not he'll reach that potential is debatable, as his OPS has dropped dramatically over the past two seasons. I suppose that some of this can be attributed to the fact that the Jays clubhouse has been a grease fire for the past few seasons. But given that our own team appeared to literally quit in the middle of a division race back in August, I'm not confident that our clubhouse culture is going to motivate him to play at that level again. I'm hoping for the best but, man, I just don't feel good about this guy.

QUOTE (spawn @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 11:39 AM) I don't post much here, but I had to reply to this. How is KW getting too fancy? During the season, he makes a trade for a former Cy Young award winner in Jake Peavy. He upgrades CF from the likes of Brian Anderson/Dewayne Wise in acquring Alex Rios. Rios didn't show much offensively while here, but I'm willing to I've the guy the benefit of the doubt and see what he brings next season. Besides, as I said, he's still an upgrade over what we ran out there the last few seasons. I think that Rios was almost a desperation move. I realize that our CF situation is somewhat unique, but paying a guy over $60M to sport a .770 OPS and play above-average defense in CF seems like a move that's going to bite us in the rear. Maybe I'm wrong (and Kenny has certainly earned the benefit of the doubt), but this seems like an uncharacteristically bad move by KW. I hope that I'm proven wrong next year.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 10:47 AM) I think the better question is, what makes you think the bolded above is true? The financial constraints of adding Peavy and Rios to the roster? Kenny and JR could always surprise us, but it seems reasonable to assume that the Sox aren't in a position to take on much more salary. Trading Paulie or Jenks could free up payroll for additional moves, but they'd also create holes at the same time.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 09:48 AM) However, you can say that consistency can also get you somewhere, just look at a guy like Craig Biggio. Granted, he's nothing spectacular, but the fact that he is an accumulator with 3,000 hits and played many weaker positions will probably get him into the hall sooner or later. I'm not sure what you mean by "weaker positions." Last time I checked, 2B and C are a lot more difficult than RF and DH. If you want to get into the HOF at RF or DH (or LF or 1B), you need to be a dominant hitter... period. Biggio was a much better 2B than Harold was a RF, as evidenced by his four Gold Gloves and four Silver Slugger awards.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 01:17 PM) Upton's the kind of guy that I'd really hate to overpay for and then have him go all Delmon Young on us. So talented but seems like he's been struggling forever. QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Nov 22, 2009 -> 03:09 PM) And he has injury problems too, it seems. ^^^^^ I love Upton's skill set, but this guy has a number of red flags. The fact that the Rays are interested in shopping him while he's (1) under team control for two or three more years and (2) coming off of a bad season with his trade value at an all-time low gives me even more pause. If they're willing to deal him straight-up for Hudson right now, it would appear to me that they view Upton as damaged goods and want to move him while before he puts up another sub-par season and loses trade value.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Nov 23, 2009 -> 09:25 AM) He won't get in. His offensive stats are nice, but the fact that he was a DH for the second half of his career probably put the nail on the coffin. If Jim Rice can get in with his stats, so can Baines. The only difference is that Rice actually played a position on the field and that matters. Actually, the difference is that Rice was a dominant player (1 MVP, and 5 other finishes in the Top 10). He had almost as many HRs as Baines in six fewer seasons, and also higher a career BA and OPS. Harold's one of my favorite all-time Sox players, but he's only in the HOF discussion because of his longevity. And while there's something to be said for a guy who managed to play for 22 seasons, being a HOFer is about being a dominant player. Harold was an All Star-caliber player for a number of seasons, but never one of the top hitters in the league.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Nov 20, 2009 -> 11:57 AM) With Ramirez at SS and Beckham at 2B, where do you envision Nix and Getz fitting in long-term? I would've seen Nix as a utility infielder, and possibly somebody who could play a corner OF position. With Vizquel and Kotsay, that's probably not going to happen now. I thought that Getz would've gotten the starting 2B gig, prior to his trade to KC.