WCSox

QUOTE (dasox24 @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 11:01 AM) What the f*** don't some Bulls fans understand about a salary cap? You can pay guys like that in baseball b/c there's no limit to spending (except for what the owner wants to spend). Not to mention that Reinsdorf is one of many board members who own minority stakes in the Sox, and that there's no way that he can unilaterally reallocate Sox assets to the Bulls.

Trading Linebrink is a pipe dream. No GM in his right mind would pick up damaged goods for that much. I'd be dangling both Jenks and A.J. this winter to see what teams might be willing to give up. I'm assuming that A.J. is going to be difficult to deal, as he's somewhat overpaid by today's market standards. Jenks will probably be closer to $7-8 million this year, and his arbitration value may also make him difficult to deal. I had assumed that one of Dye or Thome would be re-signed, but who knows.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 10:49 AM) That's because he's having trouble catching up to most fastballs. Thome has historically hit a ton of balls to LF. Charlie Manuel actually kept him in the minors a little longer than he wanted to back in the early 90's, because Thome hadn't learned to pull the ball consistently.

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 10:32 AM) His point about the big contract is a good one, but we're the kind of team that has to overpay anyway. I would rather have this on the books than have another one of those offseasons where FAs turn us down and we have to settle for Nick Swisher. If you're going to over-pay for a player, a Cy Young Award-winning starting pitcher in his prime is the perfect candidate. A guy like Peavy is also going to help you a hell of a lot more than other players with bad contracts (Hunter, Vernon Wells, etc.).

Does this genius even know how much money is coming off the Sox's payroll sheet over the next year and a half (Contreras, Dotel, Thome and/or Dye, A.J., Konerko possibly)? Does he know how much came off last winter from dumping Vazquez and Swisher? Or Linebrink, Jenks, and Buehrle being FAs after 2011? The Sox will have quite a bit of payroll flexibility over the next few years. If that's what actually happens 12 months from now, then Mission Accomplished, Kenny Williams.

They lost out big-time on acquiring Lee/Washburn/Peavy/Halladay last week. They're still a very good team who will probably win their division, but I don't see how they can feel too confident right now.

Yeah, I'd bet that Pods either gets injured or flames out next season as well. But I'm trying to look at this realistically. The Sox just committed a ton of money to Peavy, they're going to have to pay Jenks arbitration next year and/or sign more veteran relievers, they're going to have to spend on a FA CF, and they're going to have to either re-sign Dye (or Thome) or go after another power hitter on the FA market (e.g., Hank Blalock). Maybe I'm wrong, but there doesn't seem to be much money left over to pay for a veteran LF (assuming that they want one that can actually hit). I also don't see Crawford as a viable option. The Rays will want a ton in return, and our farm system has already been depleted by Peavy deal. They'd probably want Hudson or Flowers, and those guys aren't going anywhere. And that's unfortunate, because having him at the top of the order would be incredible.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 09:16 AM) And the economy could go either way. Better to wait until everything is clarified in terms of the financial direction of the game of baseball, the White Sox and just the US economic situation in general. The economy isn't going to sort itself out any time soon. With the rate that the Fed is devaluing our currency and with China getting nervous about that and our ridiculously-low interest, interest rates will shoot up and combine with inflation to trigger another recession in another year or so. Agreed in general about waiting a year with Beckham, though. I'd start negotiations on a long-term deal next winter.

QUOTE (lostfan @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 08:51 AM) Frank in his prime was a high-average line drive hitter with a s***-ton of power, not a pull-happy power hitter. Indeed, Frank hit ropes all over the park in the early and mid '90s. His approach at the plate was the best I've seen in my lifetime.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 08:39 AM) I actually expect a DH/RF platoon type situation with Dye and Quentin next year with Q getting more of the defensive play. LF and CF are this winter's #1 targets. I don't see any reason for Quentin and Dye to platoon. They're both right-handed hitters and they've both played RF competently at the ML level. Dye is the logical choice to move to DH because of his age and decreasing range. I could definitely see Dye playing RF occasionally to give Quentin a rest, though. Agreed about CF, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Sox offered Pods a one-year deal on the cheap and kept Wise around as a 4th outfielder. (If he isn't traded, Fields may also get reps in Charlotte as a LF.) They've already said that they're going to spend on middle relief, so I don't see them spending on two veteran OFs on top of it.

I'm still waiting for him to hit a slump. I'm not holding my breath. Beckham is the best Sox hitting prospect I've seen since Frank. They're different types of hitters and I don't think that Slayer is quite on Frank's level talent-wise, but he's not that far behind.

QUOTE (lostfan @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 07:12 AM) JD's arm really isn't all it's cracked up to be. It's strong, but he never actually makes any good throws. You make it sound like Quentin has a girly arm though. Quentin is not Vladimir Guerrero but he still has a plus arm. Quentin mostly played RF in Arizona, and I don't think that his arm is any worse than Maggs' was. While JD obviously has a stronger arm, he'll be 36 next year and is becoming more susceptible to injuries. He should be moved to DH.

Beckham has done nothing but kick ass in the 2-hole. I'd move Alexei down to the 8th spot, and bat Getz 9th.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 07:22 PM) NEXT YEAR WITHOUT BOBBY Thornton -- closer? Who set's up? Linebrink? Who's the 7th inning guy? Pena? Who's the lefty set up guy? Not Williams Carrasco -- long relief To me, without Bobby, it looks like it could be a bullpen implosion. NEXT YEAR WITH BOBBY Jenks - closer Thornton - set up man Pena or Linebrink -- 7th inning guy Williams (or another lefty) - LOOGY Carrasco -- long relief Frankly, neither of those scenarios are that appealing. Regardless of what they do with Jenks next year, they're going to have to spend on the bullpen. And I mean actual Major League talent, not crap like Andrew Sisco or Dewon Day. I was glad to hear Hahn state that they're looking at middle relief. Before tossing Bobby out the door, I'd wait and see how he pitches down the stretch, without kidney stone pain. If his command comes back, I'd probably be willing to take a flyer on him for one more year (probably $7.5-8 million). That's not a tremendous investment, and the Sox have A. J. and potentially Paulie coming off the books next winter as well. And Bobby would still have trade value, being under team control for 2011 as well. If Bobby continues to throw erratically later this year, I'd lean towards dealing him this winter - BUT only if I could find an experienced, viable option to fill the void (Thornton is not a closer).

QUOTE (iamshack @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 06:01 PM) Palehose, that's great and all but you have to realize your first choice in Figgins is going to need a multi-year deal. Are we really going to need him that much in year 2 of his deal? Years 3 or 4? I just don't think that length of contract fits into our plans... I agree. Hahn has already indicated that they're going to spend on middle relief this winter. And I imagine that they might extend JD after that (or go after a younger power hitter on the FA market).

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 04:30 PM) I kind of side with this. People always talk about how calm a closer has to be. But if he's talented he's gonna get people out. If he isnt he wont That's true. And no reliever in this organization has Jenks' talent. So if you want to replace him, you'd better have a talented replacement ready to go. Bringing up Joe Schmoe out of AA ain't gonna cut it.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 03:18 PM) The argument for those who find the closer spot to be overrated, (myself being one of the proponents of this theory) says, that a typical major league pitcher should be able to get these three outs regardless, of when these three outs occur in a ballgame. LaTroy Hawkins says hi. Whether or not the Sox dish out the $8M or so that it'll take to keep Jenks around for another year, they need to address the pen in general. They're going to lose Dotel, and who knows if Linebrink will ever be able to pitch at a reasonably high level again. Regardless of what role they play, Kenny's going to need to bring in at least two more proven arms this winter. Kenny cut corners by re-stocking the pen with cheap, unaccomplished pitchers in 2007, and it was a complete disaster. I don't want to see that happen again.

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 02:57 PM) But what I really think would fit is going into next year with Thornton as the closer, and just hope that whoever else fills out the pen is good. Obviously the acquisition of a proven lefty would be needed. Taking out the loss of a LOOGY, Thornton is like a left-handed Kyle Farnsworth with better command. I'm not convinced that a guy like that would be any more effective as a closer than Bobby Howry or Matt Karchner were.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 02:52 PM) We did it in 2005... Didn't the Sox start out 2005 with Shingo? He had major success in Japan and was pretty solid for us in 2004. The Sox also had a lot more depth in their pen that year (brought in Hermanson, Vizcaino, etc.) than they do right now.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 02:25 PM) We’d really be hurting our bullpen by making Thornton our closer. Ideally, someone from the minors can step up get saves, and gain value. I’m a 100% believer in selling the closer, they’re a replaceable asset. I disagree that effective closers are that easy to replace. If there's somebody in our farm system with closer experience who looks like he's truly ready for the bigs (or an experienced veteran with a reasonable price tag), I'm all for dealing Jenks. But bringing up Joe Schmoe from AA and anointing him "closer" isn't going to work. Agreed about Thornton.

Unless he's experiencing discomfort, I say that you have to keep running him out there and hope that he figures it out. (And try to avoid using him when we have small leads.) It's not like we have an excess of dominant arms in the pen right now. I don't like Linebrink's long-term prognosis. I don't know specifically what's wrong with his shoulder, but I imagine that if surgery could help it, they would've tried that this winter. Kenny's basically stuck with this guy, so all you can do is hope for the best at this point.

Trading Bobby isn't a bad idea, but who in the heck is going to close next year? The closest candidate would be Thornton, but he's never closed before and doesn't have any secondary pitches that he can throw for strikes. If they trade Bobby, Kenny needs to bring in a veteran who can handle the closer spot.

QUOTE (SouthsideDon48 @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 01:38 PM) You can't count out Nunez or Link. It's not out of the realm of possibility they they might step up next year as serviceable major league relievers. That's true. But if you're "going for it," counting on unproven prospects to fill the closer role when you already have a successful closer under team control is not a good idea.

QUOTE (SEALgep @ Aug 2, 2009 -> 12:46 PM) Ya, but we're only talking about a month with the boot I believe. And the muscle memory kicks in pretty quickly anyway. It's not a question of "memory." Atrophy is an actual loss of muscle mass, and exercise is needed to re-build it. Agreed that the amount of atrophy that Peavy has experienced is going to be minimal, though. I don't see why he'd need more than a month to rebuild it.

Obviously, a lot depends on how Bobby finishes this season. But it's difficult to imagine the Sox re-tooling right now, after the Peavy deal. Unless Bobby suffers an injury later this summer, it's difficult to imagine Kenny not at least offering him arbitration. With Poreda gone, Dotel on his way out, Linebrink appearing to be done as an effective reliever, and Thornton only able to throw a fastball for strikes consistently, the Sox don't have any other in-house options for a closer.