Lillian

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Apr 12, 2010 -> 09:01 PM) Because he keeps giving up hits and putting men on. I'm sorry, Jenks does not have closer stuff IMO. I've been watching this for quite a while now, and he just can't dominate hitters anymore. That ball Gonzales hit was a rocket. But more importantly, does the stuff he's featuring look all that impressive to you people? Now Thornton can dominate, and even Santos' stuff appears to be really almost unhittable. But Bobby doesn't have the velocity, or movement to be a dominate closer. If he keeps throwing like this, I would guess that opposing teams will make the last inning of an awful lot of games very anxiety ridden for many of us.

QUOTE (bmags @ Apr 7, 2010 -> 08:40 AM) this guy thinks andruw jones will hit better than konerko this year? I assume that you were referring to my concern that Konerko no longer provides the presence of a bonafide clean up hitter. I'm not saying that Jones will either, but I think that he has the potential to do so. If he doesn't, I suspect that the Sox will simply have an unfilled void at the number 4 spot in the lineup.

QUOTE (knightni @ Apr 7, 2010 -> 02:13 AM) Jones should be batting 6th or 7th after Rios/AJ instead of Kotsay. If Jones can produce as the clean up hitter, or number 5, then A. J. should bat 6th in order to mix up the lefty, righty hitters. Then I love Rios as the 7th hitter. It provides an opportunity to have an exceptionally good bottom third of the lineup. Rios, with his a legitimate stolen base threat, can function like a lead off hitter for the bottom third of the order. Yet, he can also drive in guys who get on base in the middle of the order. Then Teahen can bat 8th, and Alexei 9th. Ramirez has the ability to drive in the big run, with decent power, but also gives you another guy with decent speed, who functions like another lead off hitter. All three of those guys are at the age when they should be coming into their primes. While the Sox offense may not feature the most intimidating middle of the order, its total depth and versatility is very good. The bottom of their order could be as potent as just about anyone's.

One other point which argues quite strongly for Jones over Kotsay: The upside potential of Jones is far greater than it is for Kotsay. There is a realistic chance that Jones could be a very productive run producer, and that makes playing him worth a shot. Kotsay at his best, would still never be a big run producer.

If you look at Andruw Jones' split stats over the last 5 years, you will discover that he has hit virtually the same vs. right handers and left handers. This includes two outstanding seasons in 2005 and 2006, and three injury plagued years, during which he was in terrible shape. If you believe he is now capable of performing up to reasonable expectations for a guy still in his prime, now in great shape, who has a long stellar career, then platooning him doesn't make any sense. If on the the other hand, you believe that he is finished as he turns 33, then just cut him or trade him for a left handed bat. However platooning him should not be an option. Moreover, as I have previously pointed out, he is still arguably the best center fielder on this team, and therefore should be playing the outfield, and not DHing. I think that Ozzie will eventually play Jones in CF on a pretty regular basis. I suspect that he is just giving Kotsay an opportunity to play because he had a very good Spring. If Jones performs, and Kotsay doesn't, Ozzie will likely return Kotsay to his role as bench player and Jones can bat in the middle of the order. His presence in the lineup could provide the much needed protection for Quentin. That is really the biggest weakness in the Sox offense. There is no one on this team that can stop pitchers from going around Carlos, except for Jones. Konerko would have provided that kind of protection in his prime, but I don't think he can fill that role at this stage of his career.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Feb 22, 2010 -> 09:32 AM) I find it funny that I am reading that Soxtalk is now drinking the Kool-Aid since we passed on Damon. Three days ago we were screwed without Damon, now he's on the Tigers so Jones will be Comeback Player of the Year. While I would have liked Damon on the Sox, I for one, never said that we we're screwed without him. I've been consistently optimistic about Jones, ever since he signed with the Sox.

There is yet another factor which I forgot to mention. Last year was his first year in the American League. As he gets to know the pitchers better, his familiarity with their 'stuff' should help him to improve upon his first half season in the A.L.

QUOTE (bmags @ Feb 22, 2010 -> 07:35 AM) Extrapolating is just not a very good idea to base your projections on. If we extrapolated Jermaine dyes season last year after the all star break he would've been going for a 40 HR season. I mean, extrapolating Beckhams #s for a full season I feel is a lot more reasonable than doing it for a 33 year old injury plagued outfielder who has sucked for 3 years now. Yes, I agree that extrapolating and projecting numbers can be suspect. However, in this case, I think it's valid. Consider the fact that Jones was plagued by a bad hamstring the whole second half of the season. His production was actually even better than his final numbers, which declined when he tried to play through the injury. He ended the first half of the season with a .229 average and a .344 OBP. He hit all 17 of his homers in his first 221 at bats, so if you want to do projections, that works out to 43 homers in a 550 at bat full season. Therefore, the projection I made earlier is actually quite conservative. Doesn't it make sense to consider all of these kinds of factors when trying to determine what kind of expectations we should have for Jones? In the final analysis, aren't we always extrapolating when we form our expectations for any player?

Let me reiterate; I'll settle for his slugging production from last year, projected over the whole season. His projected numbers from half of a season; 36 doubles, 34 homers and 86 RBI's would have topped anyone on the 2009 Sox. Now if he can get his B.A. and OBP up a little to around .250 and .340 respectively, he could provide a real presence in the middle of the order. Isn't that really what this team is missing? I don't understand why some of you think that it's a stretch to assume that he won't be able to at least equal last years power production, considering that he is now in better shape, and apparently recovered from his injuries. Moreover, he improves the defense, if he takes either Pierre's or Quentin's place in the outfield, which I'd like to see. If this works, Jones could do more for the offense than Damon would have likely done. With Damon, Jones wouldn't have seen enough playing time to have an impact. I love this move, and for half a million dollars, it could turn out to be the best move of the off season, and maybe one of the best in quite a while. I'm rootin' for him.

QUOTE (bmags @ Feb 21, 2010 -> 11:49 AM) maybe MLB will add a fitness competition that can snag us a few more wins. Very funny. However, we are talking about a former perrenial All Star, and genuine super star, who got injured, became overweight and out of shape. His performance then fell off dramatically, right at a time in his career when he should have been in his prime. That suggests the possibility that his getting healthy and in shape could make a significant difference. Here is a link to his injury history: http://www.baseballinjurytool.com/injury-tool.php I understand that he has been linked to PEDS, however he was always a very good player until the last few years. Moreover, steroids don't help a hitter to make contact, nor to win Gold Gloves. Perhaps they made him stronger, and maybe he wouldn't have hit 51 homers in 2005 without them, but this guy was an elite player. He has really only struggled for the first time in his career, during the last 3 seasons, the time that he was hurt, and out of shape. Even then his numbers from last year project to 36 doubles, 34 homers and 86 RBI's. Wouldn't you take that at DH? The previous season, his first with the Dodgers he was injured and missed more than half the season. The year before that, his last year in Atlanta, he did have his first really bad batting average year, but even then he was productive, with 94 RBI's. I just think that while your point is well taken, in that they don't award wins or championships for being healthy and in shape, the improved physical condition can definitely enable a gifted athlete to perform up to his potential, while being injured and out of shape is a tremendous handicap. I'm optimistic, and am looking forward to seeing what he can do, especially with his apparent improved attitude. And remember that he's playing for a contract.

As I stated in another thread, if Jones does play up to management's hopes and expectations, he should be in the lineup against both right and left handed pitching. He has always hit about the same against both, so it doesn't make any sense to platoon him with Kotsay. 25 homers is a very modest and conservative projection for Jones if healthy, and in shape. I would think that he would produce more power than that. If so, he could bat as low as 5th in the order, providing of course that he can at least match his .325 OBP from last year. Moreover, as some of you have suggested, if he is healthy and in shape, he should be playing right field. He would be a much better right fielder than Quentin. I don't really know who should play Left. Pierre can cover much more ground than Quentin, but Carlos has a far better arm. The intangible there is that, on the one hand it would be nice to have Quentin DH. in order to reduce the risk of injury. However, on the other hand, his intense make up is probably not well suited for that role. He needs to focus on defense, rather than dwell on every at bat.

QUOTE (3E8 @ Feb 21, 2010 -> 12:55 AM) Number of hitters "capable" of hitting 15+ home runs is not a good way to measure team power. First, "capable" doesn't really provide a sense of likelihood. Several of the players you're including average under or just around the 15 HR mark. A team like the Twins may have a smaller group of guys who have hit 15 HRs at a point in their career, yet that group could still out-HR our larger group. These are also two teams who had below AL average power output last year. And the position traditionally reserved for the team bat with the most power, we have chosen to chalk in an inadequacy platoon. Kotsay is a singles-hitter who as a lefty could get the lion's share of DH ABs at this point. Jones clearly has a powerful bat and was no doubt one of the 8 hitters you're speaking of, but his recent performance doesn't inspire much confidence If Jones is performing up to management's expectations, there would be no reason to platoon him. His career stats indicate that he has always been able to hit righties about as well as lefties. His power presence would favor him over Kotsay, even vs righties. Kotsay is better served as a bench player. Now if Jones is not performing then we really have a problem.

QUOTE (WSoxMatt @ Feb 19, 2010 -> 08:07 PM) Damon wants the 2 yrs and Detroit is the ONLY team offering him that right Perhaps he does indeed want 2 years, but do he and his wife want 2 years in Detroit?

For the kind of money now being talked about for Damon, why not revisit the option of Carlos Delgado? He can't play the field, so it looks like his options are limited to an American League team as a DH. So, what team needs a left handed power hitting DH more than the Sox? If he signed with the Sox, he could bat cleanup, right in the middle of all of the right handed hitters: Pierre Beckham Quentin Delgado Konerko A.J. Rios Teahen Ramirez That would add a presence and make the offense formidable. If Delgado struggles vs lefties, there is always Jones as a platoon option. The question is; whose roster spot would Delgado take?

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Feb 6, 2010 -> 04:08 AM) The deal would require Flowers and Hudson. Giving them Paulie, and paying even $10M of his contract would basically make it so instead of Flowers-Hudson-Viciedo-D2-Other it'd be Flowers-Hudson-Paulie-Other. Essentially, to get Gonzalez, you give up the top of our system (aside from Mitchell or D2, as only one would go) Would you do that deal? Konerko, with most of his salary paid, J. Danks, Flowers and Hudson for 2 years of A. Gonzalez seems a little steep, but I think I'd be satisfied even with that, especially if Gonzalez could be signed to a long term deal. However, I doubt the Sox would spend the money needed to get him to stay.

Thanks fellas for the clarification. Well, wouldn't it be worth it to pay almost all of Konerko's salary for 2010 if the Sox could get Gonzalez without having to give up too many prospects. If they could keep Hudson and Flowers, I'd be in favor of giving the Padres Paulie with as much of his contract paid for as they need to make it work for them. Then give them J. Danks and whatever other prospect they'd want, not including Flowers or Hudson.

Would the Padres be interested if Konerko could be included with the prospects, especially if the Sox were willing to pay part of his salary? If the Sox paid $6 of the $12 million owed Konerko, that would bring the total cost of A. G. to about $10.75 million for this year, which is still less than they would owe Konerko. That might help entice the Padres, as they would have a replacement at 1B for Gonzalez, which could appease the fans.

QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Jan 31, 2010 -> 10:44 PM) He might be an asshole but he let's talk about what he brings to the table. He is way better option than Kotsay or Jones, you put him in DH or LF (we don't want both Pierre and Damon on the field at the same time), interchange him with Pierre, that's your decent 1 - 2 combo. Pierre LF/DH Damon LF/DH Beckham 2B Quentin RF Konerko 1B Rios CF AJP C Teahen 3B Ramirez SS Wouldn't it be better to place his left handed bat somewhere in the middle of the lineup? Why not bat him behind Quentin, and in front of Rios. I'd also prefer to separate the other two left handed bats, A. J. and Teahen. How about this lineup vs. Lefties? Pierre LF (he has actually been better vs. lefties over his career) Beckham 2B Quentin RF Damon DH Rios CF A. J. C Konerko 1B Teahen 3B Ramirez SS I like Pierre leading off vs lefties, not only because he has an historically higher OBP vs lefties than righties, but also because he is capable of stealing off a Lefty. Damon would not be running vs a Lefty, at this stage in his career. Against Right Handers: Damon DH (Better OBP vs Righties than Pierre) Beckham Quentin konerko A. J. Rios Teahen Ramirez Pierre LF That still leaves a void of a power left handed bat in the middle of the lineup. That might be one reason to just leave Damon in the clean up spot, although he is not your prototypical clean up hitter. Moreover, both lineups leave Jones out of the equation entirely, and that may not be realistic

The Twins' lineup is as overweighted with left handed hitters as ours is right handed. It's a good thing we have two tough southpaw starters, although I'd rather have Peavy on the mound vs any team. It's too bad that we would never trade with a division rival. We could use one of those left handed bats!!

Whatever happened to the last two Cuban defectors? Yasser Gomez and Yadel Marti were never signed by any MLB team. I can't find any recent news on the Net.

Rios should be in CF. His offensive production is questionable and not up to the level of a corner outfielder. This team needs a bigger bat for the remaining outfield position. I'd prefer to see Jones in RF with Quentin in left and Rios is CF. Rios and Jones provide a better offensive and defensive combination than Gardner and Rios. Of course that still doesn't provide a prototypical lead off guy, but Rios might perform better in that role than the higher pressure run producer role. Let Rios lead off. He has a very good success rate stealing bases. That would leave a left handed DH. as the only remaining offensive hole to fill. I think De Aza already fills the role of a fourth outfielder for speed and defense. He and Gardner are similar players and he's actually a year younger than Gardner. Gardner probably has a better eye at the plate but De Aza probably has a better arm.

No thank you. This guy is not only a cancer in the clubhouse, but he is not the kind of player and person for whom I want to cheer. Perhaps, if the Cubs paid all of his salary so that we could simply release him if he caused problems. But that won't happen because if the Cubs were willing to do that, they would just release him.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Sep 20, 2009 -> 06:27 AM) The Pen needs a complete makeover. How KW will do it, im not sure? Boston seems to have the perfect recipe every year bringing in new arms that can get the job done. KW hopefully will take a few pages out of Theo's notebook. Guys from 2009 that will be back: Thorton and Liney. Nobody will take on Liney's contract and im sure Peavy will have a long talk with KW about how he wants his boy to stay with the team. Thorton is solid once again- he may be a good option as our new closer pending on what KW decides to do with Jenks. That loss vs Seattle really hurt and that really showed me that Jenks doesn't have what he used to have. The time is now to ship him off, bring in some young talented arms or a leadoff hitter. Carrasco will be back as well, and perhaps with a greater role.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Sep 18, 2009 -> 12:05 PM) We're hardly 5.5 games back and we have six more games against the division leading team. Let's not give up, and say we did. Well, if we were playing over .500 ball, and didn't have two teams in front of us, I might agree with you. Moreover, it's 6.5 games, and 7 in the loss column.

This is a .500 team, at best, and has a lot of questions regarding next season. It seems to me that it's now time to play the remainder of the season with an emphasis upon resolving some of those issues. Therefore I hope the Sox will do the following: 1) Shut Gavin down. Playing with that hip could cause him to alter his motion and damage his arm. 2) Shut Peavy down. He is a very competitive guy and is probably pushing himself to get ready for what was thought to be a realistic playoff run. It now seems foolish to risk a premature return. Let the elbow heal completely, and make sure that his legs are really strong enough to pitch without unnecessary strain on his arm. 3) Give most of the catching duties to Flowers. Castro will likely not be brought back, and Flowers could be A. J.'s backup next year. Let's see if he can handle that role, and give him a chance to get some Major League at bats. I would actually prefer to see him catch most of the remaining games, and DH the rest. Flowers and A. J. could alternate catching and DH duties. This is not intended as a slight of A.J. I love him. It's just that I'd like to see Flowers get some valuable experience. 4) Start, and or relieve Hudson and Torres. Perhaps at least one of them can fill a bullpen spot next year. 5) Jhonny Nunez should be used as often as possible instead of Dotel and Lindbrink. He could be another important piece in the Pen. 6) Give Carrasco some later inning work to see if he could take over Dotel's spot. Octavio's contract will be expiring, and it would help to know if they have other options. 7) Matt Thornton should close the rest of the way. Let's see if he could replace Bobby. It will be a difficult decision to pay Jenks the kind of money that he will likely get in arbitration. You have to think that Jenks gives Kenny and Ozzie the same uneasy feeling he now gives us, every time he comes in with the game on the line. 8) In deference to Dye, let him play if he wants to. He may want to play as he will be signing a new contract with someone. Otherwise, shut him down, and let Kotsay get some more playing time in RF. Kotsay may end up being an important piece for next year, so it wouldn't hurt to get him some more at bats. Unfortunately the Sox really don't have any young outfield prospects on the roster whom they could play. 9) If they want to consider moving Alexei, it could be worthwhile to see if Beckham is a Major League SS. I know that management insists that Gordon is their third baseman of the future, but I still drool over the prospects of having him be an All Star shortstop. His bat is much more impressive as a shortstop. There are lots of good hitting thirdbasemen. That would also open up third to C. J. Retherford. I'm just not sold on Alexei defensively, although admittedly, I was sure that he would be just terrific at SS. What a disappointment! 10) Let's see if Tony Pena could handle the set up role. I doubt it, but if Thornton closes and the Sox don't bring back Dotel or Jenks, they may need him there. Does anyone have any other ideas for this scenario of playing the rest of the season for next year? Or, of course, some of you would probably like to debate whether it makes sense to do this. I'm not saying that they have to stop playing hard. I'd just prefer to see some other players giving their best effort, instead of some of the guys who won't, or shouldn't be back next year.