chiguy79

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jun 27, 2007 -> 02:27 PM) It's more about the years than anything else. Considering what Zito, Schmidt, Suppan and Lilly got on the free agent market Mark was looking at 6-7 years at $15-$17M per. As opposed to 4 years, $12.5M per. I think teams this off-season may rethink those 7-year deals after seeing what those clubs got for their huge investments Zito, Schmidt, etc....without the full facts I am guessing that you can count on one hand the # of pitchers who have signed deals >$80mm which is the "market-value" people seem to be throwing around here (ie 5yr $15mm+). While I am a big Buerhle fan, I don't see Mark making that kind of money even as a free agent. Zambrano can get that kind of money becuase I think people pay more for a power pitcher, but Zambrano is also younger with less miles on his arm. Also I think Mark doesn't want to play in NY/Bos/West Coast and likes playing in the midwest so 4/50 or 4/60 is as good of an offer he will get from anyone...that being said if he really wants to play for the cards (which is disputable) I am sure they would step up and do a 4/50 deal with him.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Jun 27, 2007 -> 02:07 PM) They cannot force a player to walk away from a deal he wishes to accept because he wants to stay in a particular place. They can admonish him if they choose, but they cannot quash an extension of 4/50 simply because it is below market-value offer. Several players have chosen to accept below-market deals to accomodate a team which they really wanted to stay with. Buehrle would be perhaps the highest profile to do so, but we're talking about money that 12-18 months ago would have been extremely substantial. Remember, AJ Burnett's deal at 5/55 was viewed as exhorbitant back in 05'. Simply because prices skyrocketted last season does not mean 4/50 is somehow a ridiculous deal. Take your mind out of the current landscape just for a moment, and that's still one hell of an extension. And in 2 years, when Mark is making $12.5 annually, I'll bet there are plenty of pitchers similarly talented that are struggling to get that number annually. I don't know why everyone things 4yr/$60mm is below market. $15mm a year makes him one of the highest paid pitchers in baseball, hell even 4yr/$50mm makes him in the upper echelon...just because Zito got a huge contract doesn't mean every lefty, soft-throwing, innings eater gets $18mm/year. Per USA Today's database, only 5 of the top 25 paid players this year are pitchers and the top 25 paid players are starting at $13.25mm a year, I do believe this database is dated but it gives an idea of where top salaries are currently at. If there is a better list to search please post it. I would argue that anything more than 4yr/$60mm is paying too much and something the sox could regret in the future. http://asp.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/sa....aspx?year=2007

If this is true, I am chalking this up to mark being a good guy and not a super greedy bastard like everyone else and not really giving tons of credit to KW although I guess he deserves some credit for standing by his word....reminds me of the story when Cotts dropped Buerhle off on the side of the highway in Southern IL while waiting for his ride (maybe someone can post that story becuase it is great).

QUOTE(Jimbo @ Jun 27, 2007 -> 10:02 AM) Pllllllllllllllllllllease get rid of Contreras, guchi and Dye(and Mack) And Cintron, Erstad, Pods.... I would think vaz and count should have serious interest, their salaries arent' that high when you consider what the crappy free agents got this year. If that is the current market price they should be moveable with decent prospects in return.

Last Year Second Half: Thome stopped hitting, Contreras and Co. stopped pitching... This Year: Everyone is old, slow and injured. Has anyone ever seen so many infield pop-ups out of an offense. If you breakdown our outs in a game there are probably 10+ strikeout (if a decent pitcher is on the mound) and 5+ weak infield pop-ups. We can't even make good outs these days.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 01:25 PM) Let's stop trashing Meche. He's a quality pitcher who's overcome a lot. The Royals were foolish to sign him because it's unlikely that they'll be too competitive with him short-term, but he's a quality pitcher, and he's better than Vazquez, IMO. They're similar guys. "Great stuff. Inconsistent results." Although Meche has been very good this year, which is what so many scouts were saying. They are more competitive than us!

I think we get something for Buehrle and Dye. I also think we can get something (not much) for Mack. Hopefully we can move Erstad as well. Can someone please explain to me why Cintron is still on the club, the guy swings like he is playing 16" softball. Also, why do we continue to play the journeyman minor leaguers and major league bench players when our prospects could be getting some solid experience...this continues to baffle my mind. It will be interesting to see what the "target" payroll figure is next year as that will determine how aggressive we are in the firesale, I wouldn't be surprised if we are in the $70-$75mm range (or less) as I am sure they expect ticket sales to drop significantly.

under your plan you wouldn't save any money over the next two years because 80% of season ticket holders would bail out next year and avg. attendance would be ~12,000/game.

I agree the intensity isn't as much as it used to be and I could pretty much care less about the cubs these days but if you can't enjoy this series for what it is and how unique and fun it is to have two teams in the same city who pretty much despise each other than you pretty much suck at life. These are unfortunatly probably the last "meaningful" games of the year so enjoy it...lets beat the crap out of Zambrano today and wake up this team... okay I am amped now, time to go change into my baines jersey and get to the game early...

yes, beware of people cutting. Or you could try to buy the seats from someone who has the upper seats (check the ticket exchange and craigslist), if it is a popular game the seats are as good as gone. (Probably off-duty cops getting hooked up by security guard friends)

FYI- that is for the seats in front of the bar (ie looking through the fence) the seats on top are season ticket packages / auctioned by the sox. At least that is what is was last year.

QUOTE(South Side Fireworks Man @ Jun 19, 2007 -> 04:02 PM) They can build a rotation around Buehrle, Garland and Danks and get whatever they can for Javy and Jose. We are all in agreeement here, they need to figure things out quickly, if we get left with little/nothing for these guys and they walk we will really be setting ourselves back. Keek Buehrle trade the other guys. Crede is on the market as soon as he comes back also.

"Cintron, Crede, Garland, Hall, Ozuna (if he makes it back), AJ, Pods, Thome" So in '08 our bench needs to be replaced, that shouldn't be that hard. Crede will be gone long before the end of '08 if he isn't gone by then he will have no value and the sox won't resign him or we will hope they don't resign him by then, cintron/hall/ozuna/pods are all easily replaceable, I think AJ is pretty critical to keep and think he will want to stay here as every other team may not want him for his "baggage", thome will be replaced by konerko and the team will save $$s by not signing thome or will hopefully try to get a more versatile player, chances are we are in a youth movement by then so all these guys are expendable. We should resign garland as he is underappreciated but one of the few consistent pitchers we currently have. Can one of our rookies please step up, the other night with Owens, Uribe, Cintron in the lineup it is like three automatic outs, not much different than last year with pods/anderson/uribe being three automatic outs...nice to see us actually get worse with the 8,9,1 spots...at least last year the rest of the order was solid...

If the sox keep playing like this you will be able to get very good season tickets next year...last two games I have been to have had about five minutes worth of suspense and "positive" play... it is time to start pulling out more mock cheers, (ie any time someone gets to second base we should have a standing O) Having an old team with injury histories has finally caught up to the sox, having no position player talent in the minors makes things worse. I don't see the sox signing any of their free agents and I think if Crede comes off the DL and has a good two weeks they dump him also. If they don't keep Iguchi, the only positions next year where we will have decent players at is 1B/DH/C, our bench pretty much sucks since pablo got hurt also. I know I am being very negative but I was counting on a bit of a run in June to get back into this and instead we fell 5 games further back. I don't see Jerry R. keeping a $100mm payroll and an aging team of high-paid players. The shame is that the season ticket fan base will evaporate and we will be right back where we were pre-2005, $75-$80mm payroll, a few bonafide players surrounded by youth, and every year hoping that we can get on a roll and then buy some players (Robbie Alomar, Carl Everett) at the all star break. Hopefully the sox don't go the route of firesale or not resigning their free agents to save dollars as I think it is important to try to retain the positive momentum with the fan base. I may just start rewatching the WS DVD instead of getting frustrated watching the current edition.

Last night was one of the first games I watched where I could relax a bit early on...will take a few more of those! Lets win tonight to keep the momentum up, our schedule favors us the next couple of weeks and with DET/CLE playing each other hopefully we can get back on top of the division.

Who cares that there weren't fireworks for one night, so three people were upset. I went to the game with my GFs small yappy dog and I know most of the people (including those not with dogs) were happy to see all the different dogs at the game and probably didn't even notice the fireworks. Not to mention it allowed the sox to sell a large # of extra tickets to a Royals game. I don't like sitting near 20, 8-year old girls who scream the whole game but I don't try to get them banned from the stadium...can we at least do away with the fan-o-meter...

I have four available for the game today section 152, row 11, asking $20/each, can pick up in loop call my cell if you want them 312.543.9802

I have not witnessed so many weak popups as yesterday's game it was ridiculous... What was more ridiculous is that Ozzie didn't pull garland after three straight batters ripped the ball, oh well lets leave him in for a 3-run homer to put it away. I also called Sosa's clean-up shot, nothing like a fairly meaningless 3-run homer. Also after we had runners on base three straight batters went to 0-2 in the count, ridiculous. Ventura lives on a huge ranch on the central coast, he is loving life...why F that up...

Jose will probably be on the 15 day DL by the end of the week...either that or he will throw a shut out in his second start...I hope option B.

I am already taking s*** from cubs fans in my office...jose get with it... can we get get a frickin immaculate thunderstorm right now and call the game...restart with a double header tomorrow?

Not sure this changes anyones opinion on the trade but interesting none the less... Garcia was pulled yesterday and his right bicept is getting examined...his velocity is/was way down again this spring. In 7 2/3 innings this spring, Garcia has a 9.39 ERA. He has allowed 10 hits, eight runs, all earned, walked five and struck out two. Story: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/spring2007/n...tory?id=2807526

an interesting game of leverage on both sides...I don't think Lance will walk from $7+mm this year. Those are big checks to pass up and he isn't the best player in the league to be pulling shots like he is. At this point I would test his word as he is probably tarnished to the point that trade offers are going to be crap...

I am not too impressed with this game...and of course by my fifth game my Xbox froze, then when trying to reboot I got the three red lights of death on my 360... No fix, warrantee had expired two months ago so $140 repair and $30 shipping charge to fix it...I had no issues with the 360 up to this point and then it just dies. So I can't make further judgement on the game until I get my 360 back...and I am pissed at microsoft for making a product that dies after 1 year of light play... Also FYI, microsoft said not to get that extra cooling fan as they have seen many melt onto the xbox, I didn't have the fan and never had my system lock up but it only took the one time. the contract negotiations do suck and the fielding is a bit off kilter. The graphics and music is really good. And I like the announcers which can be brutal for some games.

I know they started shipping them out early this week so most should be arriving today or early next week! If they are sitting on my porch when I get home I am going to be pissed at the delivery guy...

contract talk did not sound promising...