Dick Allen

Touring facilities, looking at housing is all basic stuff. Don't read too much into it.

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Nov 30, 2005 -> 10:35 AM) If Paulie gets 13 each yr for 4 years here or 13 each yr for 5 years somewhere else, what's he going to take? Is he going to hang the Sox on the 5th year? He should especially if its the Angels. Anaheim is the perfect place for him, they train 15 miles from his home. That's 6 weeks per year of being able to stay in your primary residence which is huge considering his newborn, and probably plans for more. Anaheim is a lot closer to his home than Chicago. The weather is great. He is quiet and may not crave the spotlight, although that sometimes seems hard to believe. There have been a few posts on Paulie maybe being able to get more endorsement money in Chicago. I really question whether he really is interested in that.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 30, 2005 -> 10:27 AM) Owens is still very raw and I'm still not sure whether he's ready. I would like to give him another year in aaa and then give him a shot to make the team in 07 and I'm pretty positive the sox feel the same way. Dave Wilder, the same guy who said Bobby Jenks was ready last season, thought Owens was ready in August.

Considering Paulie's hip was the main reason Lasorda traded him to Cincinatti, and considering all the talk about Paulie's hip on this board in 2003 especially, his hip condition should be no surprise to anyone here. Considering the White Sox and Paulie when questioned have always denied there was even a small issue with his hip, the fact that this leaked out now from a "high ranking" White Sox official may give some credence to fathom's theory.

QUOTE(Steff @ Nov 30, 2005 -> 06:22 AM) Yes, and it is. :rolly I still think his 2003 struggles were hip- related. Paulie also looks thinner (not just his hair) to me the past couple of years, maybe to take some of weight and pressure off his hip? There was nothing noticeable about Belle's hip when he played for the White Sox, and considering how quickly he went from being basically an ironman playing every inning of every game to not being able to play at all, it would make me very leery of giving Konerko the same contract.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:29 PM) Marte didn't get the job done. He gave up baserunners to the tune of a 1.72 WHIP and guys like Politte and Cotts bailed him out. There's a reason Marte's ERA was only 3.77 last season. It isn't wise to get rid of talented players because of a bad season. If that was team policy, Konerko would have hit his 80+ home runs the last couple seasons for someone else. Also Politte would have been let go after his horrible 2004.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:25 PM) The walks mean nothing because Marte hadn't pitched in awhile? What? Do you remember what he did in ALDS against the Red Sox? You act like Marte wasn't walking guys all season, and postseason, long. I never said the guy was lights out all season. He was brutal against Boston. He was great even with the walks against Houston and as the poster above stated he was getting squeezed then. This is a guy who is used to a large number of appearances. Most pitchers tend to be a little wild when they don't pitch as much as they are used to.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:17 PM) Is Ozzie going to fix his head? Are the Chicago fans going to fix his head? To me it seems its pretty clear Marte cant fix his own head, so who is? Marte has shown in the past and although very inconsistently in 2005, that he can get the job done. He had a sore arm that he had to pitch through, and he didn't do it well. When he had no pain, he was dominant. When there was a little pain he wouldn't finish his pitches. An offseason can fix his head, and hopefully his bicep is completely healed.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:18 PM) Marte still walked two batters in those 1.2 innings and had to be relieved for Buehrle to get the save. For a guy who hadn't pitched forever, and had gone through what he had gone through, he was very impressive. Those walks meant nothing, and Buerhle wasn't brought in because of ineffectiveness.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:16 PM) I never said I understood that either. I think your wrong to about that many people thinking that. However, with the negitive attitude you seem to bring, it doesnt suprise me that is your thinking.. Negative attitude? I'm the one supporting a White Sox player and White Sox minor leaguers. I don't want Mike Myers. I think he sucks. I see the hundreds upon hundreds of posts about bringing back Thomas. All I have to say is in my opinion Marte is a far safer bet to count on than Frank. And he's cheaper too. I don't understand how that's being negative.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:12 PM) Marte pitched well for 2 innings in Game 3 of the World Series. He was awful for the entire regular season and the rest of the postseason. You are letting Marte's 2 most recent good innings slant your perspective. 2 innings in a World Series game when the entire bullpen was spent. If Myers had to pitch 2 innings, the World Series most likely wouldn't have been a sweep. The guy also had a couple of good outings after he was thrown off the team and returned. Sure he was as inconsistent as a pitcher could be, sure he had his problems, but he also showed more than a few times he still can be very dominating when his head is right.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:07 PM) I just dont understand why people are so behind Marte. He has had two above average seasons since 2003, and looks like a completley different pitcher than he was in 2003. On top of all that, from all reports he isnt the most well recieved player on the team. What makes you think Marte can get back to 2003 form? What has he shown you to tell you that? I think it is far more reasonable to think Damaso Marte can be a dominant LH relief pitcher again than the pipedream many around here have of Frank Thomas being able to hit 40 homers drive in 120 runs again.

QUOTE(AddisonStSox @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:03 PM) Academic at this point. Ozzie and Marte can't co-exist next year for a full season. One could not but help get the impression Ozzie--despite using Marte--didn't even want him back last season after that little stunt he pulled-whether or not Ozzie fueled the flames or not is beside the point. Yes, it would appear Marte is better than Myers. Is Marte better than Myers on THIS team? Marte's value now comes in his trade-value. We've all said he won't be a part of the 2006 roster. This rumor simply re-assures that line of thinking. I am of the opinion Marte is better for the White Sox than Myers. I think Marte pitched well in the playoffs and can take that good feeling with him to spring training, and be as good as ever. I'm also of the opinion trading him won't get you a player better than Mueller or Nomar, so you would be better off keeping him and signing one of those two.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 05:00 PM) First of all, one of the reasons Myers has been on so many teams is because he's 36 years old. The other reason is because he's a situational lefty. He's great against lefties but he should not even be used against righties. This makes him less valuable for a roster spot than a reliever that can get lefties and righties out like Neal Cotts. But the way Ozzie likes to use lefties, Myers would be great addition to our bullpen. The most I see Myers making would be $1.5 million for the season. For a situational lefty who is lights out against left handed batters, his career ERA isn't very impressive. If Ozzie brings him in to face anyone but another teams top left handed hitters, they will be immediately pinch hit for and the White Sox would be in trouble.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 04:33 PM) Why should we "Just say no" to Myers? -We all know how much Oz loves his matchups. Myers has CLEARLY shown that he is great against LH hitters, and thats about it. Thats all we need him for anyway. Hell, Marte was worse against LH hitters anyway. If you bring in Myers, and ship Marte, that also will give Cotts more room to shine, which he deserves. With Marte gone, I can almost promise that you will see more Neal. -You want the Sox to try and fix Marte. At one point during the season, after Marte had left the team, Ozzie said he didnt watch to pitch Marte at home because he was worried about the fans booing him and if Marte could take it. There comes a point of no return, and I think that is it. The old baseball term " Player A needs a change of scenery" seems to apply here. -Myers is going to come cheap. I would expect maybe 1.7-2 mil a year, maybe more(could be off) You then in turn can get another piece for this team with Marte. Like many have said here, including you, that Marte can turn it around and be one of the best. You package Marte up with Sweeney or Owens, and you got yourself a nice package. Sign me up for Mike Myers. If Myers were so great, he wouldn't have modeled as many uniforms as he has. Marte can be fixed. He was hurt early in the season, and his first appearance back he was unhittable. The bicep pain returned. He didn't deal with it well. Then he comes late and is basically thrown off the team, while others who have come to the park late quietly pay their fine and nothing is said of it. Frank Thomas was booed mercilessly a few years ago, and he was able to fall back into the good graces of the fans. Marte can too. He was excellent in his World Series appearance. Eventually, Myers, even with Ozzie managing is going to have to get a right handed batter out. That is not going to be pretty. Marte is better than Myers. The Sox don't need to be trading Owens or Sweeney either. Exactly what are you going to bring in to improve the team after you have weakened the bullpen and minor league pool? I don't think its worth it. There are decent free agents who wouldn't be too expensive to fill the Sox holes. Mueller and Nomar are a couple.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 04:36 PM) Presumably there could be a risk of him being charged with something along the lines of obstruction of justice if he insists he did nothing, possibly testifies as to that point, and then takes a drug test which proves the opposite. If he's as clean as he says he would have nothing to worry about.

By July, Mike Myers would leave you longing for Damaso Marte. Just say no to Myers. I think the Sox should work on fixing Marte. When he's right, and he's been right most of the time he has been on the team, he is as good as there is .

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 11:04 AM) Excellent point. Although his advisors should have told him that "No comment" works way better than “Um, I’ll get back to you on that, first I need to check the legality of it.” Last time I checked, its perfectly legal for Irvin to take a drug test. What kind of legal issue is he checking on? This is a guy who was caught with the pipe on him. Maybe it isn't is, but his story would make anyone wonder. If he really wanted to clear his name, taking a test immediately probably would be the best thing to do, unless he just wants a few days to flush his system.

QUOTE(White Sox Josh @ Nov 29, 2005 -> 12:42 PM) My Ideal Lineup for next season: 1. Pods LF 2. Uribe SS 3. Thome 1B 4. Thomas DH 5. Iguchi 2B 6. Dye RF 7. Crede 3B 8. Pierzynski C 9. Anderson CF I would rather spend money on Frank and strengthen the bench than pay Konerko $14 Million now that we got Thome. Sign a good bench player like LeCroy or trade for Stairs. Both of those can step in if Frank gets hurt again and they both have a lot of pop. So you would rather spend money and count on a guy who may not be able to play at all, let alone a full schedule? I can guarantee you, KW won't be counting on a full healthy season from the Big Hurt in 2006.

Signing Frank Thomas to a contract before he can prove he is 100% healthy is not an example of spending money wisely.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Nov 28, 2005 -> 02:43 PM) I think the Ordonez backlash was almost all from his lying to the team and calling the organization and its leaders liars, and cheats essentially. To me it seemed like the monetary amount didn't matter, but his dirty dealings are what pissed off people the most. No one complains about Robin Ventura taking more money from the Mets do they? I think if Ordonez hadn't tried to get down and dirty with the Sox, not many would have faulted him for taking that much more money. Ventura got lowballed by Schueler. He made him an offer that wasn't close to what he was being offered elsewhere. I agree, Ordonez was ripped for his comments, but he also was called greedy. People should bow to him. If he re-signed with the Sox, the wait would be up to 89 years now.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 28, 2005 -> 02:39 PM) He would never get booed here unless he decided to bad mouth the organization upon on his departure *cough cough* I agree. The only way Paulie gets booed at USCF is if he signs with the Sox, and stinks up the joint his last couple years of the contract.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Nov 28, 2005 -> 12:40 PM) I can't blame Konerko one iota for testing the waters to see what his value is. And let's say the Angels do offer him $15M per for 5 years and the Sox offer $13 per for 4 with an option on the 5th year, I don't think Paulie's a bad guy for taking the Angels offer. The difference in guaranteed money is $23M. Does anyone really expect a guy to leave that much money on the table for the sake of loyalty? It's a business, too. Just like when Kenny Williams couldn't consider the 'loyalty' issue when he traded Rowand. I would never blame a player for taking the money. But how many on this board lit into Ordonez for taking $75 million from Detroit, and lit into him for hiring Boras, who is well known for getting his clients maximum dollars, when the White Sox offered him $60 million and he turned it down? I think the Sox are making a mistake putting a deadline on Konerko re-signing, unless they really wouldn't be all that upset he refuses their offer.

Where would he play?

Frank is going to have to show he is healthy before he gets a contract. That won't be for some time, if ever. I would think AL teams that don't get the big bats they were looking at this winter may have an interest in him right before spring training. Oakland, Baltimore, Minnesota, there will be several teams that will be willing to take a chance if the price is right and he is physically capable of playing, which is going to be the biggest question.