Dick Allen

The sad thing is Crede probably won't get an error.

QUOTE(South Side Fireworks Man @ Aug 12, 2005 -> 03:17 PM) The team that worries me most about claiming Griffey before the Sox is the Angels. They might want him for the same role we do--DH and occasional OFer. Let's hope we hear something soon. I think if the Angels don't grab him, he's ours. The Angels may grab him thinking there is no way he would accept playing there, thus not really risking anything and keeping other teams from acquiring him.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 06:18 PM) "I enjoy being in Chicago," Griffey told WMVP-AM 1000 during the Reds' visit to Chicago this week to play the Cubs. "My family comes here a lot. I do have control. The Reds and Chicago have to make a deal." From the man's mouth. Anyone ready to get their hopes up again only to see this thing not happen? Did he really say that? I thought he told Levine his first choice would be to stay in Cincinatti.

QUOTE(JUGGERNAUT @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 02:19 PM) I don't know if this helps boost your hope but I do not believe the need for KGJ to clear ML waivers will have any impact on the White Sox getting him. It comes down to the White Sox making an offer the Reds owner can't refuse. It's as simple as that. It makes no sense for the Reds to request ML waivers on KGJ just to dump his contract on another team. They can do that with SPL waivers after the season. With the season he's having they have to weigh the risk of him getting hurt over the next 2 months vs his trade potential for & during the 2006 season. It doesn't help that KGJ played a major role in sweeping the Cubs. The owner is probably feeling pretty good right now. The Reds supposedly agreed to trade Griffey for Young, Rogo and a lower prospect. They were also willing to pick up approx. $15 million of what's left on his contract. Now ask yourself, if you were the Reds, would you rather have Young, Rogo and a lower prospect or $15 million. I think I would rather have the $15 million. I don't think the Reds would mind dumping his contract on another team, in fact, if someone claimed him, I think they would be stupid not to let him go. They have enough outfielders, they aren't going to contend for a while. Griffey can get seriously hurt at any moment, his value is not going to get any higher, and this would free up some money to get some pitching. And as great as Griffey was against the Cubs, the owner can't feel too good about being in 5th place in their division.

My buddy who is a serious Cub fan was at a Cub game one time when Bullinger was getting lit up. He was screaming at him, telling him how much he sucked and so forth. Well, Bullinger finally gets yanked and the people in the row behind him stand up and start clapping saying we love you, Jim. It turns out he was sitting right in front of his family.

My cousin lives in Kildeer, and fences around your yard are not allowed. Its strange driving down the street to his house. There are several in- ground pools in people's yards with no fences. It would have to be a nightmare for people with young kids living there.

Can the PTBNL option be used in August?

QUOTE(JUGGERNAUT @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 10:20 AM) If you guarantee it then I would expect you to certainly have proof of it Let's recap this debate so we know where it stands. We both agree that a player can be placed, withdrawn, or clear waivers without it being reported SO LONG AS it does not change that player's status as it pertains to their being on the 25 man or 40 man roster. Where we disagree is that you believe most (601+) players are put on waivers from Aug 1st to Sep 1st 12AM EST & I do not. You have offered no factual evidence to support your assertion & I have offered factual evidence opposing your assertion. Neither of us have provided indisputable evidence which is why the debate lingers on. But common sense would strongly suggest that given the public interest & value of such information when marquee players are put on waivers someone is going to write about it. On a side note, if such information is confidential wouldn't there be an uproar when Levine reports that KGJ is on waivers? Didn't Kevin Shea say that such information is confidential in MLB rules &/or the CBA? So who's crapping who? I skimmed the CBA & didn't find anything about confidentiality of waivers. Where is your proof that the Remlinger deal was agreed on before he was DFA, and that the Moyer deal was agreed on before he was placed on waivers?

QUOTE(YASNY @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 09:56 AM) July 31 ... I think. Yes, July 31

QUOTE(JUGGERNAUT @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 09:49 AM) I will be kind in my reply & give an example of your logic: A: A is a fact because I told you so. B: A is not a fact because I told you so. A: It is too a fact because you can't prove it's not. B: It is not a fact because you can't prove it is. And so A & B argue endlessly without being able to prove anything. What's the point? With respect to Moyer why was he put on waivers? To facilitate a trade to the NYY$. He was not put on waivers just to gauge interest. The two GM's had talked over the trade parameters prior to Seattle putting him on waivers. This is common sense stuff. My point was Moyer was placed on waivers and it was not in any paper or any news report. I never said waivers was to gauge interest. I'm pretty sure every GM has a pretty good idea who has interest in all their players. I will guarantee you hundreds of players have either cleared waivers or have been placed on waivers since July 31.

Hawk, who at one time was a GM was talking about irrevocable waivers the other night.

QUOTE(JUGGERNAUT @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 09:30 AM) This is too easy If it never gets reported then what basis do you have for your statement? How do you know that Frank has been put on waivers repeatedly? Where did you get that information if it was never reported? Let's try to use common sense here. If a player is placed on waivers then all MLB teams know about it as does the player's union & player himself. There is no confidentiality agreement governing this information. So it's ridiculous to suggest ALL or even most marquee players get put on waivers & no one ever reports it. Put another way, if the NYY$ put A-Rod, Jeter, Posada, Randy Johnson, or Mike Mussina on waivers do you really believe not one NY reporter would write about it? Did you hear about Jaime Moyer being placed on waivers last week? NO. You heard he declined a trade to the Yankees, who claimed him ON WAIVERS. Most players on the 40 man are place on waivers this time of year, and its not a big deal, because for 99% of them if they are claimed will be pulled off the list.

QUOTE(JUGGERNAUT @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 09:10 AM) I'd be willing to accept the reasoning that a team can place a player on waivers & then withdraw him before the 3 days & it never gets reported. That seems reasonable since no action occurs with respect to that player. I doubt very much that GM's do that with all their players because the player's agents would find out about it. But if the player is then DFA'd, claimed, or traded then that transaction would definitely be reported. In the case of marquee player's like Manny we've already seen that the act of a team placing such a player on waiver's gets reported. That's the main reason why I don't believe KGJ has been put on waivers. How could such an act escape reporters in NY? How could Levine be the only one to report about it? It makes no sense. Frank Thomas has been place on and cleared waivers several times. You don't read about it in the paper. If Griffey clears though, we probably will here about it in a column by Stark or Nightengale.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 08:58 AM) Here's a question for you guys: If Griffey makes it to the Sox to they put a claim in on him or just let him pass through? If they claim him they might be able to get him for absolutely no players just take on that crazy contract, also this negates any chance of another team(the yankees) making a trade for Jr. Unless they have an agreement that Cincinatti wouldn't just award him to them, I don't think KW and JR would want to take the chance of being stuck with the entire contract. In the agreed upon deal, Cincinatti was going to be paying between $13.5 to $18 million of that contract.

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 08:45 AM) Im actually kind of worried that Griffey would clear waivers, and the Reds would work out a trade with someone other than the Sox. I dont think the problem for the Sox is worrying wether he will make it through waivers rather it is wether the Sox will be the one that the Reds deal with. The White Sox are the last team in line to put in a waiver claim. So the only chance they would have of acquiring him is if all the other teams passed. Considering they already had a deal agreed upon, and most other contenders would be very leery of his contract, if Griffey were to clear waivers and was going to be moved the White Sox would have to be considered the favorites to land him. Another waiver claim in which the player was awarded to the claiming team trying to block a trade was Jose Canseco when he went to the Yankees. I believe it was from TB. That was an entirely different circumstance than Griffey though. His contract was up at the end of the season, and he rotted on the Yankees bench.

QUOTE(BlackBetsy @ Aug 11, 2005 -> 08:18 AM) Well, let's think about who might claim him to block the trade....note, this is not where Griffey would be WILLING to go (just teams that would be willing to take on his salary, a la Canseco/Yankees a few years ago). National League (goes first, in order of waiver claim): Colorado - May not be willing to take on salary, but could claim to get * player Pittsburgh - No chance, too much $$ San Francisco - They could take on $$, could use CF with Grissom done. Dodgers - Salary maxxed out, also have Milton Bradley Arizona- Salary maxxed out. Chicago Cubs - With Patterson out of the picture in CF for now, they could put in a claim. Star power helps with team image. Milwaukee - No chance. San Diego - It's a possibility they put in a claim to get him for stretch run and trade him over the winter, but not really likely. NY Mets - Nope, they have Beltran Florida - Not with salary as is and Pierre in CF Washington - This could work. They have no true centerfielder and are looking for star power for new ownership. They can take on additional salary. Jim Bowden (who acquired Griffey for Cincy) is the GM Philadelphia - Probably not. Houston - Won't take on salary Atlanta - Andruw Jones. Nuff said. St. Louis - Have Edmonds. So, from the NL, I see as possibilities - San Francisco, the Cubs, San Diego and Washington. Here's the AL Order: Kansas City - No chance Tampa Bay - No chance Seattle - Not with all the salary they took on before this year. Detroit - Probably not with the salary taken on before season. Baltimore - Possible. Team needs star power, and has been willing to spend Texas - Unlikely. Minnesota - Yeah right. Carl Pohlad owns them. (They also have Torii Hunter) Toronto - Nope. NY Yankees - Tony Womack is playing CF. They can take on salary. I'd be surprised if they DIDN'T claim him. I'd also be surprised if he agreed to be traded to NY. Cleveland - Not likely to add salary, and have Grady Sizemore in CF. Oakland - No way. Just re-signed Kotsay. LA Angels - Not likely, with Finley in CF. Boston - Not with Damon in CF. So, in the AL, Baltimore and the Yankees are possibilities for a claim. All in all, I'd say there's about a 5% chance he clears waivers to the White Sox. There is not a chance in hell Angelos would take on Griffey's entire contract with his injury history. The Yankees may claim him, but I doubt it unless they have something worked out for a trade. They don't have the money to burn this year, and would be locked into Griffey for a long time. I would be real surprised if Griffey didn't clear waivers. There is too much of an injury history with too much money left on the table.

Griffey waivers can always be revoked. I'm sure he either will be placed on waivers or already has been. And I would bet the owner of the Reds would rather have the money the GM and President of the Reds agreed to pay than the prospects the White Sox were sending back. FWIW, Steve Phillips is taking credit for all the waiver claims being made the past several years. He said he claimed 150 players on waivers in 1997 in order to block trades.

It certainly appears as if the rumor that KW had a deal for Griffey in place before the deadline was true. It's really too bad it didn't happen, because offense is definitely hard to come by these days. In the last nine games the Sox only scored as many as 5 runs in one game. Their record could be even more dominating. I also think Hawk knows more about what's going on than most, and he keeps saying after Rowand makes another spectacular catch, "Where would he play", I think knowing that Griffey coming here isn't happening. Word of advice to Hawk, don't ask where Griffey would play during games where Timo Perez is your DH batting fifth.

QUOTE(SuperSteve @ Aug 10, 2005 -> 03:45 PM) That is such a petty reason IMHO. Its 6 weeks to be with his family, and he was given partial no-trade rights when he signed a contract that was at the time for him well below market value.

If you knew the Sox would score exactly 2 runs in each of these 3 games how many do you think you would have thought they'd have won? Since the 2nd inning of Game 1, the Yankees scored 2 freaking runs.

QUOTE(Steff @ Aug 10, 2005 -> 02:02 PM) Skanks. Lucky him

Jeter gets a lot of chicks.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Aug 10, 2005 -> 01:51 PM) he is not getting his jumps like before. WTF is wrong with scotty. Stealing bases beats you up. Getting 70 last year may even be playing a part. I'm sure everybody who has ever played fantasy baseball knows steals drop as the season goes on.

QUOTE(Brian @ Aug 10, 2005 -> 01:49 PM) Good call by Bruce, Thank you for not f***ing us over. Bruce wants this game to end. He's hungry.

Pods needs to be PH for