iamshack

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jul 10, 2007 -> 12:05 PM) I have no problem with Rowand being signed at 3 years, $15-$18M but there needs to be another very productive RF brought in as well. Rowand alone isn't nearly enough. I guess there is a possibility Aaron would sign for something like 6/18, but I'm not seeing it. He's having a nice year offensively, there is the perception that he is nearly unmatched defensively, and he has a very solid image as a "team player" and all that nonsense. I think he's going to want more than 3 years, and I think he's going to be looking in the 8-9 million range. Just my humble opinion though.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jul 10, 2007 -> 10:54 AM) I actually didn't mind that lineup. I guess I'm not really certain how it's going to get any better.... I'd much rather keep the starting rotation strong and go cheap at some other positions than dealing Jon for someone who may or may not pan out. With a solid rotation, and hypothetically, Ichiro leading off, with Aaron in CF rather than the production we've got there thus far, a more experienced Josh Fields, a faster 2B and SS, how could it honestly be worse than what this year's offense has produced? And honestly, if MacDougal and Thornton could get it going again, along with Logan, we really don't need all that much else in the bullpen. The problem this year was MacDougal started failing, then Aardsma, then everyone. But if that 7th-8th inning stretch guy can just be effective for us, and there is a reasonable chance Mac can get it back together, then the problems would be far less magnified. As for the bench players, looking at the numbers of Cintron/Mackowiak/Hall/etc, how could that bench possibly be much worse than the numbers put up by the current one? I just think with continued strong starting pitching, and some youth and speed on this team, it could get the job done scoring runs more consistently than the offense we have now, which should be the goal. When your starters' ERA is around 4, you can win with consistent run production, such as in 05', as opposed to the slugging approach we've had for so long here...

Well, I know other posters have brought this up, but who knows why Ichiro would want to come to this team next year in the first place... Assuming he somehow would, I think it's pretty fair to assume he's going to get a deal somewhere along the lines of 4/52 or possibly even more if some team gets stupid. If you're paying $13 million for Ichiro, that really limits your chances of getting Rowand. What does everyone think Rowand will get in FA? Assuming he cools off a bit, but continues his solid play this season, what would he be worth on the market? To the White Sox? What sort of discount would he take? Would he do something along the lines of 4/30? 4/36? For the sake of argument, let's say the average annual salary for both Ichiro and Rowand would be $22 million...can we afford that? Assuming we go cheap at 2b with Richar, the other OF position with Sweeney, acquire a cheap ss through trading Dye and/or Contreras, and keep our bullpen basically the same or with one minor addition, it can be done. But it would be tight- very tight. This would also mean moving or not resigning Mackowiak/Cintron/Tadahito/Pods/Erstad/Toby Hall (although it may be impossible to move him)/Uribe/and possibly Crede. Would something like this work for people? 1. Ichiro RF $13 million 2. Richar 2B $400 K 3. Konerko 1B $12 million 4. Thome DH $8 million 5. Fields 3B $500 K 6. Pierzynski C $5.5 million 7. Rowand CF $9 million 8. SS $400 k 9. Sweeney LF $400 K Bench 1. Andy Gonzalez $500K 2. Pablo Ozuna $1.05 million 3. Jerry Owens $500K 4. Gustavo Molina $500K 5. Brian Anderson $500K 1. Buehrle $14 million 2. Garland $12 million 3. Vazquez $11.5 million 4. Danks $500 K 5. Floyd $500 K 6. Jenks $800 K 7. Thornton $875K 8. MacDougal $1.95 million 9. Masset $500K 10. Logan $600K 11. Vasquez? $400K All this comes in at about $95,875,000 I know it's a rough sketch, but does it work for anyone? Are we better with that lineup out there?

I've heard Drayton McClane is refusing to deal Lidge because he does not believe they are out of the playoff race...sounds like he has a bit of Kenny in him....although he does have some history on his side....

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jul 9, 2007 -> 10:25 PM) No but I would deal him at the deadline. Fields is the future at 3B. My roomate and I were discussing this this afternoon. The question becomes, how do you play Joe and build his trade value without stunting Josh's development? Do you platoon them? Does Josh rotate between third and left field and dh? I'm already feeling the pain at third without Joe, even though I have been saying for a year or so that Joe's defense is taken for granted. But I guess this is one of the side-effects of signing Mark- even if Joe does somehow make a full recovery- we don't have the money to sign him long term. It's going to be a difficult situation for Ozzie getting Joe the pt he needs to build his value without messing with Fields' development too much. I guess we'll know more by season's end.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jul 9, 2007 -> 03:25 PM) This rumor came out after the Pads acquired Bradley. Regardless the Pads have a need to significantly upgrade the offense. Yes, the rumor came out, and it was in the past tense...The timeframe of when these discussions went on was most likely prior to their acquisition of Bradley. Simply because we did not hear of it before the acquisition of Bradley means little. I think they would have rather avoided acquiring Bradley if they could get Dye at a reasonable price; once they heard our price, they went ahead and got Bradley for far less and figured they would put up with his attitude.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jul 9, 2007 -> 02:54 PM) Buehrle, Garland and Vazquez = $37.5M for 2008 Buehrle, Glarland, Vazquez, Konerko, Thome = $58M for 2008 Buehrle, Garland and Vazquez = $40M for 2009 and beyond. Buehrle, Garland, Vazquez and Konerko = $52M for 2009 and beyond I guess if the Sox are willing to go to a $115-$120M payroll in the near future, things could work out because I don't know where any cheap alternatives at other positions are going to come from considering the Sox' lack of position prospects and trading chips. Kalapse, you and I have been sort of pointing this out for the past month or so, regarding the large % of payroll tied up in a few players. I agree, it makes it difficult to have a deep team with so much tied into so few. However, if we're going to put it into anywhere, it may as well be starting pitching. I think the Twins and the A's have proven you can win division titles with solid pitching, even if your offense is underwhelming because of young position players. While we have few positional prospects who look as though they will be very big impact players, I think with a few well-timed trades and some good mixing and matching by Ozzie next year, this team can compete. We don't necessarily need to have big name, star players in the field, but more so some fundamentally sound guys who make contact, can run the bases, and catch the ball. Obviously, the bullpen needs to pitch better also. But IMO, we can form a reasonably competitive team with the remaining $50 million there. We just need to make the right moves and mix and match the right personnel.

The Padres already passed on this deal and acquired Milton Bradley. They no longer have any interest in Dye.

Actually, he did a good job with the exception of about three pitches I thought. He called two of the highest strikes I have ever seen called in mlb, one on Tadahito Iguchi and another on Josh Fields. He also made another call on Iguchi that I thought was a poor one, but other than that, he did a fair job. Silva made it easy on him for the most part, because all the guy does is throw strikes, but it has got to be sort of difficult umpiring for Javy, because he has such movement on his pitches. All in all, the guy did a nice job...just completely missed a few pitches that were above letter high on Gooch and Fields.

Now that Buehrle has been extended, we, as Sox fans, must begin to get accustomed to having to go cheaap at several positions right now. There is no money to gamble $8 million on Jermaine Dye. We've got a larger hole to fill at CF, and the leadoff spot, and so what little excess room we have left in the payroll must be directed at filling that need. After that, we're going to have to find something affordable or dirt cheap at SS and RF, and at 2B if Richar doesn't prove he can field the position. I'm still pining for Chin Lung Hu in the Dodgers system, who is very capable with the glove right now, just needs a bit more time with the bat, but could be ready by 08'.

I truly don't understand this obsession with trading Javy. The guy has finally begun to pitch like the guy everyone thought he was in 01'-03', and NOW we want to deal him? This is the guy we thought he could be when we dealt Chris Young for him, and now we've got him extended at a fairly reasonable price. You don't deal Javy at all in my opinion, but you ABSOLUTELY don't deal him without knowing what Jon wants in terms of an extension. If I'm KW, I am approaching Jon with the same extension offer I just gave Mark. If he wants to stay here, great, sign him up. If he doesn't, I'm looking to deal him as he has some value still with another year on his contract. If we wait until after the season, we are going to be going through this all again next season. I don't see any reason why we cannot maintain a rotation based around Mark/Jon/Javy for the next 4 years. They're all in their prime as pitchers, have all been extraordinarily healthy and durable throughout their careers, and all seem to be very classy, clubhouse-friendly guys. You then slide Danks and one of Floyd/Gio in and I think you've got yourself a pretty solid rotation until 2011. It would cost a bit over $40 million. Obviously, Contreras would have to be dealt under this scenario, and I will miss Jose, but he is the odd man out. If he can be moved for one reasonably decent prospect, and without paying out any of that contract, then he is gone. I doubt there will be teams jumping out of their shoes to try and get Jose, but there will likely be some suitors as the contenders become desperate.

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Jul 8, 2007 -> 05:43 PM) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Abso-f***ing-lutely. I was dead wrong. And I'm happy to be so. You didn't believe me, did you....

He will be signed.

QUOTE(Top Notch @ Jul 7, 2007 -> 05:40 PM) Hasn't it been determined that neither Ellsbury or Bucholz will be moved? Alot of things that are determined 6 weeks from the trade deadline tend to change as it approaches...

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Jul 7, 2007 -> 05:37 PM) Well, Anderson not playing for Charlotte tonight. Either something's happening with him or he's got Dye's Syndrome, where everything goes wrong with you when there's a chance of getting traded. Just bring the kid up and give him another chance, for the love of Pete. He's been hitting well of late, and he deserves another chance.

Mark's stock just keeps rising with each quality outing. I've got to think what happened today had to have some sort of affect on Kenny. Just today's ballgame juxtaposed against yesterday's games is evidence of how valuable Mark really is. If I'm Kenny, I take one more shot at getting the asking price he was looking for a few weeks ago, and if discussions still go nowhere, it's time to bite the bullet, give Mark his NTC, and deal with the repurcussions as they arise.

You absolutely know KW will be trying to somehow get Eric Brynes...

Damn. Dude just took a big chunk out of Mark's trade value with those comments. The Sox are going to have to yield here and deal with Jon Garland wanting his NTC when it comes up. Because Mark isn't blinking and the Sox really have no other play here. This will be done soon.

QUOTE(fathom @ Jul 4, 2007 -> 12:10 PM) The funny thing is, Tampa doesn't have a whole lot to trade us. Dukes is too much of a character issue, Baldelli is hurt too much, and they're not going to trade Upton or Young now. The only guy is Crawford, but that would make no sense at all. I can't see them trading Longoria or Brignac. I think they would move Brignac. Longoria isn't going anywhere, not with the way he's been hitting. But Brignac isn't exactly tearing it up offensively, he's not very solid with the glove, and Brendan Harris and Zobrist are ahead of him. I think he would definitely be a key piece that could be had. Another player who could be available is Joel Guzman, the former Dodger prospect. He's currently playing third base in the minors, but he has Longoria and Iwamura ahead of him. He probably could be moved to left field and could be a power hitting corner OF we seem to be lacking in our system.

Once again, Javy is pitching better than he has in years. He finally looks like he may be fulfilling what we thought he could be.... This is such a shame- our top 3 are absolutely playoff-caliber pitchers right now....

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:25 PM) Fans continuing to pay for a s***ty product because the park is pretty and the neighborhood is building up... Sounds like the fans of some other team.... And we need fans like that... But let's not get too carried away with the analogy....the level of mismanagement on the North side far, far, far outweighs the mistakes made on the South side. QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:29 PM) Like I said, they haven't been for 20+ years and I don't see them starting now. It would be nice if you are right, but I doubt it. All done. How do you think the situation on the North side got to how it is currently? It certainly wasn't always like that...

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:06 PM) Kenny does not make the decison to tie up $100+M for 2 players. I believe that is where the NTC comes in. I don't think they are afraid of committing the money. I think they are afraid of becoming inflexible.

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:59 PM) And before I forget, I agree with you about signing both Mark and Jon to similar deals. Not a snowball's chance in hell. Steff, just curious. Why not? Secondly, why is KW afraid to set a precedent if no other high-dollar contracts are forthcoming?

QUOTE(hi8is @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:18 PM) there gonna sign him... you know how horrible this would be for JR and company from a PR percpective. it'll get done soon and then we'll see some deals go down. Agreed.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:22 PM) Years ago, I would have agreed. But right now, I think they would do it if the deals were right. Why, you ask? Here is why... Attendance at last night's game, a Monday night against the mighty Orioles: 35000+ Even 2 years after the WS, and with the team playing like crap... people show up. As long as the attendance stays up, which it looks like it will, and the money keeps flowing in... this club will spend the money. Especially on young pitching talent. It wasn't more than a few years back that there were only 4 games a year where they drew 35k - 3 Cubs games and Opening Day. Well, keep in mind that two things were driving last night's attendance: 1) pre-sold season tickets; and 2) the possibility of it being Mark's final start on the southside.