iamshack

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 07:40 PM) Probably Lance Broadway I'd have to say. For Burgos? That conversation wouldn't last long.

The one thing that bothers me about this speculation is that no national writer or reporter has mentioned this today. I've looked at a Yankee forum and the only mention they have of it is someone relaying to them what is being reported here. Is this just more BS reported by Levine because he doesn't know what the heck is going on? Or does he have some actual valid sources? This is a huge story, and the lid would be blowing off of it were the national writers to get a hold of it. Yet they are saying nothing or even reporting that Cashman is "sitting out" the action thus far. What gives?

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 12:34 PM) Free agent after '07 though it appears he may be negotiating a long term deal with the Sox currently. Well, it appears that either he or Freddy is. I could see Freddy being the one who wants to negotiate a long-term deal moreso than Mark, considering that Freddy has familial connections to the team.

QUOTE(tonyho7476 @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 12:33 PM) I keep forgetting our pitchers status...is Buerhle signed through '07 or '08? O7'. Mark and Freddy's deals both end after this upcoming season.

QUOTE(tonyho7476 @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 12:15 PM) I would love to see AROD break up the base-clogging duo of Thome and Konerko. So I guess AROD would play 3rd this year, and then move to SS in 2008, when Mr. Fields hits the scene? Sounds like a plan. Where do we sign? Not necessarily. As many have said, ARod may be too bulky to play ss at this stage in his career. Although I imagine him getting the go-ahead that he could return to ss might be a factor in him waiving his NTC. If not, he could stay at third, and Fields could be used to acquire a ss prospect?

QUOTE(tonyho7476 @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 12:08 PM) I realize this...but how AROD was discussed, was my question. But obviously he is the only player we would be interested in. So I am a moron, thanks for pointing it out. Well, you are correct, they don't KNOW for certain that ARod is the player being discussed. And I wouldn't be so sure in saying we don't have interest in any of their other players. They have a few other nice pieces KW could be zoning in on...

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 12:00 PM) The market wasnt what it is right now. Gil Meche, who basically is a 5th starter and has never sniffed 200 innings is going to get a 4 year deal for 10-12 a year. Thats about as inflated as the market gets. Also, why would we be better suited to deal one of our pitchers? I cant see why we should settle for a deal, just because making a move is the best thing we can do. As it stands right now, we most likely still have one of the best rotations in the AL, with one of the most potent lineups. If the deal does not favor us, we are better off standing pat until something catches our attention. I will say this again. If we take the team we took into last year, or something of equal value, the team wins 95+ games 7 out of 10 times. We got pretty unlucky last year and had a year that was disappointing, but also somewhat uncharacteristic of the talent on our team. I think many people on here have xbox or fantasy syndrome where you think that any deal will improve the team, as long as we move pieces. Prospects are also so overvalued on this board. We really arent a small market team, and as good as acquiring a stable of spects to bolster our minor league system would be, I would rather have an establish Ace like Mark Buehrle and sign him to an extension. I don't claim we are a small market team, but no team other than the Yankees, perhaps, can afford to be handing out several $10+ annual salaries and expect to have any flexibility were those players to suffer injury, or perform at an unexpectedly mediocre level. I have no problem signing *some* of our players to extended contracts that pay them what they are worth. But as KW has said, you have to consistently infuse your roster with young talent or else you end up with an aging team or roster inflexibility. The answer cannot simply be to sign everyone to extensions. And with the way our system looks now, we don't exactly have a whole lot of young players to infuse into our everyday lineup. We have to be careful with whom we decide to keep, and who we recognize we would be better off trading. Under your theory, we'll demand an exorbitant price for any of our starters, and possibly come up empty. Then we'll walk into 07' with the same rotation, and where will Brandon pitch? Charlotte? That will make him miserable. Out of the pen? Even KW admitted that if you put him in the pen you are risking his ability to become an effective starter in this league. Simply because there are mediocre options out there signing for $10 million annually does not mean that teams are going to trade you their top 3 prospects for your above average starter. It means they are going to give a shot to someone in their system and bank on him producing 80% of the performance of one of those mediocre FA's for 5% of the cost. Believe me, I'm all for taking advantage of our position in this marketplace. But if we don't, because we asked to much, then we have missed a major opportunity to take advantage of our surplus and restock our system. Because sooner or later, under KW's philosophy of player acquisition, we are going to run out of prospects to use in trades to get established veterans. At some point we need to restock the farm so we can continue to move prospects for established players. I'm not arguing that we need to keep whatever prospects we get in return for dealing one of our starters. Just that it would be foolish to miss out on this opportunity to take advantage of this market. Because I don't want the draft picks when these guys walk. I want players that are close.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 11:43 AM) Because they have people at the meetings. How do you think they know this? Wow, take a look at this from Neyer's chat: Mike (chicago, IL): Rumors are flying about A-Rod for Garcia and Crede. Anything known about this? Rob Neyer: (12:47 PM ET ) All I know about this is the lopsided nature of the transaction. Unless the Yankees send along some money. First time I have seen someone that isn't a Sox fan say WE would be the one getting the short end of the stick.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 11:42 AM) It doesnt matter if he had a down year last year IMO, Buehrle has been our Ace now for several years and should demand the highest price. If we do not get a huge package for him, it benefits our team more in the short term to keep Buehrle, and I bet thats what KW is thinking. So if the Mets do not want Buehrle at our price, they dont get him, and they have to either overpay or settle for something else. We do not have to make a deal to make a deal right now. There is so much of a market for pitching its ridiculous. Buehrle will make less money than Ted Lilly and Gil Meche this upcoming year, thats flat out ridiculous. There is a difference between commanding a high price, and being flat-out unreasonable. For years, the Devil Rays were demanding the moon for some of their players, and teams eventually just said the hell with them and the Rays got nothing. Then Bowden tried to hold the league hostage with his ridiculous demands for Soriano and now has some draft picks to show for it, when that team desperately needs some mlb-ready players now. Simply because the price of pitching is extraordinary right now does not mean you can ask for whatever you want; while we are one of the few teams with a surplus, we still would be better served by dealing at least one starter for an impact player or some quality prospects.

Just a snippet from Rob Neyer's ESPN chat: Del (Chicago): How much of a bargain is Mark Buehrle at one year, $9.5 million? Do the White Sox trade him now while he's still a bargain? Rob Neyer: (12:32 PM ET ) If I were Kenny Williams, I'd trade whichever of my starters has the most value. He's essentially got seven good candidates for the rotation, and has a real chance this winter to make his team the No. 1 contender in the division.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 10:54 AM) Remember what he gave up for Bartolo Colon? Now he actually has a team with the resources to trade for an ace and sign that ace to a long term contract (Buehrle or Garcia). Yes, I remember: Grady Sizemore, Cliff Lee, and Brandon Phillips. However, you can't compare the two situations. That was when he was in Montreal, where he had no payroll to sign FA's with. The only chance of getting impact players was through trades, and he consistently raped that farm system in order to do so. Simply because he got desperate then does not mean he will do that now. Currently, he has at his disposal one of the largest piggybanks in baseball to utilize, and he will undoubtedly empty that out, rather than the Mets system. Trading one of those guys for Mark, sure. Trading two of them for Mark, probably not. Trading all three for Mark, not a chance. This isn't Montreal anymore.

QUOTE(hitlesswonder @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 10:45 AM) I think Milledge and Pelfrey would be a great deal if Williams could pull it off -- you're talking about getting the Mets equivalent of McCarthy and Chris Young for one year of a starter who had a 5 ERA last season(Buehrle). That package is more than what the Diamondbacks got for Vazquez and Javy had 2 years left on his contract. In fact, I doubt the Mets will move Pelfrey, since they are still stung by the decision to trade Kazmir and Pelfrey is probably one of the top 5 starting pitching prospects in baseball. I agree that Williams should hold out to get the best possible deal (considering the state of the farm system). But if people think Milledge and Pelfrey wouldn't be enough for Freddy or Mark, I have a feeling they are going to be disappointed in whatever trade KW finally makes. Agreed. I love the idea of getting optimal value. But KW doesn't need to do what Jim Bowden did with Sori at the deadline last July.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 10:06 AM) Then he doesnt get a pitcher, see how that works? KW doesnt need to make sure that the deal is even on both sides, because he holds all the cards. If the Mets dont want to do that deal, we move on to the next one. That reminds me of Danny Noonan and DeNunzio in Caddyshack. "I ain't payin' no fifty cents for no Coke." "Then you ain't gettin' no Coke, eh." Well, it seems that Minyana would rather offer Zito the $ than trade his top 3 prospects for Mark, so maybe that is what happened. As for ARod, I doubt that he would block a trade here. This is the PERFECT place for him to play, second only to maybe LAA. If you think what Ozzie said about him really bothers him, remember what the Yankee fans and the NY media did to him the final 3 months or so of the season...

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 09:58 AM) Then he better start talking to Miguel Batista, because we dont NEED to deal our pitchers. This is what the market has become, and we can seriously rape a team with a deal like this. Still not enough value. We dont have to make a deal just to make a deal. I'm not saying that Mark shouldn't command a nice package, but Pelfrey, Milledge, and Humber are their big three prospects. He can't move them all for one player, especially one with one year left on his deal and coming off a poor season. He wouldn't move Heilman and Milledge for Zito last year; he isn't going to move those three for Mark now.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 09:53 AM) I would be shocked if he didnt ask for both, and not take the deal without it. There is not a chance in hell Minyana would do that deal, but were he to, I would take it and run as fast as I could- even if we had already traded Freddy to another team.

I would be shocked if KW wasn't demanding Pelfrey or Humber along with Milledge. Even NY papers seem to be agreeing that Milledge's stock has taken a hit in the past year.

I don't know if this has already been posted, my apologies if it has. It's a Scott Merkin article about a rumored Mark for Milledge deal. http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article...rtnered=rss_mlb One of the newest rumors making its way around the Swan and Dolphin Resort on Monday involved the movement of White Sox southpaw Mark Buehrle via trade to the Mets in return for outfielder Lastings Milledge.

QUOTE(fathom @ Dec 5, 2006 -> 09:28 AM) Two things: - We're not going to get Wells for just one of our starting pitchers. - Wells is going to get a contract in the 8 year, 140 million dollar range...we can thank the Cubs for this ridiculous market. I guess you're probably right, although only because Mark is set to make 11 million this year and Wells only 5.5 million. They would probably need another player in return. I wouldn't want to chance Brian though. If you have to go much beyond one of our starters, this deal makes no sense to me.

Anyone think the Jays would be interested in a Mark/Vernon swap? Would you like that deal from our perspective?

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Dec 4, 2006 -> 11:27 PM) Mark Buehrle might get $20 million more than that next year if he hits the open market and only signs a 5 year deal. He might get $40 million more than that if he signs a 6 year deal. Yeah, he might. But not from his beloved Cardinals, that's for sure. And not if he struggles again this year. And not if the market reacts harshly to this spending spree going on right now. It's very easy to say he might get this and he might get that, but in all reality, would YOU turn down a chance at $55 million in guaranteed money and a chance to stay with the only organization you have ever been with (and recently won a World Championship with), to gamble at 5/75? I mean, I realize that is an extra 20 million there, but in all practical terms, what could he do with $15 million a year that he couldn't do with $11 million annually?

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 4, 2006 -> 11:21 PM) Interesting. Could be a nice surprise. However, Any possibility they are working on an extension to make them more attractive? Well, one thing I thought about with the Carpenter extension was maybe that it was setting a market for Mark more so than anyone else. Maybe something a little smaller, like 5/55, although, I am not personally in favor of such a deal.

QUOTE(Vance Law @ Dec 4, 2006 -> 09:56 PM) yes, not to mention some Wolf gentleman is being paid 8 millions of dollars to try to pitch And Wolf took a discount so he could pitch at home near his mother.

QUOTE(ChiSox9 @ Dec 4, 2006 -> 08:51 PM) From the MLB.COM site... LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. -- Of the 30 Major League clubs, roughly 29 are looking for more pitching. As the baseball balance of trade goes, there is a definite trade imbalance The position we have in these meetings is phenominal! Now let's utilize that and get another impact player.

Looks like some of these pitchers are beginning to get close to deals, which is good. Padilla has reportedly reached a $34 million deal with the Rangers, and Lilly looks like he will be signed in the next few days. That should begin to clear up the market for our starters a little bit.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Dec 4, 2006 -> 06:30 PM) Mark Buehrle and Jon Garland are wearing nice, shiny rings. Neither Jon nor Mark came from that crop of guys. Mark came out of nowhere to be successful and Jon was acquired from the Cubs. And even in Jon's case, he didn't start showing he could be consistent in this league until he was nearly a FA. Are all of you patient enough to sit on Brandon for 4 full years of starting until he starts to become what we thought he would be? The point is, quality starting pitching comes from all different sources, and not always from where you would think. I, just as much as anyone, hope that Brandon can reach his expectations. But if he gets dealt for a sure thing at this stage, especially a 25 year old sure thing, I won't be too upset.