iamshack

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 01:57 PM) That middle paragraph isn't true, we had great pieces to trade but we sucked. The market for rental players has been weak this year compared to recent years, unfortunate but that's the market thus far. It's pretty true, Russ. Of course some s***ty teams have a few decent pieces to move, but a lot of teams that suck don't have crap to move, which is why they haven't been moving it. Anyways, I won't fight you guys anymore on this. I see pretty much everyone is pleased with the deal and I'm not here trying to change that. Just expressing a different opinion. My apologies to anyone I may have offended or been abrasive with. Please enjoy Ryan Cordell and Ian Clarkin until your hearts are content.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 01:54 PM) Relievers moved so far: Robertson Kahnle Swarzak Mauer Madson Doolittle Phelps Relievers likely available: Hand Stammen Brach Britton Ramos Neshek Benoit Storen Strickland (his name has popped up in rumors) And then add in any reliever on a team in contention that could decide to sell a few rental BP pieces in the next 5 days. Plus any team selling back-end rotation guys who may end up in a team's bullpen. I'm unconvinced Baltimore is selling...Angelos is nuts. l did forget about Phelps - good catch.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 01:46 PM) It is totally a buyer's market for relievers. You can continue to be upset over what is a minor trade, or focus on the next stages of development our farm needs to get us where we need to be. There was not a better return to be had right now. Think about this...bats apparently have no value in this market. The market is "flooded" with relief arms. There have been basically 5-6 rumored decent SP on the market. There are basically 15-16 supposed buyers in the market right now, and maybe 10-11 sellers. And the sellers aren't exactly loaded with great pieces, or else they wouldn't be selling. They'd be good. And half of those teams haven't sold anything yet. Several of those selling teams went into the year attempting to suck, so they don't even have many movable pieces, because they are all kids. We've seen 6 teams sell thus far - CWS, Oak, SF, Mia, Det and SD, three of which have moved relief arms. And honestly, don't worry about what I am or am not upset about.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 01:43 PM) No one really gave any praise to Beane in that deal if I recall. It was the first deal to happen in terms of relievers, basically. But he dumped a bunch of cash on Washington and got two pretty solid assets back in Luzardo and Treinen.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 01:40 PM) Well the price relievers have gone for so far and the fact there are a lot still out there would make it seem differently. You mean the price Hahn has accepted for relievers? Billy Beane's deal with Washington is starting to look better and better.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 01:23 PM) As you know, the market is always changing. A lot of teams went into this year with the intention of sucking. They're all trying to flip their relievers. Everyone knows how fungible and sporadic relievers can be. To me it's interesting to see how unwilling teams are to take on money this year. In the past I feel teams were willing to take on cash if it made their team better. Our cheap ass owner paid 4M for a month of a washed up Manny Ramirez. Now teams won't give up anything for a professional SH bat who's been consistent as can be in Melky with a 6M price tag. Regardless, it's a buyers market. You sign relievers in the offseason so you can have them the whole year. You can't be in contention in July with no bullpen unless you have the Nats lineup and rotation and play in the NL East/Central. There Brewers have a deep system so a "20th prospect" is relative. If Brewers lose 7/10 and the Cubs pitching holds up the Brewers just wasted an asset for nothing. I think there is a very high probability the Brewers lose this trade and the White Sox have no chance of losing other than in the way of opportunity cost if there was anotehr interesting piece out there. Yeah, I hear you, but I guess we need to see how the next 5 days go. I don't think this is nearly the buyer's market as it's been made out to be.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 12:46 PM) Ha, Shack I saw you had some strong opinions on this one. If I told you in March we traded Swarzak for this kid you would have had to be ecstatic, no? Swarzak's been great but would have lost all of his value a week from today. He has no track record and if you want him for next year trading him now doesn't preclude that from happening. Getting a T20 guy from a top system is a big win even if Cordell is flawed. I admit I know nothing about this guy, and so hopefully he changes my mind. That said, I would have preferred to get something like what the Red Sox gave the Giants for Nunez. A younger kid with some upside that may pay off much more down the road. I think this is an interesting discussion to have...but I think the GMs that are buying are really pulling the wool over the eyes of the selling GMs right now in terms of reliever value. Teams are basically able to land some quality relievers, which are becoming more and more integral in the postseason than ever, for almost nothing. What is the point of even spending much money on the bullpen at this point? Why take the risk of signing a reliever to a 3/15 contract when I can just wait and see if I'm in contention, and then drop my 20th rated prospect for a rental that makes nothing? The market has shifted so ridiculously towards prospects that it's going to continue to eat into the salaries paid to average veterans and cause labor issues.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 12:34 PM) I dont like that the scout Hayes quoted compared him to Engel. This guy is nowhere near the defender or speedster that Engel is. Engel is nowhere near as polished or well rounded on the offensive side. Engel, if you're going to play him, should be in CF. Cordell could play there, the corners and perhaps some infield although the reports aren't all that positive there. This Cordell guy is really unique. If he can be a guy who can play all three outfielder positions, 1B/3B and even SS in a pinch we have a very interesting bench piece. Still, defensive reports in infield are poor. To me, his ceiling is Ian Desmond with less infield ability. How likely he is to hit that ceiling I have my doubts. He has overall very decent numbers but there's caveats along the way. He was too old when he murdered A ball and he's a bit old now when he's been productive at one the best parks to hit in all of baseball. All things considered, this is guy who was top 20 in a top 5/10 system. He was ranked above guys I would have been legitimately excited to have acquired for Swarzak. We gave up a rental who came here on a minor league deal. This is a win. These are the types of moves that need to be made during rebuild years. Identify, utilize and ship off. Limited liability and considerable upside. Throw guys like Davidson, Leury, Engel, Cordell, etc. out there to get full time ops and they can either make a spot for themselves for the future or become a trade piece. His flexibility is nice too. While I still don't agree, I appreciate the insights Brian!

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 10:46 AM) Rumor has it that Abreu will soon have a higher batting average than Avi. He needs to sit some games and just let that finger heal.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 09:54 AM) Is it? I thought Hahn said it was basically done on Tuesday after agreeing on Eloy and Cease as main guys on Monday. I thought that it was just haggling over 2nd pieces the next few days but it sounds like it was actually talking it through with ownership. I think he said by Tuesday, Theo had agreed to Eloy and Cease...which still makes this timeline work...but it isn't surprising that it took some time to convince Jerry.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 09:35 AM) I think they are trying to. Cashman historically waits until last day for his moves, but clear that OAK/CHW wanted to get out ahead of someone like Texas dumping anyone. But they may get Gray for a package headlined by mateo (no idea how accurate that is), and a bunch of these guys. Yeah, my guess is Mateo and Florial is what Cashman may be offering for Gray/Alonso..but I don't think BB wants Mateo considering they have Barreto.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 09:07 AM) And seems to have a rubber arm. HBD

Sox reinstate Petricka from DL.

Sounds like Cordell still has a few more weeks on the shelf.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 08:02 AM) Chicago White Sox‏Verified account @whitesox 53s53 seconds ago More The #WhiteSox have acquired minor-league outfielder Ryan Cordell from the Milwaukee Brewers in exchange for RHP Anthony Swarzak. Looks like the deal is finalized^ Rats.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 07:40 AM) At it again this morning, I see. Honestly though, the fact that nothing official has come makes you think there may be a hitch. With Cordell's reported back issues, it makes some sense. But would seem to me the Sox would have explored that before agreeing to the trade? That was just an honest question. I had never heard the term used before. I don't know if there is a hitch, but one would think if the dude was on the DL for a month that they would have checked the medicals before this news got anywhere close to being leaked. Hell, for all we know, it could be Swarzak's medicals.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 06:51 AM) You're right it's unfair...but it's becoming less unfair lately. People have watched him getting frustrated and not hustling and this is unacceptable. I don't dispute those things. I know he's frustrated, and I don't know where his head is. But he is not lazy.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 06:50 AM) He absolutely has a chance to end up being an everyday player, with the ceiling of a second division regular. In being realistic about the player, I think he is going to be best suited to a solid 4th outfielder role. Playing good defense will help his case, as will some pop. It's worth rolling the dice on. This bolded term...this basically means a regular on a lousy team, correct? I saw it yesterday and didn't know what it meant.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 06:29 AM) You guys are still arguing about Anthony Swarzak? I've moved on to hoping the deal gets axed due to medicals

QUOTE (whitesoxwinner @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 12:13 AM) Also a very lazy player. Lazy defense causing him to have the most errors, lazy approach causing him to strikeout, lazy base running. The dude basically walks out the box every time he hits something. Just a flat out lazy player. I don't think this is fair at all.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 06:24 AM) I am not going to take the bait to try an argue that Cordell is TCQ. That isnt the point I was trying to make. I am just open to trying to understand what Hahn may see as best case scenario with this prospect. The guy has power and he is seemingly knocking at the door of the major leagues by the opinion of people who have actually watched the guy play. I wasn't offering any bait, Shipps. Just like many of you guys haven't been shy to disagree with my opinions, I am telling you that that comparison was not valid. Not close.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 06:14 AM) Oh you have a negative take on Cordell? Please tell us more. Carlos Quentin was the 20th rated prospect in baseball in 2006.

Carlos Quentin was a big time prospect that had sort of stalled out a bit in the DBacks system, wasn't he? I don't think Cordell's mom even thinks Cordell had the pedigree that TCQ had.

Brewers Media

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 26, 2017 -> 04:01 AM) I haven't seen this trade officially announced by either team yet? Maybe the prospects back injury and medicals are holding something up? Wow...looks like you are on to something...although I dunno how you trade for a guy with a back injury that's been on the DL for a month and not go through the medicals pretty well first...