iamshack

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 07:18 PM) From a baseball standpoint, it wouldn't be a terrible move, at all. However, often times, pretty much all the time, there is more than just the baseball side of things, and Buehrle getting dealt would be the straw that breaks the camels back to a lot of fans, at least IMO. That would be tough for a lot of people to swallow. Once again, Williams can talk all he wants about the fans and media don't influence decision making, but that always isn't the case. This is one of those cases. Oh believe me, I see that side of things...another thing we don't know is what Mark thinks about what has gone on this offseason. Apparently he was one of the guys Kenny told we were targeting Hunter and the flying Cabrera brothers. I wonder if he would be disappointed with a trade knowing that him going to the Reds quite possibly makes them a better team than the White Sox (or possibly gives him a better chance at making the playoffs than with the White Sox)?

White Sox linked to Prior. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/stor...&id=3161000 Scroll down.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 07:13 PM) After missing out on all the big names this off-season, there isn't a chance in HELL Williams trades Buehrle. I don't care what he says about "I don't care what the fans think.., ect. ect." Not going to happen. You gotta do what you gotta do, man. Maybe he's going to try a rebuild after all....and a Votto acquisition means Paulie is on his way out the door as well...

This was posted on the Baltimore Sun message board- as you know, they are closely monitoring a possible Bedard to Cinci deal... Supposedly we are looking at Cueto and Votto.... http://www.baltimoresun2.com/talk/showthre...ghlight=Buehrle

QUOTE(CanOfCorn @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 03:53 PM) What hole? Leadoff or 2B? Or both? Depending on what Richar does in Spring Training, I might be willing to give him both roles cuz he's younger and cheaper and only played for 2 months or so. To answer your question, I am not worried about Richar defensively. I was thinking of the leadoff spot, which Roberts would fill nicely.

I would take Fernando Cabrera back for Uribe.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Dec 17, 2007 -> 07:30 PM) Konerko, Dye, and Pierzynski are all pretty bad contracts. Tolerable, but not preferred. I disagree with this statement and your statement before that we have a crapload of bad contracts. That's simply not true. In fact, it's ONE of the things Kenny and Jerry have done extremely well with. When was the last time you recall the White Sox eating any money from a contract? And until Contreras' rapid decline this season, we had not one bad contract. Now, we have one. And it's not the worst thing that's ever happened...heck, were he to improve this upcoming season, the contract may be fine. As for Konerko and Dye having bad contracts, that's not the case. What makes you state that is that the landscape of the market has shifted to acquiring pre-arb players that make nothing. But in the grand scheme of things, those are not contracts which will preclude us from trading either of those players should we wish to.

QUOTE(fathom @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 12:06 PM) Nope, he was consistently in the 90-91 mph range, and only a few times would he reach 93-94 mph. And it's not like it's a deceptive fastball (like Neal Cotts), where he gets a lot of swings and misses on the pitch. Well the scouting report says he hits 92-93 consistently, occasionally hitting 95. Perhaps he was more customarily around 90-91 last year, but I seem to recall him hitting 93-94 more than a few times. "Physically, Floyd is close to being a perfect pitching prospect. He is tall and lanky, but not too thin. He has both a strong upper body and strong legs. His fastball can hit 95 mph, and is a consistent 92-93 mph offering, with movement." http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?id=1794552 Regardless, the point is that Floyd does not have "below average pitches."

I read that supposedly there is a deal on Peter Angelos' desk for Brian Roberts from the Cubs, of Gallagher, Murton, and Patterson. We cannot beat this?

QUOTE(fathom @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 11:36 AM) Floyd's fastball is in the 92 mph range. It's far from being an above average pitch. I think he hits higher than that. And I should preface my comment: If he is locating his curveball, his fastball easily an above-average pitch.

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 11:19 AM) Floyd and Danks also have below average pitches. Garland is at least average across the board, and he can throw each for strikes. Danks and Floyd can't. That's not true. Floyd has a very plus curveball, and an above average fastball. If you want to talk about "plus" pitches, this is Floyd's greatest strength. Danks, I'm not so sure about. He appears to have a plus curve, but everything else appears prettty average to me.

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 11:14 AM) Why would you not want Bedard given the current rotation the Sox have? The price? Yep. The Orioles supposedly want 4 prospects for him, at least one which is Grade A, which I am not sure we have (however they would probably consider Fields = to that). Which means we are probably talking a package of Fields, Danks/Gio, DLS, and one other pitcher, probably one of the Egbert/Broadway/Russell crew.... Couple that with Bedard's seemingly lackluster attitude, his desire to possibly play in his native Canada, and his Zambrano-esque contract in a few years, and I don't think it's worth it. If you could get Roberts for something along the lines of Danks+Richar+Uribe, I think I would be willing to do so, only because Roberts could plug such a hole for this team.

I frequent a solid Baltimore Orioles forum from time to time, where there are a few guys who definitely have some sources within the Warehouse- Baltimore's FO. One of these guys mentioned this morning not to be surprised if we see a Jay Payton for Juan Uribe deal happen shortly. It does make sense, as Payton will make $5 million in 08', while Juan will make $4.5 million. This doesn't seem like a good idea however, as Payton is known as a poor clubhouse presence, and will do nothing but keep our younger OF's off the field. Additionally, Payton may be the worst guy to replace Juan with, as he posted a whopping .295 OBP last season. Not good. Just wanted to pass along the info. Please don't confuse this with me suggesting this deal would be in any way a good deal for the White Sox.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Dec 19, 2007 -> 12:02 AM) so long as members of Soxtalk can be the Werewolves of London Of course we would be the Werewolves of London.....ah oooooooooooohhh

I'm just excited to hear we may have an internal option by 2012. Oh, and by the way, I hereby nominate Kenny Williams be hereafter referred to as "Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner." In fact, I think we should turn this offseason and the 08' season into a musical set to Warren Zevon's Greatest Hits album. Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner needs Lawyer's, Guns and Money as well...

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Dec 18, 2007 -> 09:59 PM) Yeah, find me a musician who DENIES it. As I've said, my problem is with the lying. I've no problem with my bands and such doing drugs, and most of them will admit to it. They also face minimal or no repercussions for such drug use, unlike the position these players were in.

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Dec 18, 2007 -> 05:33 PM) I've been extremely pessimistic for the upcoming season, but if we got Bedard and Roberts, that pessimism would turn to optimism in a hurry. Part of me doesn't even want Bedard...I'd be quite happy with Roberts....

QUOTE(Fantl916 @ Dec 18, 2007 -> 02:07 PM) haha this is going to sounds aweful... but for Bedard and Roberts it would probably take (i hope you're sitting down) a package similar to the one detroit gave florida... DLS, Danks, Crede, Sweeney, Richar, John Shelby, and McCulough... i think we can get away from dealing Fields in a deal like this cuz Bedard is a FA after this season and Roberts now comes with steroids baggage... Gio and Danks are interchangable, but i think Danks fits better here for Balt. because of the flux of pitching prospects they got from Houston and they might want someone more major league ready. crede makes sense as mora is garbage, and used to be a superutility guy anyway so he can be moved around. if not... Fields, Danks, Sweeney, Richar, Egbert, McCulough might get it done is it worth it for us? im not so sure, maybe if we were able to negotiate an extension with bedard before a trade. obviously this is all in good fun, i dont expect something like this to happen, but i thought a response to iamshack's question was needed... It certainly seems like we are much more in need of Bedard and Roberts than the Cubs are...

Suspended for admitting he "tried" steroids 4-5 years ago? No chance.

I know this has been discussed before, and I am certain there will be a fair number of replies which state that getting these two guys will not significantly increase our chances at winning the Central this season, but what do we all think it would take to reel in Bedard and Roberts? We know KW has long been a fan of Bedard, and perhaps no other "availablle" player would fit our team better right now than Brian Roberts. What kind of package would it take to reel them both in? The Cubs are reportedly offerring a package of Gallagher/Murton/Cedeno for Roberts, but Andy MacPhail is holding out for Felix Pie. Now there is speculation that the Cubs may try to expand the deal to include Bedard as well. Could we outbid the Cubs? Fo sho. What would such a package look like? Rampant and irresponsible speculation is appreciated.....we've been in a bit of a lull for the past few weeks...

QUOTE(hitlesswonder @ Dec 17, 2007 -> 12:02 PM) I would hope not -- in my experience there's very little correlation if any at all between college attendance and intelligence. And for anyone saying that Williams not graduating is a sign of stupidity, go tell that to Bill Gates. I think the point here is that it's pretty clear when you hear Williams speak or read his quotes, he comes off as very intelligent and articulate. And to form an opinion otherwise seems to be baseless. It's ridiculous to refer to KW as "not too bright."

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Dec 17, 2007 -> 10:53 AM) KW went to college 2 years. I never mentioned KW as being a "graduate."

QUOTE(AWhiteSoxinNJ @ Dec 17, 2007 -> 10:06 AM) Danks, time will tell. Floyd. For seeing most of his starts in Philly and with the Sox, there is 0.0 chance he's a top 5 talent, let alone top 2. What exactly are you saying here when you mention "top talent?" Are you suggesting in the league, or as a slot in the rotation? Are you arguing he has a 0.0% chance of being a #5 starter?

QUOTE(sircaffey @ Dec 17, 2007 -> 12:39 AM) What does Stanford have to do with anything? They offer scouting classes there? A person who couldn't get into your local community college could be the best GM out there as long as he evaluates baseball talent well and knows what it takes to create a good baseball team. Our GM is the same one that believed our bullpen was going to be very good last year. It sucked. Stanford didn't help much in that department, did it? There is little doubt in my mind that KW believes he has a good team. Whether he still believes we can compete after the moves DET made, I don't know. But he thinks this is a good team, no doubt. Take a quick look around mlb- check out the academic resumes of all the new, young GM's- and then tell me that top of the line educations are not extremely valuable in the current industry landscape. Check where Shapiro, Epstein, and many of the other younger GM's attended college. The days of hiring front office execs strictly because they are "baseball people" is over.

Well, first off, I think Gavin Floyd has the potential to be a #2 or 3 starter. He certainly has the arm and the stuff. Whether he can ever locate it well enough, and whether he can ever have the mental determination and focus that being an above-average mlb starter remains to be seen. Although he did show flashes last year. Danks has been sort of a disappointment for me thus far, but I try to remind myself that he is still very young. His stuff isn't as good as I had anticipated, but if he can locate his curveball and fastball, I see no reason why he can't be a very solid #2. I don't think he'll ever be a true "ace," but I think he can probably be a #1b or #2 if he can get command of the zone. I envision his ceiling close to Buehlre's. Doesn't mean he'll ever reach it though, as Buehrle has.