JUSTgottaBELIEVE

Not in hindsight. The Indians have had glaring holes in the outfield and at 2b/3b (wherever JR wasn’t playing) since 2016. They would have been much better served upgrading those positions than DH. That’s not hindsight. Anyone that watched the 2016 World Series could recognize those glaring holes, ones that likely cost them the title.

You have low expectations I suppose. I’d be very disappointed if Harper averaged 3.5 fWAR over the next four years.

Not arguing their success. They’ve been great. Simply saying that even strong FO’s make mistakes, which I stand by my statement that signing Edwin was a mistake for that particular team because I believe their limited financial resources could have been better allocated to improve other areas of weakness.

Let me say it a different way since the Sox have similar budgetary constraints as the Indians, generally speaking. When the Sox sign Harper, will you be satisfied if he puts up 14 fWAR at a cost of $140M over the next 4 years?

For a team with the budgetary constraints of the Indians they needed more. Not every situation is comparable. When you are operating with a budget in the low to mid $100M it’s far different than a budget like the cubs or Red Sox where sure ~1 fWAR for $10M on a free agent signing is acceptable.

3.3 fWAR for $33.5M over two years? I can think of a better way for the Sox to allocate their resources.

Ah my mistake. Time flies, was thinking they signed him last winter. Either way, despite the homers he was old and on the decline. He’s been a disappointment in Cleveland, I know that much.

Few years later? They just signed him last winter. And yes, most agreed it was an overpay at the time of the signing as all signs pointed towards Edwin having a very limited market. No one would be defending that signing if it was the Sox instead of the Indians that made the signing...

Nah. It was a mistake. No doubt about it. They admitted as much when they traded him to bring back an also declining and overpaid Carlos Santana.

The smarter ones (Indians) were also the ones to sign these guys in the first place...even the smart guys makes mistakes. Indians are still stuck with Santana and his remaining salary though. No one’s going to lose sleep over one year of Alonso at around $10M.

All I know is that the idea of the Cubs being in play for Harper is a great way for Boras to drive up the WS offer. I still think the WS are the favorite to land Harper. If he was set on either the Dodgers or Cubs he would have either (1) signed by now or (2) there would be more activity and moving pieces involving those clubs (I’m not convinced the Dodgers view OF as their greatest area of need and best use of resources). I’ll be getting together with one of my buddies that works for the Sox marketing department on NYE. I’ll be curious to see what his thoughts are on the entire situation.

http://www.chicagonow.com/cubs-den/2018/12/cubs-rumors-heyward-to-giants-harper-watch/ Rock Raines’ source = Bruce Levine or Charles the Cat?? jk, I think...

I thought so too, which is why I don’t understand the real tax benefit to trading Heyward if the Cubs are retaining a large amount of the remaining money or taking on large contracts like Shark and Melancon. I’d be shocked if the Cubs blew past the second luxury tax threshold of $226M. Their current projected team payroll is just under $210M per baseball reference.

So if the cubs eat $10MM a year of Heyward’s contract, does that $10MM count towards the luxury tax payroll? I know you are saying the Cubs aren’t concerned about the tax but I’m sure every organization is to some degree. Just trying to understand how the tax works for retained salaries such as that. I honestly don’t know and not sure how much of a benefit it would be to deal a guy but retain a large percetange of his remaining contract.

Wouldn’t paying half count against the luxury tax payroll amount or does that money just disappear completely? Also, taking on Melancon’s $14M per year doesn’t help the Cubs much over the next two years when they are already pushing 2018 Red Sox payroll levels.

How do we know the Giants would be willing to take on the remaining $106M even if Schwarber was included?

Who in their right mind would take on the Heyward contract without the Cubs eating a significant portion of his salary? Wouldn’t that still count against a team from a luxury tax threshold perspective?

Pretty certain they’d trade Alonso if they miss on both to avoid the exact situation described above. Plus, why not give those at bats to Palka instead if it’s another development year?

But that’s why paying a 20% premium on top of the Yankees offer if the Yankees offer is in the $35MM AAV range over 7 or 8 years is nuts.

Assuming Machado signs with the Yankees for ~$35MM AAV, a 20% premium is $7MM AAV. That’s significant.

Sheffield, Kelenic, or Dunn with Edwin please ?

Definitely similarities in their games. I wouldn't be surprised if Moncada puts up 2017 Baez numbers in 2019, albeit with a lower batting average and higher on base percentage, and then makes a big step forward in 2020.

I probably would as well but Harper would be first. Adding both guys to this organization would put the Sox on the map as easily the biggest draw in the AL Central (I know not saying much but still). Assuming the team is a division contender over the next several years, I could see attendance back to 30k+ per game with a huge uptick in merch sales that would seemingly cover the cost of both of these guys' salaries. I imagine TV ratings would more than double 2018 ratings. From a business perspective, it makes a ton of sense to sign BOTH, at least for the next 3-4 years. The risk is pain on the back end of the contracts but that risk could be lessened by opt-outs.

I expect some improvement defensively but significant improvement offensively. Can easily see a 750-775 OPS from him in 2019.

If they pulled that off, they'd see a huge increase in attendance in 2019. I for one will be buying a 40 game plan (4 tickets) if they land both those guys.