caulfield12

ERA up to 6.51. We can't pull him yet because of the DH tonight, and Stewart pitched yesterday, too. Humber showing obvious signs of frustration. They're going to have to use Quintana sometime soon, though. Kotchmann was 1/16 with RISP coming into that at-bat. You're going to have to take him out of the game, despite the DHer. Humber HUMBLED. Now Phil Humber has an injury problem. Welcome to your rotation being Peavy, Floyd, Danks and ????/????. 19 earned runs in 12+ innings now since the perfect game (against BOS, CLE, CLE).

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 7, 2012 -> 01:34 PM) 1/8 of a season at rookie ball and 1/4 of a season at low A after being drafted, one full season at high A, 1/2 season at AA, 1/2 season at AAA before being moved into starting in the big leagues. Danny Valencia was drafted at the same age and got almost 1.5x as many minor league PA's as Morel before coming up, just as a "prospect philosophy comparison". See Teahen, Mark disaster. KW sucks. End of story. But I don't think anyone is very sure that Morel's going to be any better than Chris Snopek at this point.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 7, 2012 -> 01:30 PM) fukudome beckham dunn konerko de aza rios aj ramirez lillibridge Why in God's name would you want to lead off the 2nd or 3rd worst hitter on the team, a hitter obviously on the decline? Did you see him play in CLE last year? What signs has he shown this season? For some reason we're now benching Dayan Viciedo when he's starting to look a little better...and when Fukudome has absolutely nothing to do with the future. Great, we might end up 30th in attendance and still not know about Dayan going into 2013 at this rate.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 7, 2012 -> 01:29 PM) Solid success in the minor leagues at every level despite being pushed upward very aggressively? What major league evidence?

Humber's not missing many bats in this game. Curse of the perfecto strikes again, or the Curse of 2008. Since that game, we're 3-9 and closing in on 3-10 and probably 3-11 if they start Stults (assuming Game 2 is played and they cannot skip him). Indians' announcer pulling a Harrelson and rooting it out of the park prematurely.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 01:25 PM) The small amount you might gain offensively with a little more speed, you lose defensively. Its a wash at best. The Sox have to see if Morel can play everyday. They know Lillibridge cannot. Umm....what evidence is there to suggest Morel can play everyday except for a stretch of 6 weeks against mostly rookie pitchers? Neither option is good, but Lillibridge gives you speed and some pop. Morel good but far from "great" defense overall.

QUOTE (justBLAZE @ May 7, 2012 -> 12:03 PM) White Sox Option Dylan Axelrod To Class AAA Charlotte, and recall Eric Stults and Jose Quintana for the double header today. Stony just said organization loves Quintana and they think he will be a quality 4/5 starter in the majors. Welcome to the team Quintana, I can't believe there is no post about this. Also Jacob Petricka and Nestor Molina got promoted to AA Birmingham and AAA Charlotte respectively. LOL. Phil Rogers did write this today about Quintana (who was so good the pitching-starved Yankees just let go) and Cameron Bayne, who I've never seen listed as so much as a Top 20 prospect in the worst farm system in the majors. FWIW, they got McAllister for Austin Kearns. Quite a steal. At the time, Zach wasn't throwing 93-95, he was in the low 90's. 3rd round draft pick in 2006.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 11:43 AM) Then they should have traded him correct? The second he moved to the bullpen his value plummeted. You have taught me well. I must say I am just shocked you don't believe Don Cooper can develop a #5 starter in the next couple of seasons. And just so you know, every team knew about Sale's potential issues. Its the only reason the Sox had a chance to draft him. Also, since the Sox had the #5 starter instead of Sale yesterday, for that game to be a win, Sale would have had to thrown a shutout. Highly unlikely. There's one start the Sox are better off he's in the bullpen. Do you read? When did Davis' value plummet because of overwhelming concerns about his elbow blowing apart at any minute? So the White Sox were "smarter" than all the other teams because they overlooked all the concerns? Sounds like the same rationale that got us Alex Rios and Peavy when he was on the DL. And I said there's no way those starters can be developed for 2012.

So much for the hot April Fukudome. It's now May, and there's no reason to be constantly benching Viciedo when McAllister is actually much more effective against LHP. Nice to know Ozzie's trend of not benching Rios is being continued by Ventura. 5th double of the year for Gordon Beckham. White Sox 10th in the AL in runs scored, still first in strikeouts. And in another positive sign for Gordon, it was on a fastball.

QUOTE (Jake @ May 7, 2012 -> 01:00 PM) This is looking pretty s***ty right now. I feel bad for Phil. At least he has the joy of a new baby. There's that. And you can't ever take the perfect game away from him. On the negative side, we're in danger of a disastrous 3-10 streak and only 2-9 more from equaling the horrendous stretch last year that completely knocked us out of the race at about the same time of the season.

Something like 15 runs given up now by Humber in his last 12 IP. All that work to get 2 outs. Thanks for that throw Alexei! Game in danger of getting out of hand here in just the 2nd, and a long long way to go for the bullpen. Indians have more 2 out RBI's this season than RBI's or with 0 or 1 outs. Humber taking forever and running up his pitch count already to nearly 40.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:33 AM) It is funny Texas and Tampa were brought up as 2 examples of how to build a bullpen considering each has down something that is supposedly taboo to Soxtalk. Feliz was the closer for Texas when he should have been stretching out his arm in AAA to start, and Tampa has made the curious decision to move Wade Davis, once a top 40 prospect peaking at #17, which I believe is higher than Sale ever peaked, from the rotation to the bullpen thus killing his value. How deep is the Rays' starting rotation, vis a vis the White Sox? How deep is their minor league system, vis a vis the White Sox? Where are they in the standings? Whatever they're doing, it's seeming to work, since they've been in the playoffs year after year after year in the toughest division in MLB. Their major league rotation isn't going to suffer as a result because they have the depth to cover it up or make a trade. What team's going to give us another Chris Sale for $12 million worth in commitment to Matt Thornton? Not likely. Whereas the Rays still have the ability to trade Wade Davis and get a nice return because everyone knows he doesn't have the same structural/mechanical flaws. And they're doing all this while missing Longoria from the line-up. Take Paul Konerko or Dunn out of the current White Sox line-up and we're fighting with the Twins and Royals to get to last place and a Top 5-7 pick in 2013. Many would argue that's exactly what we SHOULD be doing.

Raining here in Jiangsu Province, China too, lol.

QUOTE (ptatc @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:04 AM) Especially if they do not change the mechanical flaws that lead to the problem in the first place. And the Twins had that amazing 2006 stretch run, the Tigers the 2007 World Series, to show for Liriano and Zumaya...there's that. What do we have, exactly? The Twins also made the playoffs two more times with Liriano as one of their STARTERS and not relievers. Are you so sure GM Ryan would have given up the 2006 season and done what exactly with Liriano? Put him into the bullpen all season long? Would the Twins have made the playoffs in 2009 and 2010 without Liriano in their rotation?

This is what it has pathetically come down to now. Selling the fans of the 2nd worst attended franchise (already, with Chris Sale) in the majors that a bunch of no-names from the AA team of the worst minor league system in the world are going to rise up from nothing and save the day. Don Cooper really is good, if he can pull that off. But nobody's buying it. And whatever happened to Zach Stewart as part of the future rotations? Guess KW conveniently forgot to mention that fiasco of a trade.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 09:53 AM) What if it provides Francisco Liriano results or Joey Zumaya? If it did, you would be complaining, as Frank Thomas says, no doubt about it. Your pledge not to bring up Greg Walker lasted less than 24 hours. (Are you like Greg, where you're more a fan of personnel/coaches no longer currently associated with the White Sox? I'm starting to think you would rather the whole White Sox offense tanked this entire season if it would give you more support for your Manto attacks.) Please support the Fathom Pledge, no Walk Talk. But know this about Ken Williams: He believes in his heart that he has at least two, maybe three or four, young starting pitchers who can become the next generation of John Danks/Gavin Floyd. He loves right-hander Nestor Molina, who came from Toronto for Sergio Santos, and also lefty Jose Quintana, who signed a major-league contract after the Yankees allowed him to become a minor-league free agent. He’s also open to the idea of Simon Castro and Pedro Hernandez (both acquired from San Diego for Carlos Quentin) becoming long-term pieces of the White Sox’s pitching staff, not to mention the homegrown Cameron Bayne. For the moment, that’s your starting rotation at Double-A Birmingham. But those guys -- not the fill-ins like Eric Stults and Dylan Axelrod -- are closer to Chicago than you might think. www.chicagotribune.com/sports Whoever believes for a second in what Phil Rogers just wrote there (clearly spin from Rongey/Merkin/Williams) should have their head examined.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:47 AM) Apparently a good chunk of Soxtalk thinks rehabbing pitchers are the next big thing and really want that. If it's going to provide Steven Strasburg-esque results in 2014, better than what we're going to get from our 4th-5th starters in 2012 and 2013.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:43 AM) No, Keith Foulke was traded by KW. If he wasn't, the Sox win the division in 2003, Ozzie never becomes the White Sox manager, and perhaps never a manager. It was a watershed moment. So now we lost that season on purpose, Keith Foulke deliberately removed himself from the closer's job, all directly leading to: 1) Moneyball book and movie (Foulke/Koch/Cotts deal, Adkins, Durham, Olivo/Bradford, etc.) 2) Boston Red Sox World Championship in 2004 (Foulke as closer there) 3) Chicago White Sox World Championship in 2005 4) Ozzie Guillen as Sox manager and Greg's hero

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:41 AM) I think you might have lost your mind. Ripping Greg Walker again. Check out the Braves offense. Check out the White Sox BAA coming into this past weekend? 1st in the American League. Better than the Rangers, Rays, Yankees, Angels, Mariners, A's, Red Sox, Blue Jays, etc.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:34 AM) I think they are capable of putting up the same numbers El Duque put up in 2005. If Keith Foulke was the Sox closer in 2003, I think they would have won the division. Notice you DIDN'T SAY that Brandon McCarthy put up. So instead you compare all those rookies with the exact opposite, a grizzled veteran signed for $6.5 million instead of a collection of rookie cast-offs, waiver claims and trade throw-ins. Where's our Brandon McCarthy from 2005. Guess he's in Arizona.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:34 AM) I think they are capable of putting up the same numbers El Duque put up in 2005. If Keith Foulke was the Sox closer in 2003, I think they would have won the division. Horseshoes and hand grenades, Dick. If if if they'd only signed Kenny Rogers that offseason instead of letting him go to the Twins. If if if the White Sox had kept Thome away from the Twins in 2010 and signed him instead of Jones/Kotsay. If if if the Sox had signed Victor Martinez instead of Adam Dunn coming into 2011. If if if Rick Hahn's son's coin flip when the other way, then KW would be out of a job, Game 163 would have been a loss and a major disappointment.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:26 AM) Then keep Sale in the rotation, let him blow out his elbow and watch what caulfield aka Mitt Romney complains about then. Also, the nasty boys won a WS and we have Don Cooper to develop a #5 starter. Shouldn't be too tough, the 2005 #5 starter had a 5.12 ERA You're really going to compare that Reds' team with this White Sox team? Now who's the one who is drinking? Molina, Stewart, Hernandez, Santiago etc., have been either in our system for less than one full season or starters for barely more time than that. But what Greg Walker couldn't manage to change in a decade can be undone in a matter of days and weeks by Cooper, that's not a completely impossible standard. And it helps to have guys with major league TALENT and ABILITY to develop. And since when is PHT the Slam Section? I voted for Obama, but I bet I could find 100 times since he has been president that he's flip-flopped his position. Bill Clinton was famous for it. And, what have I changed my position on exactly? For the whole offseason, I consistently supported Kenny Williams against the likes of Marty34. You will see no wavering, go through every single thread if you'd like. Now, I have thrown in the towel. As opposed to Romney, if Obama came out for protecting the American flag from being burned by protestors, Romney would come out for flag burning the next day.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:24 AM) They had a great shot in 2003 if they had a better closer than Billy Koch, the actually were in 1st place the middle of September,and btw, their 5th starter at the begining of 2003 that year was the All Star game starter. 2004, they were right there, at least for a playoff berth, but did lose Maggs and the Big Hurt. 2005 their 5th starter was El Duque who was lucky to even make the postseason roster. Not exactly reliable. Danny Wright 1-7, 6.15 ERA Josh Stewart 1-2, 5.96 ERA Mike Porzio, 1-1, 6.43 ERA Neal Cotts, 1-1, 8.10 ERA 4-11 So, you're going to tell me that Dylan Axelrod, Stults, Simon Castro, Pedro Hernandez, Santiago and Nestor Molina are going to be a significant improvement there??

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:21 AM) We are talking about the bullpen. Get a grip. The argument is bullpens are a dime a dozen, that you shouldn't waste pitchers with talent by putting them in the bullpen. Does anyone not get Sale can't handle the rotation physically? The point ALSO is that having an ELITE/SUPERSTAR/NASTY BOYS/WORLD-BEATING bullpen does you absolutely no good with a so-so starting rotation on a rebuilding team. What, is Mel Allen going to give us bonus points from the grave for leading the Rolaids Relief Team Bullpen stat in 2012? That's kind of like the Cubs' "attendance trophy" every season.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 7, 2012 -> 10:17 AM) I guarantee if none of this news came out and Sale continued to pitch in the rotation and blew out his elbow, at least 95% of the people crying about his move to the bullpen would be up in arms at the White Sox for allowing his injury to occur. That includes the people who think right now he should continue to start until his elbow blows up. How many times did the White Sox go the playoffs from 2001-2004 when they had no credible 5th starter? Why should there be any reason to believe that would change now? You're telling me our hitting on this team is significantly better than those years? I think not. So why would there be any reason (other than sheer blind luck) for a White Sox historical pattern to reverse itself in the next 12-24 months?