caulfield12

QUOTE (Andrew @ Feb 11, 2012 -> 03:14 AM) 1.)- Totally Agree here. 2.)- Ok...good. 3.) - A qualification here - you do this for 1/2 season. If they're good (or one is decent,other not, maybe both average etc.) do a deal and move them BOTH if you can. NEITHER is a fit for this team so get rid of them (or either of them) when the perceived value presents itself. I mean...like the MINUTE either/both looks any good. F***ing garbage, both of them. 4.) I don't know what you mean here. "Extended looks?" They have #s or not. Every single one of these guys you mention are non-starters/bench. Who gives a s***? 5.)- I have absolutely NO IDEA what you mean here. I sort of 1/2 quipped about a post somewhere else were it was projected Dunn will be the #2 producer on this team and I remarked he'd have to surpass Alexei.... It was obviously kind of silly but not really. Alexei is easily the most valuable player on this team. Let me know if you want to argue that. 6.) - No - Let Chris run. All the way. As FAR as he can go. Nobody is going to fall for that McCarthy s*** again. 7.) - Right, well.... we'll see, I guess. It's because Ramirez is the single most valuable trade chip we have....bringing back the biggest potential return. Marty34 has been advocating his trade for months now. I'm in between. I do see the point that he will be entering his early to mid 30's as the team theoreticallly starts to compete again in the next 2-3 years, but his salary will also jump up quite a bit 2-3 years from now as well. Because he's such a bargain with both of his contracts (the original one and the one they're now operating under)...he has huge value to about 8-10 teams in baseball, if not more. He does seem to have the type of body that will hold up better than say an Ordonez or Fielder over time, but we can't be 100% sure about his exact age and he does look older than the official age. Then again, so did Contreras and so does Viciedo. As far the middle infield...if Beckham flops again and/or Ramirez is traded, you're going to have to replace 2 middle infielders. That's why I said there's a good chance that a couple of those guys will get extended looks. In an ideal world, Beckham hits like at UGA and his first season in the bigs or 2nd half 2010 and the conversation is moot. Certainly, going forward is exponentially more difficult without Gordon playing at close to All-Star level. But we have insurance just in case he flops.

They would be able to skip Sale (if they so choose) on April 30th, May 10th and May 30th. Not sure they need to rest him twice in the span of 10-11 days, but one of those might be a good opening earlier in the season to save him for potential important August/September innings later.

I've been know to write essays before, but no need. 1) See if Beckham, Morel, Viciedo and DeAza are everyday players....they have to be for us to succeed going forward, at least 3/4. 2) Continue exploring trade options for the likes of Floyd, Konerko, Thornton, AJ, Crain and Ohman. If the team totally tanks, you have to give Flowers 3-4 months to see what he can do as the everyday catcher. If he can't do it, you need to replace him from outside the organization via trade or the draft. 3) Play Peavy/Dunn/Rios as much as possible and see what options are out there for salary dumps, particularly with Rios and Peavy. Dunn, if he rebounds, there's a higher likelihood we keep him. 4) Give extended looks to Lillibridge, Escobar, Ozzie Martinez and Tyler Kuhn. Determine if Brent is a Joe McEwing/Jose Oquendo "jack of all trades" type, if you want to move him back and forth from the OF to IF or if he should stick at one position, possibly replacing Beckham or DeAza (you can't bench Rios or Dunn in a year like this, Greg). McPherson and Dan Johnson could figure in as well, but they're basically retreads and roster filler until we can replace them with better talent from within. 5) Decide once and for all if Alexei Ramirez is a franchise cornerstone or valuable trade chip. 6) Shut down Chris Sale when it becomes necessary and audition Molina, Castro, Santiago, Petricka, Axelrod, Rienzo, etc. Anyone who emerges from our High A through AA teams at that position. 7) We have 10-15 NRI's and minor league bullpen prospects in AA/AAA that all need to be looked at carefully. I won't even bother to take the time to name all of them. Pitch well in 2012 and you'll get your shot with the big league club, just like Ehren Wasserman did in 2007.

It has worked before with Jenks and Santos, although they had top prospect status earlier in their careers, so you clearly don't expect Mustain to make it. We went through something similar with Jason Dellaero (that didn't take) and we also had Brooks Kieschnick, who went on to surprise with the Brewers, two more converted players. Of course, they were converting from position players to pitchers, so they at least had baseball backgrounds. It's a 5% shot at best, if he can get a fastball into the mid-90's (with some life and movement) and then at least an average breaking ball. But this signing isn't any better or worse than say the Royals trying to turn Brian Anderson into a pitcher or the Pirates signing Indian cricket and jal alai players. Low risk, decent reward. Wonder if this came through Paddy or Hahn?

Basically, KW has a free pass for at least this year. That could all change if Ventura's completely in over his head and the team starts off 10+ games under .500 in the early months. Then the storyline becomes the fate of Konerko, AJ, Floyd, Crain/Thornton and playing as many younger players as possible to see what we have for 2013, especially at the catching position with Flowers and/or a possible acquisition there. Anything would be better than last year. Maybe the media attention won't be as high with Ozzie's theatrics gone, but in the worst case scenario, we get to see another 25-30% roster turnover and long looks at Molina, Castro, Axelrod and Petricka, along with 3-5 new bullpen arms auditioning. It then starts to look like 2007 (minus the "breakout" year of Josh Fields, unless you count Viciedo as a rookie....and the blahness of Andy Gonzalez/Jerry Owens/Ehren Wasserman), and the clock's REALLY ticking on KW, giving him one more year of cover, probably.

Then you throw in Alexei Ramirez, Viciedo and Gio Gonzalez, it's not quite so abysmal. The anger is that Hudson and Gonzalez are putting up those numbers with other clubs, obviously. And, it's about the current state of the system being bereft of many impact players. That can all change in one minor league season, and things will probably look quite a bit rosier in 12 months than they do now.

Morel should be better than last year, both offensive and defensively. Beckham can't get any worse offensively. Same with Rios and Dunn. Ramirez is likely to be at or better than what he did offensively in 2011. AJ should put up similar pedestrian numbers at catcher. The only players you don't expect to put up the same numbers are Konerko and DeAza. Viciedo has the potential to have a breakout year offensively, and SHOULD be healthier than Carlos, although he's had some injury problems as well over his 3 years with the Sox. Unless Floyd is traded, there are no obvious holes in the rotation. Bullpens are a crapshoot, but it's not like the cupboard is barren there. If Reed comes through, we'll be fine. One shouldn't be expecting 90 wins, but neither would I expect 90-100 losses, either. If nothing else, having a new manager and clubhouse environment with Ozzie Guillen gone should be good for 3-5 extra wins just on the face of it because of how dysfunctional things were last year. And Chris Sale could have a breakout/dominant 4 months of pitching, too. Nor should we discount one of our young guys like Molina or Castro having a huge impact in the 2nd half. Our system is due to produce another Hudson type situation where a starting pitcher rockets through our system.

And Martinez might not even be 100% to start 2013...they're playing with fire having three DH's on the roster, and then adding Cespedes, who could just as easily be another Fukudome. Cespedes is clearly not a true CFer, either. They already have Boesch and D. Young, as well as Austin Jackson. Not even sure how he fits, probably more for 2013 than 2012. The Twins almost never make mistakes and they really blew it with Nishioka. International free agents are so hard to assess. And just wait until Greg's Marlins have problems with Hanley, Zambrano and Morrison's tweets. Reyes ends up healthy for approximately 75 games and Bell pitches like Doug Jones and Josh Johnson isn't quite back to 100%.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Feb 10, 2012 -> 03:35 AM) Oh for Christ. f***ing. Sakes. No, it's a f***ing stupid hindsight post. Almost everyone in Soxdom LOVED the Dunn signing aside from your father, Whitesoxrandy, and my brother (who was for the E-Jax trade because "Prospects never do anything!"). If by "a lot" you mean ".5% of all Sox fans" then sure, maybe that number comes out to more than 10. That might be considered a lot to someone from Kansas. But stop lauding every damn post that agrees with you as "post of the year." I get that they're more rare then a blue moon or J4L being sober, but just because they spew the same ideology as you does not make them good posts. I f***ing teared up and was sad as hell when Mark when to go join the Oz Show. He was my idol when I would play baseball. I didn't pitch, but I knew he made it because of hardwork so he was my inspiration. Each game I wore a Mark Buehrle #56 shirt underneath my jersey and it's so tattered now that I probably couldn't wear it even if he was still here. And if 3 bad moves are enough to can Kenny, how many would it f***ing take to can Ozzie? Is he also like a Tootsie Pop where the world may never know? Was it playing Rios? Pinch hitting Dunn against lefties? Leaving in Humber or Peavy? Frasor? Benching Morel for performing? Dicking around players in the lineup? Falling in love with mediocre s*** like Randy Williams, DeWayne Wise, and Jerry Owens? Explain those to me Greg. He made the f***ing lineups and no one man is more responsible for this team not making the playoffs in recent years or stunting the growth of players like Morel. Kenny, Dunn, Rios, Peavy, JR, Coop, none of them did as much damage as this one greedy, selfish asshole who had to make them the "Chicago Ozzies" and made bad moves because he was either being spiteful or he was just a terrible f***ing manager. Don't forget the wisdom of the Kotsay/Jones over Thome bull-headed DH move that 50% cost us the ALCD crown in 2010.

Part of me is rooting for the Tigers, just because they almost doomed themselves with bad/bloated contracts and the same might easily happen with Cespedes, Martinez, Fielder, Verlander and Cabrera hogging so much payroll space.

Have to be using the threat of a walk back to the DR as negotiating leverage. I'm not exactly how sure that visa process works...but it's not 100% sure that he'll just be able to re-enter the US again without any complications the 2nd time. In other words, make a good deal now, he's yours. Wait...and maybe he won't be able to start the year in your minor league system and go through big league camp. Of course, that works two ways. Some teams will just wait them out and the pricetag might come down to the $30-40 million range the longer it drags out, especially if he's back in the Dominican and not holding meetings with other teams. Then again, any American front office executive is free to fly down there and meet with him and probably Katz or Katz's in country representative (Spanish interpreter/translator).

And yet our system was rated #1 in 2000 or so and exactly how many of those players had an appreciable impact on the 2005 championship? Buehrle and Garland were really the only ones who "stuck," and Mark was mostly on the periphery of the Top 10-15 during his minor league career.

I think in context, the only blame goes for investing so much in a one-dimensional player. Then again, with the power numbers down, having a real/genuine power threat (LH to boot) in the middle of the line-up seemed critical to our success...how much you want to blame Ozzie and KW for throwing Thome under the bus, that's best left to another thread or discussion. http://www.yankeeanalysts.com/2011/07/is-t...an-league-31965 The thing is, the average American League team spent only $6.8 million on the DH position and we're spending almost twice that...which is forcing us to cut from other areas (also due to Peavy/Rios underperforming). Over the same five-year period, the 14 American League teams employed something like a full-time DH in 57 out of 70 possible seasons. (“Full time” is defined here as 300 or more plate appearances with at least half the player's games at DH.) The average salary of those players? $6.8 million. And that doesn't include the cost of DHs who break down due to age or injury. Travis Hafner made more than $8 million in 2008, Ken Griffey $2.3 million in 2010, and neither made it to 300 plate appearances. Frank Thomas had a $12.5 million salary when he was with the Blue Jays in 2008, Pat Burrell was making $9 million from the Rays in 2010, Shea Hillenbrand $6 million from the Angels in 2007. All three were cut early in the year and were signed for a song by other teams. The financial impact of the Designated Hitter rule also widens the gap between big- and small-market teams. Just compare the haves and have-nots: Over the same five seasons, the average AL team that finished .500 or worse had a payroll of $71.1 million, indistinguishable from the $72.0 million average in the NL but $37.3 million behind the winning teams, while the NL teams trailed the winners in their league by $17.6 million. Some of those American League teams kept their costs down by just giving up. Sure, a well-run small-market team can compete by filling roster spots with players who haven’t reached free agency yet and thus are paid below their market value. But the more roster spots there are to fill, the harder it is to use the farm system to keep up with the teams that are buying high-end veterans on the open market, especially the big sluggers who generally fill the ranks of DHs. The average age of the starting DHs in the AL over that period? 32.7 years old. Aside from Billy Butler on the 2007-08 Royals, no American League team employed a DH under the age of 25, and the only AL franchises to use a regular DH under age 29 were the Royals, Twins, Rays, and Blue Jays. And the DH gives roster flexibility to the biggest players in the free-agent market. The Yankees, for example, could move guys like Jason Giambi and Hideki Matsui there near the end of big contracts to make room for still more high-priced acquisitions. http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle...ics-of-baseball

Cespedes meets with Marlins, visits ballpark By Joe Frisaro / MLB.com | 02/08/12 6:40 PM EST MIAMI -- For several hours on Wednesday, Marlins officials met with Yoenis Cespedes. They showed him around Miami, and gave the Cuban native a tour of their new ballpark. Overall, the visit went well. Still, the Marlins are in a wait-and-see situation as to if they will actually sign the 26-year-old outfielder. "It was good to see him again," Marlins president David Samson said on his weekly segment of The Dan LeBatard Show on 790 The Ticket. "We hadn't seen him since he was in the Dominican. He's still not a free agent officially. "But he was able to be in town for some appointments, I guess. He wanted to come and see the ballpark, and we're always happy to show people the ballpark." Cespedes recently gained temporary residence in the Dominican Republic. He received a travel visa, and arrived in Miami on Tuesday afternoon. Cespedes and his agent, Adam Katz of Wasserman Media Group, met with Marlins' officials on Wednesday. They took a tour of Marlins Park, located in the Little Havana section of Miami, in the afternoon. "First of all, I need to play good baseball, wherever I go," Cespedes said through a translator on Channel 7 WSVN. "If I get to play where there is a Latin community, it's that much better." Despite being declared a free agent by Major League Baseball on Jan. 25, Cespedes has not been legally cleared by the U.S. Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control. Currently, the outfielder remains "blocked" by the OFAC. Until Cespedes is unblocked, he can negotiate and even reach agreement with a team. The signing, however, won't become official until after he is legally cleared. Samson said Cespedes did not take a physical on Wednesday. The Marlins have aggressively pursued Cespedes for months. A contingent of at least 10 employees, including team owner Jeffrey Loria, attended a Cespedes workout in the Dominican Republic in November. Multiple sources consider the Marlins the frontrunner to signing the Cuban sensation. The Marlins, Tigers, Cubs, Orioles, White Sox and Indians all have expressed interest in Cespedes. There is optimism that he will be cleared to sign with a team before the start of Spring Training later this month. With Miami's large Cuban influence, the Marlins feel Cespedes is a natural fit. His impact could be felt on the field and at the ticket gate. The Marlins project him as a center fielder. But even if he signs, it is likely, he will open the season at Triple-A New Orleans. Emilio Bonifacio is the frontrunner to be starting center fielder on Opening Day. Samson said on his radio show that exactly how many tickets a player like Cespedes would sell is hard to measure. "It's hard to know," Samson said. "Everything has to hit at the right time. I think if we have this new ballpark and we win, that is the key, much more than anything else. "Having Cespedes on our team would be great. But we don't control it. We'll try to come to a negotiated deal. If we can't, we can't. That's ok. The team is always more important than any individual. And we've got a great team right now. We just have to go out and prove it." Joe Frisaro is a reporter for MLB.com. He writes a blog, called The Fish Pond. Follow him on Twitter @JoeFrisaro. This story was not subject to the approval of Major League Baseball or its clubs.

QUOTE (Andrew @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 11:35 PM) So.... ??? Anything? www.miamiherald.com/sports Cespedes is Miami-bound for likely Marlins visit Cuban outfielder Yoenis Cespedes, who is the last remaining target of the Marlins' offseason acquisition spree, is scheduled to arrive in Miami later this afternoon and will more than likely meet with team officials tomorrow. Cespedes will first meet today with his agent, Adam Katz. A handful of teams are believed to be interested in the 26-year-old slugger, and there are reports that bidding for the free agent could hit the $60 million mark. The Marlins have been outspoken in their desire to land Cespedes, which is most unusual of the typically tight-lipped organization. Even if the Marlins are successful in signing Cespedes, he will almost certainly start the season in the minors. Once he's proven himself there, the Marlins must then decide where to position him once they call him up. Cespedes has been playing center, a position that will be occupied to start the season by Emilio Bonifacio (Bonifacio, by the way, had his salary arbitration hearing this morning.) Scouts believe Cespedes is better suited in a corner outfield spot, both of which are currently taken on the Marlins by Mike Stanton and Logan Morrison. But those are details for later. More than likely, the Marlins will give him the grand tour of their new ballpark, take him to Joe's Stone Crab for lunch, and give him their best sales routine to convince him that South Florida is the place to be. Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/fish_bytes/...l#storylink=cpy

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 09:11 PM) To be fair KW inherited him from Schueler and subsequently let him have too much free reign. I don't think KW should fall on the sword for someone he inherited even if it did happen on his watch. Bowden hired Rijo and thus was more responsible for him and his actions. As mentioned below, wasn't it KW operating directly beneath Schueler in the organizational hierarchy who brought Wilder on board? He originally was hired by the White Sox as a special assistant to General Manager Ken Williams on November 5, 2003, before assuming the role of director of player development on December 8, 2003. In his new role, Wilder is responsible for assisting General Manager Ken Williams with evaluating the major league club, as well as assisting with player development and scouting evaluation. As director of player development, Wilder oversaw the entire minor-league department and player development staff and also the club's Latin American Operations. In three seasons in that role, the White Sox system produced pitchers Bobby Jenks and Brandon McCarthy, third baseman Josh Fields and outfielders Brian Anderson, Jerry Owens and Ryan Sweeney for the major-league roster. Wilder spent four seasons with the Milwaukee Brewers from 2000-03, working as a special assignment scout in 2003 after serving as vice president of player personnel from 2000-02. In that capacity, Wilder was the primary talent evaluator for the Brewers at both the major and minor league levels, oversaw their scouting and player development systems and directed the professional scouting staff. (Also worked for the Altanta Braves from 1991-1995). That's quite a bit different from Rick Hahn being blamed, for example, for something Buddy Bell did or didn't do as director of the minor leagues.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 06:51 PM) I think some of this was fallout from Wilder and his kickback scheme. Players may have been hesitant to sign knowing they has to give some of the bonus to them. Another reason for KW to fall on his sword, in the collective scheme of things. Still...I'm sure he learned a valuable lesson. But that same type of situation toppled Bowden and Jose Blame It On Rijo in Washington.

QUOTE (Heads22 @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 08:14 PM) Dunn's 2011 season doesn't mean it was the wrong move to make, it means it was a move that went wrong, and when evaluating a GM that needs to be taken into consideration. But couldn't you argue, since we're ALWAYS in "win now" mode over the last decade...that Hudson for Jackson was also the best move to compete in 2010, that Hudson couldn't have possibly put up the same numbers as E-Jax did? That's where you get into, "yes, but...we lost 4 1/2 years of cost-controlled Daniel Hudson," which added to the payroll and put KW in a position where he had to deleverage the salaries of Teahen/Frasor/Quentin/Jackson/Buehrle, etc. The Santos one...is the head scratcher. Will be interesting to see how that one works out...but at least there's the logic of Addison Reed as your go to option. Trading Thornton/Crain/Floyd...those would have been more expected from a team in our position. And the Danks extension was the diametrically opposed option of dealing Sergio. At least we're unpredicatable. There's that. Other than David Ortiz, how many other full-time DH's are paid over $10 million per year??? I know Posada was as well, last year. Just curious.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 05:40 PM) But frankly, I'm not sure we'd want him. Agreed, Viciedo HAS to play everyday. I could go either way on DeAza, but he definitely earned the starting job based on his play last year. His to lose.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 07:22 PM) That's not the tone I got. I read his quote as him acknowledging that he's partially accountable for the team's poor performance of late and was willing to accept a lesser position if Jerry thought it was best for the team. I see no problem with him stating that to the media. At least he's admitting that he f***ed up, unlike someone else we got rid of. Also, what's wrong with him wanting to stay in the organization after leaving the GM spot? KW has his faults, both personally and professionally, but he seems like a loyal employee who would put Jerry's best interests first. For f***'s sake, he's taken a ton of abuse from the Guillen family over the past few years and really hasn't discussed it much with the media, which is not the type of person KW is. Maybe because he has so many skeletons in his closet, he doesn't want to go there with Ozzie/Cowley. Better to ignore and "act like the better man" than to engage the Guillens in public. And probably there was a direct order or request from JR to let it go and not breathe further life into Ozzie's departure storyline.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 04:15 PM) I've said it before and I'll repeat it. It was always disheartening to have to rely on acquiring major league players that had fallen off, but it's pretty damn sad that we now have to do the same thing with prospects. At least we have the ability to sustain a payroll and pay for those younger, cost-controlled players. It's just that there's now such an "overpremium" on them (especially pitchers) that it's hard for KW to exploit this area as much, with Quentin being a prime example. Of course, were it not for Peavy/Dunn/Rios, we'd still be able to easily afford Carlos for this season.

Split decision goes to DA.

Castro has the ability to be a lot better than C or C+ or whatever he's rated, but the point still remains with the sheer numbers favoring the Marlins.

What's the consensus on Chronicle from those who have seen it? Sorry, late to the thread after 3 weeks travelling. Seems to be a director with a ton of promise who operated without CGI but managed to jam in about 5-10 "how the hell did they do that?" moments. The last half of the movie...felt like a superhero becomes villain story arch. If nothing else, it was very creative and original, and blows much more expensive flicks like I Am Number 4 or Percy Jackson out of the water.

In the end, you take risks. We've seen that money go to the likes of Silverio, Anderson Gomes and Orlando...and it's a better idea to take the risk of 10-20 Jordan Dankses or Trayce Thompson's making it and becoming a superstar than drafting the likes of Royce Ring, Broadway, McCulloch or Poreda in the first round (well, Aaron was LH and at least had some above average heat at one point). Plus it helped to keep his brother in the fold, there was that theory as well. He had all the raw physical tools (not unlike BA) that you look for in a young outfielder, not unlike our drafting of Sweeney. The problem has always been the long swing, power and K numbers. That's what happens with 90% of toolsy outfield prospects, they go bust. And saying is Cespedes worth 8-10 Joe Borchards in terms of price isn't quite the point, although the numbers are scary. If nothing else, it makes the Viciedo and Ramirez signings look even more "genius" in retrospect. Then again, if we just had average results in the Dominican and Venezuela over the last decade, our farm system would actually be competitive vis a vis the rest of MLB.