caulfield12

QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Jul 17, 2011 -> 12:03 PM) Why did Beckham not try to break that up? He's been taking lessons from Alex Rios in not exerting too much unnecessary energy? 17 innings string with the Tigers not scoring just broken....note to AJ: No low and inside hanging curveballs to LHB's.

Sizemore was pulled from that Orioles game early. Wonder why. 3-0 behind the infamous Jeonmar Gomez. O's starting some jokester I've never heard of who's getting rocked, HR's by Hafner and Santana already. (OFC, he's wearing a Cubs' hat in his pic, Atkins???) Beckham now 6/10 in this series.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 17, 2011 -> 11:39 AM) Thome, Thomas, Rowand, Uribe for starters. Uribe got to the point where he was only a minor league invite to spring training with the Giants. After playing like the NL Rookie of the Year, his career was definitely on the brink....as we only had to give up utility man Aaron Miles to get a franchise-quality SS when he's right. Uribe has a big-time prospect and was heading for Angel Berroa territory in COL. Rowand has arguably one of the five-ten worst contracts in baseball these days. Thomas didn't sustain his success for long with TOR/OAK, and his average went way down as he sacrificed for power. Thome was used very wisely, but he wasn't going to hold up for 500-600 AB's. And he certainly hasn't this year. We were one year too early parting with him, though.

8/10 batters with good swings, aggressive early in the count. And one walk. Pierre with the only bad result. Tigers really have to start looking at Ubaldo Jimenez or Derek Lowe right now. Sign Greg Walker now before his rates double.

Rios now an amazing (for him) 10 for 16 career against Penny. .625, can't believe it. Just missed a 3 run homer.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 17, 2011 -> 12:20 PM) Philthy Phirst. That was unphair. Does he work for Price Pfister? Or with the Phillie Phanatic or Philharmonic? Alliteration is fun. What's the other literary term for that....? Where the beginning of word sounds is the same in sequence.

Humber looking like 1967-68 Bob Gibson against the Tigers. Tigers' announcers amazed by his story. How many strikes he throws, particularly first pitch strikes. Very much improved control and only 7 homers surrendered the entire season. They want the January Phil Humber waiver claim from the A's put in at the end of Moneyball movie....along with Miguel Olivo and Neal Cotts.

So that means someone ELSE will view him the same way they view, say, AJ Burnett. We could get something really nice back if he gets on a roll again. IF WE WANT. 4.66 IP/3 ER 7/4 5.33/4 6.66/4 6/4 7/4 He's had TWO starts which actually are one inning longer than the minimum standard for a quality start with one more run. Basically, he's had four really bad starts out of 18, or 22%. In other words, in 14 out of 18 outings, he's given up 4 runs or less. With a "normal" White Sox offense, that should keep you in a majority of games. That looks a lot different to me than just saying 8/18 are quality starts. 3.31, 2.81 and 3.27 are his ERA's over the last 3 months. That's pretty darned consistent. It's just that first month that was a huge mess, but it was for nearly the entire team after the first two weeks of the season. You can put any of his stats up against Floyd or Danks and he'll come out the winner in those comparisons this season, except for walks/9 IP and wild pitches.

Hitters who have excelled under Walker Dye Thome (for his age) Lillibridge (well, for 2 months this year...compared with Braves) Konerko Quentin Ramirez (compared to expectations upon signing) Rowand (compared to most of the last 3-4 years, he had a couple of really good years in Philly when healthy) Crede Uribe Pablo Ozuna

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 17, 2011 -> 10:44 AM) could you imagine the gamethread meltdown if Marmol walked the bases loaded on 13 pitches, then turned a 3-0 game into a 6-3 loss? It would be epic. Greg would be epic too Kevin Gregg almost managed that feat last night against the Indians before he was mercifully pulled by Showalter.

Bruney is a concern, since Pena doesn't exist anymore....and he was a bigger concern than Bruney, in all honesty. I'd put it at #10 on our shopping list. And even if we wanted to get Marmol, what in God's name would we have to give up? For a reliever that's getting more and more expensive (looking ahead)....when we just discarded Jenks to avoid that very same thing from happening. When we've got cost control over Danks, Floyd, Quentin, Ramirez, Santos, Sale and Beckham....that's one of the few positive lights in our payroll situation. Why we'd trade away Viciedo + Mitchell + Reed + Santiago for another closer is beyond me. If anyone should be going after Marmol, it's the Tigers or Twins.

I'll hand it to Dick Allen, he's always been consistent in his defense of Walker. You gotta admire that, at least. He raises lots of valid points. Not that many of us necessarily agree, but it's healthy to have that debate instead of just a one-sided crucifixion (unless it has to do with Dunn/Rios).

But it's really hard to compare Contreras the starter with Contreras as a set-up reliever or closer. I would be a lot more convinced if Hudson or Richard put up those numbers in the AL West or even our own division. Remember when we had the theory way back when that Kip Wells could never have had the success he did with the Pirates if he was still on the White Sox? If you look at the ballparks, and the lack of offense in that division (especially with Posey out), it's hard to draw any definite conclusions. I don't recall most of SoxTalk clamoring for Richard to be a permanent member of the starting rotation. He was always seen as a guy who would really struggle the 2nd or 3rd time through an order. Let's put it this way. If you could trade Hudson/Peavy for the remainder of the season and take back Hudson/Richard in their places, would you do it? Not talking about 2012-2013-2014....just the next 70 or so games. I know that I wouldn't. And Jon Garland even looked good at times the last couple of years pitching out there. Heck, John Ely. Could either of those guys actually pitch for the White Sox, or Charles Haeger?

•According to executives polled by Sherman, only the Giants and Tigers could afford to take on all of Carlos Beltran's remaining salary, among potentially interested clubs. If the Mets paid most or all of the cost, teams like the Indians, Diamondbacks, Pirates, Red Sox, Phillies, and Braves would all be in play. •Beltran is on the Angels' radar as well... That would give the Indians an outfield of Brantley, Sizemore, Choo and Beltran. With the Tigers, Boesch, Austin Jackson and Ordonez/Beltran. Beltran could also take AB's away from an ailing Austin Jackson, theoretically, and play CF.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 16, 2011 -> 11:36 PM) After Friday's Twins game, I told myself I was done with this Sox team. I will watch them, but I won't get emotionally involved. If they complete the sweep, I might already be back in. The Tigers have now lost six of their last eight series. In none of those six series did they force a rubber game. To put it another way: In six of their last eight series, the Tigers have lost the first two games. That includes their ongoing series at Comerica Park. The visiting White Sox beat Justin Verlander in the opener Friday night, then a former Tiger blanked them Saturday. Right-hander Edwin Jackson guarded a two-run lead from the third through eighth. The White Sox added three in the ninth, then Jackson finished his nine-hit, 5-0 win. Recent trends indicate the Tigers will win today’s series finale. In all five series they’ve lost lately, they dropped the first two games, then pulled out the finale of the three-game set. In the American League Central, a division so far without a powerhouse, that pace has allowed the Tigers to stay in the race. They were seven games over .500 when they plunged into this pattern of losing the first two games of series. Now they’re four games over .500. www.freep.com/sports

Another Matt Joyce though, we could definitely use. Then you could easily replace Quentin with Viciedo and aforementioned prospect.

And once Dunn starts hitting again, KW will never deal him because that would be admitting he was dead wrong. Rios, as quite a few mentioned, should/could have been dealt in the offseason...it would have been a huge win to clear the risky contract from our books AND get anything in return, since we gave up absolutely ZERO to the Blue Jays in order to acquire him. That's an "I told you so" move if ever there was one for a GM. It's pretty clear that Rios HAS only produced in 2-3 of the 8 months we've had him on our roster coming into this season.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 16, 2011 -> 09:42 PM) When Javy Vazquez sucked, who blamed Cooper? When John Danks was 0-8, who blamed Cooper. When Contreras wasn't pitching well, who blamed Cooper? They gave him credit when they pitched well. Its exactly the opposite with Walker and everyone knows it. Apparently most people believe everyone is a .400 ba 1.100 OPS guy until speak to Greg Walker and every pitcher is a 8.00 ERA guy until they speak to Don Cooper. If the Sox had lost today 20-1 Greg Walker should be fired would have been attached to at least 25 posts. Its beyond ridiculous. A lot of hitters have done very well with Greg Walker as the hitting coach. He's not the problem. Those are extenuating circumstances. For most of that time, Danks was pitching pretty decently, we all know his offensive support is the worst or among the worst of any MLB pitcher since he's been here. So, in a way, Walker will even get blamed for Danks being 0-8, right? Because if he pitched for the Yankees during that timeframe, or Rangers, or Red Sox, he'd be 5-3 or 6-2. It's not like he went all John Lackey...who by the way, has a similar record to Danks. Contreras was never the same pitcher after his injury, particularly the back and hip problems. Cooper worked on changing his arm angles to relieve the pressure on his back, but he lost command of his fastball and forkball compared to 05-06. And he never got back that dominating fastball...the 95-97 MPH version. After the injury, he was no longer confident in the FB and overused the forkball and started to nibble. I think EVERYONE blamed Javy's lack of cojones and "testicular fortitude" for his own personal troubles and demons.

If you look at all of Jackson's peripherals, he's head and shoulders over Peavy. Just the eye test....Jackson's stuff right now and Peavy's aren't even in the same ballpark. And when you factor in Jackson's FA status and the fact that any team picking him up willl surely get the compensation/sandwich pick, it's a no brainer to at least pursue him. If nothing else, the guy has a rubber arm and is a dependable 4th/5th innings eater. When he's on, like he was for DET two years ago or with us in the 2nd half, he's a frontline starter, at least a #2 with the arsenal of an ace. He's one of the few pitchers out there who can still post quality starts when he has command of just one of his pitches. For any team (ironically, like the Tigers), he'd be a perfect addition. Even more amusing is that they could really use Matt Joyce right now with the lack of production they're getting from Magglio, not to mention his high price tag.

Dick, I'm not sure that comparison alone is fair. The fact of the matter is that we lead the majors in quality starts since 2003. There's just no arguing with that, it's one of the most important stats you can possibly throw out there. Theoretically, that means you're giving your team a very good chance to win on all of those occasions. It's true, when you remove Thomas, Valentin, Carlos Lee and Ordonez from the offense, it's going to be a lot less explosive. And even Crede, Rowand, Uribe, AJ (when he first came to Chicago), Everett, etc., were much bigger threats than the 5 "worst" guys in our line-up in 2011. And it's really no secret that when the White Sox have pitched very well (2005-2006, 2008, 2010-2011 for long stretches) it's kept our team competitive. As I've said before, a lot of this Walker angst is about Beckham's "regression." There's probably nobody on our team outside of Dunn and Rios that are incredibly off what their normal expected numbers would be...it's really just those two guys. Those situations probably have one million posts attached to them alone. Here's the way I look at it. Let's say Ozzie resigned and announced he was going to be managing the Marlins in 2012. Who would you rather bring back, Cooper or Walker? Neither? Both? Just Walker? If you looked at where our starters were in 2007 (Contreras on his last legs with us as a starter), especially Danks and Floyd, they've made tremendous strides as major leaguers. Most of us didn't think we'd get much at all out of Floyd, and we certainly didn't in the beginning. You know the list. Thornton, Jenks, Loaiza, Contreras (based on expectations when he was acquired from NY), Garland, Clayton Richard, Marte, Floyd, Danks, Santos, Humber...Edwin Jackson last year, and maybe again this year now. It's not really Cooper's fault that KW was paying Buehrle, Garcia, Contreras, Garland, Javy...etc., about 40% of the money that was going into the roster. Pitching wins games. If you want to point at his "failures," you have a much shorter list. Javy, although in all fairness, blaming Cooper for Javy....well no pitching coach in baseball's gotten through to him on a consistent basis. Then you have MacDougal, Masset, Aardsma and Sisco. Interestingly, all those pitchers supposedly were stubborn to listen to him and/or were reluctant to add other offspeed pitches to their repertoire. It just seems like Cooper can make a bigger difference with the individual pitchers than Walker can as the hitting coach. Different jobs, different methods and evaluations. But it's a lot easier to change Greg Walker than it would be to dump Rios, Dunn, Teahen, Beckham, Morel, etc.

Hopefully the Twins will destroy the Indians' bullpen over that series for us. Carmona's coming off the DL early next week as well. Still have no idea why Aaron Crow wasn't used to start the 8th instead of Francis. When you have a tie game on the road against the Twins, you should go with your best bullpen pitchers.

Doesn't get easy for Nathan. Butler/Hosmer/Francouer for his first save as the "new" Twins' closer. Fans giving him a standing ovation after Capps had blown 7 saves already this season. It will be interesting with the Twins facing the Indians (DH on Monday) next week. Who do we cheer for? Split? Kind of mixed feelings. You want the White Sox closer to first place, but everyone's nervous about the Twins getting right back into it. Hosmer with a base hit. One out. Frenchie and Moustakas (only hitting .213,1 HR, 4 RBI's in 100+ AB's) to follow. Popup to RF. So Tigers 1 GB, SOX 4, Twins 6...at one point, they were 17-37. Luckily they blew the game last night at least.

Gregg has somehow managed to load the bases with walks in the 9th. 2 K's, 3 bb's, Indians down by four with a chance to tie it with a homer by Orlando Cabrera. Sizemore next. Needless to say, the Orioles fans are not pleased. Three run double up the alley in RCF by O-Cab when he was down to his final strike (and in a huge slump). 6-5...Sizemore up, Showalter just yanked Gregg. Sizemore has a chance to tie it up or give them the lead with a homer. UNREAL. The Indians have had this knack all season long, but usually at home. Mike Gonzalez on (he's starting by praying on the mound) to try to get the final out. O's escape, Sizemore grounds out to former North Carolina basketball recruit D-Lee. WHEW. Now to the Twins/Royals, 3-3 in the 8th. Why Francis was in there, I have no idea. Aaron Crow relieved with runners on 1st and 3rd (Mauer had singled) and gave up the go-ahead single to Cuddyer. Two outs, Mauer out at the plate, runners on 2nd/3rd. Valencia up. Joe Nathan is now officially back in as the Twins' closer again.

And that's not a surprise when they've gotten rid of Breslow, Portly Reyes (he was almost always nasty against us), Rauch, Guerrier and Crain. There's serious talk about trying to bring back Rauch, even though he wasn't very popular at all in the Twins' clubhouse. Had a reputation for surliness. Indians now down 4-2 (at least) going to the top of the 9th. Hard to sweep a four game series on the road, even with Baltimore so cold. Felix Pie with a rare two-run double, 6-2. Surprised that Indians' announcer Tom Hamilton is giving up on this game ("that's ballgame, folks") already with how many comebacks they've had, even down 3-4-5 runs in the 9th.

Petricka got rocked. Now 0-5. Mitchell hitless with a walk and K. Saladino with his 12th homer.