caulfield12

QUOTE (WCSox @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 07:17 PM) Oh, I'd love Victor Martinez. But wouldn't Konerko have veto rights on a trade? And would Kenny even want to deal The Captain? His new deal calls for him to receive $12 million annually. Chicago agreed to a limited no-trade clause that states he can't be dealt to six specified teams without his permission.

But NOT having a fifth starter can keep you out of post-season, surely. See Rogers, Kenny (2003) and look at the results of our fifth starters that season. It was truly abysmal/atrocious/egregiously bad.

Presenting the only thing better than AJ throwing.... Victor Martinez in the middle of the White Sox offense, sharing C/1B/DH with Flowers, Paulie and JD. LH bat problem solved. Victor isn't worth as much at 1B (see Mauer discussion), but if we could trade Jenks and Konerko (sell high again)....wouldn't we be better off with Victor Martinez, Flowers and Dye and using the leftover money for CF/leadoff/LF/RF? You know Ozzie and KW are very familiar with Victor Martinez. Interesting thought. Don't think the Red Sox will bring him back...well, depends on what happens with Varitek, I suppose. But don't think Francona wants Martinez as their 60-75% of the PT starting catcher.

Miguel Olivo for one year and Flowers' mentor....lol. Not sure that's the greatest idea in the world, but KW and Ozzie are very familiar with Miguel, fwiw. Jason Kendall would make a good mentor, too, IMO.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 05:47 PM) Yes to Jenks. No to Webb. Why to this being tied into the same thread? Jenks gets talked about enough in every other thread. We probably have to open up an additional bit of breathing room in our payroll...not sure. Jenks is going to be around $8 million next year. The other options are trading Konerko (unlikely) and/or saving money bringing back Dye and/or Thome ($6-8 million but not $11-13 million as they're currently paid)....don't think we will ever get from out under the Linebrink contract now. OTOH, if you had THAT historically amazing rotation (Peavy/Buehrle, Webb, Floyd and Danks), it would be a crying shame to risk so many blown saves turning the game over to Thornton or Pena at the end of games. Someone like Byrd, Doug Davis...Garland, etc., is more likely for the back of the rotation unless they think Hudson and/or Torres are ready. Duchscherer has been mentioned a lot around here. Who else is rehabbing or struggling with health issues? Smoltz? Glavine? Mulder?

I MEANT FOR THE 2009/10 OFFSEASON...heading into the following April. Looks like he MIGHT be out until next May/June, possibly.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20...sp&c_id=mlb The DBacks have an $8.5 million dollar option for next year or a $2 million buyout. Would guess they would probably keep him and risk that if they're not in contention that they could trade him next year, kind of like the M's did with Bedard this year instead of letting him go and not getting anything back in return (especially when M's fans have to be reminded of how that Bedard trade cost them future contention in the AL West for many years).

Tigers rip into top pitching prospect Tillman....runner already in as Polanco doubled Granderson in, still no outs. This is going to be one of those LONG, LONG games. 5-1 O's.

Detroit is 31-16 at home, BALT wins about 1/3rd of their road games (16-34, or 32%). Verlander versus Tillman. 2.17 ERA in his last 18 starts. Verlander gives up 4 runs (HR by Roberts) and loads the bases with NOBODY OUT. JUST WOW. JINXED. Not the best odds in the world of us getting to 1 GB going into TUES. Which means BALT is guaranteed to win, one of those "trap" betting games. MINNEAPOLIS (AP)—The Minnesota Twins were proud of the way their young group of starting pitchers exceeded expectations and brought them to the brink of the playoffs last season. This year, it’s the same rotation that’s holding the Twins back in an AL Central race that remains wide open. “Our starters, it’s going to start with them,” manager Ron Gardenhire said, looking ahead at the season’s last two months. “They have to suck it up and get on a roll for us.” What stings the Twins the most is that deep, steady starting pitching has been their hallmark over eight seasons with Gardenhire in charge—the primary reason why they’ve won four division titles during that time. Thanks to Scott Baker(notes), Nick Blackburn(notes), Francisco Liriano(notes), Glen Perkins(notes) and Kevin Slowey(notes), they were one victory from a fifth last year. Because of injuries to and inconsistency from the same quintet this summer, Minnesota has been unable to sustain any significant winning streaks despite the usual exceptional production from All-Stars Joe Mauer(notes), Justin Morneau(notes) and Joe Nathan(notes) and a breakout season by designated hitter Jason Kubel(notes). Baker is the oldest member of the rotation at 27, but there’s a standard of success in place from last year that’s not being met. “We have the guys that are capable of winning,” Morneau said. “In the division, nobody’s really running away with it. If we can figure out what we need to do, hopefully the hitters can stay hot. If we keep doing what we’re doing and the pitching staff gets a little confidence, we should be a tough team. But until we start doing it at the same time, it’s going to be tough.” Baker became the ace last season, parlaying an 11-4 record and a 3.45 ERA into a new $15.25 million, four-year contract, but he has regressed in 2009. Thus, the Twins have been without the streak-stopping, momentum-creating pitcher who can consistently throw eight innings or even spin a four-hit shutout when they need it most. “I’ll vote for that,” Gardenhire said, after a 13-4 loss to the Los Angeles Angels on Sunday left the Twins three games behind the Detroit Tigers and 1 1/2 back of the Chicago White Sox in the Central. Both the Tigers (Jarrod Washburn(notes)) and White Sox (Jake Peavy(notes)) made trades last week for front-line starters. Johan Santana(notes), sent to the Mets, has never been missed by Minnesota as much as he is now. “We kind of have a lot of guys on the same level right now, as far as experience and that kind of thing,” Morneau said. “When we expect a lot out of them, it’s tough. It’d be nice to have that one guy that’s been there for eight or nine years, but we don’t and we just have to make those adjustments.” Blackburn was rolling until recently hitting a big bump. Baker has been faring better, but only after a bad start. Slowey started 10-2, but he’s having season-ending surgery to fix a bone chip in his wrist. Performances by Perkins and Liriano have been all over the place, ending in the fifth inning far too many times. Rookie Anthony Swarzak(notes) has filled in capably, but he’s also trying to find some consistency. Early exits by the starters have overworked the relievers and overexposed a lack of depth in the bullpen, too. For the Twins to stay in contention and avoid wasting these exceptional contributions from Mauer and Morneau, the rotation must find some extra mental toughness to go with those fastballs and sliders down the stretch. Gardenhire seemed to be issuing them such a challenge after Sunday’s latest deflating defeat. “You have to suck it up in this game,” the skipper said. “No one’s going to feel sorry for you. No one. We have to find a way, and we have to figure out how we can get people out and get the ball where we need to get it.” Mauer can help from behind the plate, but only to a point. “Those guys want to go out there and do well, and sometimes they try to overthrow and miss their spots,” he said. Perkins, pounded by the Angels for eight earned runs in four-plus innings, maintained a public confidence in his own pitches as well as the ability of his fellow starters to get back on track. “We do need to get on a roll. There’s no doubt about that,” Perkins said. yahoo.com/sports

Inside the Padres' financially strapped offices at Petco Park, there was a huge sigh of relief. General manager Kevin Towers had a mandate -- since last November -- to get Peavy off the Padres' books. Still, some people close to that organization believe Williams didn't need to part with so much talent to get Peavy at this point. ''The financial relief alone might have been enough to get it done,'' a Padres insider said. ''Maybe you dress it up with some bodies. But [the Sox] had a lot more leverage. [The Padres] had no other options.'' DeLuca, Sun-Times Sports

Obviously KW bought himself some leeway with 2005, lol. However, the argument is that the Padres would have given up Peavy for maybe even Richard and Russell or Poreda and Russell...as Towers was under orders from the ownership group to clear the contract, plus Peavy was hurt and there were no other suitors, so the argument goes why would KW offer the SAME package when he could have lowered it (and maybe it was changed from Hudson to A. Carter instead) and still made Towers happy just to get out from under the financial burden for the Moores' divorce situation. I guess we'll never know...and I'm not worried about Poreda or Russell ever becoming anything, but Richard and Carter definitely might. Still, you have to give up talent to get a Cy Young winner (albeit injured) in his prime.

QUOTE (Tony82087 @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 04:20 PM) 100% false. Were you around any White Sox message board from 2002-2004??? Everyone was obsessed with bringing up that Todd Ritchie for Wells/Fogg/Lowe deal and shoving it down KW's throat. It easily dwarfed Wise and Anderson as topics/issues of discussion.

AccuScore uses past player performance statistics to describe how players perform under different environmental, match–up, and game situation conditions. Using projected starting lineups AccuScore simulates each game of the 2009 Season one at bat at a time. By repeating the simulation 10,000 to 20,000 times per game AccuScore calculates the precise probability each team has of winning each game, winnin g their division, making the playoffs, advancing in the playoffs and winning the World Series. Here’s the AccuScore.com analysis of the 2009 MLB season after 17 weeks of play. visit AccuScore.com for daily updates to the season forecast and all game forecasts updated twice a day. AMERICAN LEAGUE The Chicago White Sox are 1.5 games back, and even though they had a 3-4 week their chances of winning the division and making the playoffs improved 10 percentage points. The White Sox were underdogs in all four games vs the Yankees and by winning three of four games they were projected to lose, they were able to turn a bad week that started with getting swept by the Twins into a good week. The forecast also assumes Jake Peavy(notes) will be able to play in September. Should Peavy’s status change it will have a significant impact. The Tigers improved their chances by acquiring Jarrod Washburn(notes), but they went 2-4 the past week which cost them seven percentage points. The Twins got bombed by the Angels at home which hurt their playoff chances. The Angels’ 5-1 week helped them take the lead in the AL in both current record and their chance of making the playoffs (up 6.7 percent). The offense has been red-hot even without Torii Hunter(notes). The Texas Rangers did their best to keep pace with a 5-2 week, improving their chances by six percentage points. Last week the Rangers made the playoffs as a wild card in 18 percent of simulations, but now they have a 23 percent chance of being a wild card thanks to the losses by key wild-card competitors. The Boston Red Sox parlayed an easy schedule into a 5-2 week and improved their playoff chances by six points. The Yankees dropped minus-5 points because they lost three of four to the White Sox and were just 3-4 for the week. The Yankees and Red Sox play a key series starting Thursday which could end up dictating the AL East (YES, EVERY GAME IN THIS SERIES SHOULD BE DECLARED A NATIONAL HOLIDAY AND TELEVISED BY GAMMONS AND ERIN ANDREWS). The Rays were 3-4 and their chances dropped nearly eight points. The dropoff was especially severe because they lost two of three at home the Yankees and they lost Sunday to the Royals – a game they were favored to win at an over 70 percent rate. AMERICAN LEAGUE WEEK 17 REVIEW PLAYOFF % CHANCE TEAM 27–Jul 3–Aug % DIFF WIN DIV Chicago White Sox 45.3% 55.4% 10.1% 54.4% Los Angeles Angels 86.0% 92.7% 6.7% 85.8% Boston Red Sox 62.5% 68.5% 6.0% 39.2% Texas Rangers 31.5% 37.0% 5.5% 14.0% Baltimore Orioles 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% Cleveland Indians 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% Kansas City Royals 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% Oakland Athletics 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% 0.0% Toronto Blue Jays 2.6% 0.4% –2.2% 0.1% Minnesota Twins 15.6% 13.3% –2.3% 13.0% Seattle Mariners 5.0% 1.0% –4.0% 0.2% New York Yankees 85.8% 80.7% –5.1% 55.4% Detroit Tigers 40.6% 33.6% –7.0% 32.6% Tampa Bay Rays 25.0% 17.4% –7.6% 5.3%

I love Lady Gaga. Seriously, Chris Getz WILL NOT prevent the White Sox from winning the World Series in 2009 or any future year. Josh Fields as a starter definitely had a more negative impact on our results for 2 months (April/May) as a starter...there's no argument. Now if we don't make the playoffs, it's certainly not ONLY due to Fields, there's also many other earlier offensive deficiencies like Lillibridge, Wise/Anderson/Owens, Corky Miller and Getz was very inconsistent as well, but still better than Fields from any type of "all-around" broad/general view of who's the better baseball player for THIS Sox team.

I do think the point that Richard might have a very good NL career (like Kip Wells did for awhile, and Josh Fogg, too) while the White Sox are continuing to struggle to man the 5th spot (of course, that's only WITHOUT a Peavy return in 2009) can later be used against KW. But, once again, that's only if Peavy blows out his elbow or something. And the insurance/contract we picked up from the Padres mitigates the risk factor, just like we got back about $5-6 million instead of eating David Wells' 2001 contract completely. Giving up RUSSELL was nothing at all...just a name that makes the trade look bigger, and possibly sad to those wallowing in 06/07 top prospect lists for the White Sox and believing he was actually a legit, TOP 10 prospect with most other organizations. Basically a one-pitch pitcher with so-so mechanics and much less valuable as a reliever than limited starter (like Poreda, except RHed). But if two of those three pitchers (think of Carter like a lesser version of Faustino DeLosSantos) excel, KW will never hear the end of it....UNLESS, of course, we win the World Series. In which case KW is back to being a genius and maybe having his own "revenge" book to answer Moneyball with Denzel as KW. LOL.

And Ozzie and KW agree with you, too. End of story and thread. Next year...maybe an interesting question to discuss...assuming Fields could be an 775-850 OPS 3B and not commit 25+ errors in the process.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos...asePct/minpa/25 Look at Getz's OBP since the ASB, .382 and 6th in the AL during that time period! http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos...asePct/minpa/25 ALSO, 6th in OPS. So better than AL average. Interesting argument here...all things considered, unless there's a CLEARLY better option, the INCREDIBLE affordability of Beckham, Getz, Nix and Alexei Ramirez give us many/multiple options around the rest of the payroll (starting rotation, bullpen, outfield, etc.) Imagine if we did have Brandon Allen/Viciedo/Fields paired with those four youngsters? Probably the most productive efficiency in all of baseball for cost of production...in any MLB infield. Finding better...impossible. The only weaknesses we have going forward are the 5th starter slot (until Peavy comes back), defense, health/age/range of outfield and the bullpen, which started out the 2009 season as our main area of strength the first 2-3 months of the season and has become something of a weakness recently.

Beckham would trail only Ben Zobrist in AL at 2B in OPS. Right now, he's fifth (860) behind Michael Young (so-so defensively despite GG), A-Rod, Longoria and Aybar (also limited defensively). So the argument that Rolen at 3B with Beckham at 2B is much better than Beckham/Getz has some merit, unless you consider the financial cost and the players that bringing in Rolen AND Peavy would prevent us from adding or resigning (CF, leadoff, Dye/Thome, LF/RF, etc., bullpen). Getz would be something like 14th out of 15 players (ahead of only CLE's Valbuena and also Casilla/Tolbert, who didn't have enough to qualify)... STILL, Getz's skill set (speed, doing little things, fundamentals, hustle...plus his cheap/affordable contract and production)....make him much more attractive and valuable to the WHITE SOX, especially if he can increase his OBP 15-35 points. ALEXEI is still sixth (out of 16) AL shortstops in what is a down year for him compared to his rookie campaign). http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos...t/OPS/minpa/200 If he was putting up last year's numbers, he'd be RIGHT up there with everyone in the AL except for Bartlett (is this season an anomaly or repeatable?), Jeter and COMPARABLE with Scutaro, Asdrubal Cabrera and Erick Aybar. http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/pos.../true/minpa/200 Getz at .340-.350 OPS becomes better than AL average and a much more palatable line-up option for Ozzie and KW...and I think he's definitely right there in that territory since the ASB, correct, as he has grown more and more comfortable in 2009.

$6.5-7.5 million, maybe $8 million tops (behind Papelbon) is pretty accurate as a guesstimate for Bobby Jenks in ARB, unless he completely tanks over the remainder of the season and loses the closer's role or doesn't recover quickly from his kidney stones (and they're a b****, I had them once...I understand him blowing those saves a bit better now, sometimes the pain is so great and your back hurts so much that you throw up from the pain, even if you have nothing in your stomach, it's that debilitating).

QUOTE (bmags @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 01:10 PM) Not a fan of this article. It was a weird way to frame the salary argument. Why bring up Carlos Lee as your example when he is meeting expectations, and therefore, arguably, living up to the numbers on his deal. Why not bring up a real suck contract with a bad player. It would have been stronger to say the money from Carlos Lee's contract brought a championship that Valentin, Lee, Ordonez and Thomas (out for most of that season) didn't.... Carlos LEE

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 12:32 PM) Richard's ceiling appears to be that of solid #3 starter Poreda, now that he's away from the team that drafted him, is going to start being looked at as bullpen-type because of his makeup Obviously we cant judge the deal yet, but the guys we sent are replaceable. Peavy does some things that are very hard to find, and JR gets to take on that type of starter with his preferred method -- 4 year contract or less. His point about the big contract is a good one, but we're the kind of team that has to overpay anyway. I would rather have this on the books than have another one of those offseasons where FAs turn us down and we have to settle for Nick Swisher. Actually, we underpaid Dye, Buehrle, Konerko, Alexei Ramirez, Viciedo, etc. All had bigger offers from other teams, or would have had them on the free or open market. The thing the author totally discounts is the positive affect on the fanbase, increased attendance (not quite the Halladay affect in TOR, but it will be interesting to see attendance in his home starts versus other starters, especially his first 2-3 starts), increased season ticket renewals for 2010, etc. In other words, renewed positive optimism for the future of this ballclub. Peavy, GQCQ and Beckham, for example....can sell tickets in a way that Richard or Poreda never could dream of. You're not a former Cy Young winner for nothing, and I like the "shot across the bow" aspect of ramming it down the throat of a Cubs' franchise that is very much paralyzed financially. Even if he is DEBATABLY overpaid by $3-4 million per year at the back end, I think he more than compensates by generating additional revenues, goodwill from other free agents that will give the Sox extra consideration now (someone like Figgins)...the type of starting rotation we have, of course other players would love to play here.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Aug 3, 2009 -> 10:00 AM) Anyone see us floating a Longoria like offer to Beckham? 6 years 13-15 mil? Not quite yet. Give it one more season....not that he'll pull a Chris Young, but there's no rush. And the economy could go either way. Better to wait until everything is clarified in terms of the financial direction of the game of baseball, the White Sox and just the US economic situation in general.

Why waste Viciedo's arm at 1B? He's capable of playing LF or RF possibly...as well as 3B.

I don't know...sometimes when I see Lillibridge pictures, he reminds me of Elijah Wood's character from SIN CITY...equally creepy.

I REALLY REALLY want to start a string of threads about Willie Taveras coming here next offseason with KHP. By the way, Coco Crisp might be available again if the Royals don't keep him...exactly the kind of situation where KW will go out and take a smaller risk and bring him in for one year and see what happens...like the White Sox used to do with the revolving door of RFers in the 90's like Dave Martinez, Ellis Burks, Mike Devereaux, Lyle Mouton, Cory Snyder, Shawn Lil Abner, Matt Merullo, Pasqua, etc. TWO YEARS for CHONESTER, that's the max I would go...$16-19 million. Take it or leave it...