caulfield12

Who did Egbert start against? Australia? I can't remember...and the line-up he faced that day. We do know that Marquez and Richard have started all of their games against the best possible hitters.

Nix is the best defender on the team...we've yet to see how Beckham will do at 2B over an extended period of time. He's looked better at SS so far...or are you arguing he should be beating out Alexei Ramirez, because he's clearly outplayed everyone on our team offensively?? That's the same argument as Lillibridge over Anderson...if we stuck Brent out there for the next 3 weeks about two to three games per week and he "looked good." I have no problem with taking Egbert, fine...up to Ozzie and Cooper. Why haven't we heard it mentioned yet. It's a crapshoot, he could actually be better than Carasco, who knows. I would question why his name hasn't been mentioned once by a single beat or national baseball writer as part of the White Sox conversation. As someone mentioned earlier, Marquez and Richard have had to pitch against the BETTER hitters in most line-ups at the beginning of games. I don't have all the boxes to look at how many "good" MLB hitters Egbert's actually gotten out that would make me bat an eye. Owens is quickly playing his way out of this organization and showing no signs of coming out of it. Cole Armstrong with a bomb...wow, I guess I should "jinx" the offense every game like this...unfortunately I'll be gone for a week to the Philippines and out of internet access when the games are on so I won't be able to start another ST game thread.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:08 PM) It's spring f***ing training. Balta is right about the quality of pitcher, you tried to argue about clutch situations which don't exist in exhibition games. He had 27 AB in C&L situations last year and 87 in games when there was a 1 R margin and he hit .272/.314/.494/.808. What's the spring sample size looking like? 8/27 against hand-picked/favorable lefties for BA to feast on means about as much to me as BA's homer today in garbage time or his homer against Australia.

If it's ONLY/JUST spring training, then why are we ALL talking about Beckham making the team??? We wouldn't be if he was hitting .100, but because he's performing exceptionally well, he's become a legitimate part of the conversation. How many times do we hear that BA hit two homers off Felix Hernandez...as if they means he has a lifetime get of jail free card???

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:01 PM) There's a gaping hole in the back of the bullpen, someone needs to win that spot and if we're going off who's earned it with their spring performance it's Jack Egbert. No one is going to trade for Jayson (DFA) Nix and Chris Getz is the future utility player of this ballclub, both have been thoroughly outplayed by Gordon Beckham this spring, the job should be his. Ummm...we got Loaiza and Jenks for basically nothing. Or look at someone like Carlos Pena. Just because Jayson Nix had no value to other teams last year doesn't mean he has no future value for infinity. Nix has been out for one week with a strained quad and was 5/7 before today. I don't know how you can say Beckham clearly outplayed him. Egbert hasn't pitched CLEARLY better than Marquez, Poreda and Richard...his sample size is too small to say he's the best option.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 03:57 PM) It's spring f***ing training. There are no "clutch" moments, the games are all exhibitions and populated by single A crap by the late innings. Balta has a decent argument about the quality of pitcher he's facing but give me a break, when the "score's tight"? Brian hit .296 in Close and Late situations last year, you know, during real games and put up a mid .700 OPS in tie ballgames. His OPS got progressively better as the score got tighter last season. What he does in clutch spring opportunities is irrelevant. I think Ozzie cares more what BA does against a quality pitcher in Chris Young than everyone who has come since then. I know if Viciedo hit a homer off David Price or Chris Young, it would be looked at much differently than one off Eckstrom. Van Benscrotum??? LOL I also think that BA needs to prove that he can actually put up a better than 650 OPS playing against tough RHPers. All of those late at-bats were hand-picked to face mostly lefties. How many are in that sample size anyway??? It can't be that many, usually he was a defensive (not offensive) replacement in games.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 03:50 PM) So are you taking the players who are playing the best right now (apparently 7 singles, a 1/10 BB/K and no playing time in CF is good) or the players who make the team the best it can be? So if the season started today you'd honestly be comfortable giving Lillibridge significant playing time in CF? Seriously? Then you're going with the players who "deserve" to make the team based on their spring performance because there's nothing about Brent Lillibridge that leads me to believe he'll contribute to the major league club this year. If Brent Lillibridge is on your team then I hope Jack Egbert and Gordon Beckham are as well. The problem with that line of thinking is that Egbert is the 9th starter on the team right now, assuming he's ahead of Broadway. Obviously, Owens and Anderson are struggling. The manager acknowledges/ed it...and the door's open for ANYONE as far as KW and Ozzie are concerned. I would have no problem taking Beckham, although then you're penalizing Getz and Nix and eliminating any chance to get a return on them via trade if neither has the opportunity to demonstrate anything during the regular season. Our best future line-up most certainly has Beckham at the top (first or second) of the order.

QUOTE (JorgeFabregas @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 03:48 PM) Are you accusing him of being unclutch in spring training? I do think the situations in the games....who is pitching....what's the score, etc., are part of the thinking process, yes. Anyone can swing hard and hit the ball occasionally (see Uribe, Juan), but what does he do when they really need him and the score's tight?

Yes, he specifically mentioned Lillibridge would start getting time in CF and wouldn't even rule out Beckham, although he added the caveat that Beckham would be the "everyday" player no matter where he was on the field. It was in comments made to Scot Gregor of the Daily Herald on Wed or Thursday.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 03:43 PM) So who are the 2 major league centerfielders on the roster? Wise and who? Can't be Owens, even if Brian's swing is pure s*** he still brings more to the table than Owens. Lillibridge? The infielder who's proven nothing above A ball and hasn't played CF in regular season game in 4 years? Anderson has hit two huge homers in completely meaningless situations...but failed continually when his bat was needed in clutch situations. I wonder how much Ozzie and KW will take that into consideration, kind of like Albert Belle stats when he was with the Sox.

Lillibridge was battling a wrist problem all of last season and changed his swing mechanics to compensate. He played much better in the last 4-6 weeks (like Konerko) but it's really lost in the stats. KW and Ozzie really like what he brings to the team...versatility, speed/pinch-running, best defender/back-up at SS and the ability to play CF if we give him some time out there. I won't be surprised at all if he makes the team.

QUOTE (jphat007 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 03:32 PM) It's too far away to be making any big statements like that. One player could get hot and cold and in one week their avgs will be totally different Brian Anderson has left 7 on base. He's struck out in a key situation and looked more horrible than Jerry Owens. That's hard to do. Ozzie has already told the papers he's going to use Lillibridge in CF. Lillibridge is RH and he was acquired as part of a big trade for Javier. I think that increases the odds of him breaking with the team. I know this sounds crazy...but MacDougal is coming close to being under consideration for at least being part of the conversation for making the squad.

Well, technically Owens is at .212 but it's the weakest 200+ average in spring training history. Coleman wants to rename him "Wayne Wise." Starting to remind me of Harry Carry...he's really really OLD.

The difference is that Lillibridge has two tools...speed and defense. He can play SS perhaps better than anyone in our organization (according to reports), 2B and CF as well (at least at Univ. of Washington). His minor league averages were strong/solid before the last couple of years, but he's a younger player that has more upside than Owens/Wise and probably Brian Anderson too at this point in his development. You'd have to say Lillibridge would be more valuable simply because he can play SS so well. We can debate if BA also has "power" as a tool. Dewayne Wise homers as the WBC 10 run mercy rule is about to be put into effect. Things are really shaping up to be a Wise/Lillibridge platoon with Anderson and Owens waived or traded or sent to AAA.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 03:17 PM) Do you want to change any of this? It is an anemic line-up. Ekstrom is garbage/horrible. The only hitters who looked good b4 that were Konerko and Fields against Chris Young. Owens cost Floyd a run with a bonehead play. Wise made a baserunning mistake but it didn't end up hurting us. Anderson and Owens are playing like....well, there are many possible words to choose. Owens, I think, has actually squared approximately ONE ball the whole spring and hit a line drive somewhere. Maybe he does it in BP occasionally, I doubt it.

Lillibridge would have to hit against LHPers with Wise getting most of the AB's against righties. He could also pinch run and back up Ramirez better than Getz/Betemit and also play occasionally at 2B, depends if you take Nix or not. Ironic....both Owens and Anderson K in an inning when the Sox send up 12 to the plate. Wise, CF 3 1 0 1 0 0 3 .350 Nix, 2B 2 1 0 0 1 0 1 .556 Pierzynski, C 3 1 2 1 0 0 0 .476 Konerko, 1B 3 2 3 3 0 0 0 .357 Fields, 3B 2 0 2 1 1 0 0 .389 Anderson, B, RF 3 0 0 0 0 1 7 .172 Lillibridge, SS 3 1 2 1 0 0 1 .310 Owens, LF 3 0 1 0 0 1 3 .212 Floyd, P 1 2 1 0 1 0 0 1.000 Lillibridge's average is climbing...that's the nature of spring, he can catch Wise in almost one game.

Just don't look at Lillibridge's offensive numbers the last two seasons and project Brent as a regular CFer. Well, maybe KW "fixed" him just by bringing him to the White Sox. Owens manages not to get somehow by Todd Worrell's brother...Konerko scores on WP, miracles (milagros) do happen.

That Baines trade was at the end of his career...or towards the end. The Baines for Sosa/Fletcher/Alvarez move was in 1988 or 1989 I think. Josh Fields continues to come through with another hit...station-to-station baseball at its best/worst. Nobody has advanced once in this inning more than one base on any of the plays. For an outfielder (on Anderson) to be hitting .192 "that's not so good." Anderson K's for the FIRST White Sox strikeout of the ballgame. Anderson is really killing his chances. Lillibridge making a case to play in CF as part of a platoon instead of Anderson.

Wise with an RBI on an infield FC...runners on 1st and 2nd with one out, Owens cut down at 3rd, no attempt at a DP. C'mon Nix, come through with a big hit. Nix apparently gets a break on a call that could have been the 2nd out and takes the walk. Bases juiced with AJ up, only one out, Sox up 3-2. Somehow a ball that should have been a double ends up only scoring one run...Wise had tagged up at 2nd and misjudged the ball, so the runners could only advance one base at a time. Wow...Konerko with another hit...5-2 White Sox. Konerko 3/3 with 3 RBI's. Owens up to a "blistering" .219. Anderson stuck at .179 in shades of his 2006 batting average in early June of that year.

Aha....didn't Lui (Liu) Rodriguez (utility infielder) come up with the Twins? Maybe I'm confusing him with someone else. Jerry Coleman thinks the White Sox look FAST, lol...after Lillibridge ends up at 2nd base on the hustle double. Owens with the infield single to the left side...3B couldn't make the play, Lilli had to stay at 2nd. Floyd with a chance to bunt the runners over, only 1 career sacrifice in his career so far. The "wheel" play was on, Floyd flails at a ball and ends up with an infield single that hits the bag at 2nd...Lilli somehow doesn't score but bases loaded for D-Weezy.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 02:40 PM) They actually left Floyd out there to run, huh? I wonder how well he runs. Gavin was timed running down to 1B on the walk at 2/10th's of a second faster than Owens running from home to first on the weak grounder to Chris Burke. God, Brian Anderson is really making this hard on KW and Ozzie...really hard. At least you can "argue" that Owens is walking occasionally. Cliff Floyd rips a homer and we're all tied up like that.

BTW, that was Fields' 3rd double of the spring. Beckham has five, leading the team...I think he had at least one or two doubles against Australia in the exhibition game as well. Gavin Floyd, auditioning for the leadoff spot, shows Anderson and Owens a thing or two by grabbing a walk on the full count. Fouled off a pitch even.

Owens leading Anderson in the race to the Mendoza Line, .194 to .185. Gavin Floyd gets a strikeout with his slider? Sure it wasn't his curve? They keep call him throwing his slider and not curve....interesting. You think they'd be more familiar with Gavin Floyd from his time w/ the Phillies...it's not like he wasn't one of the best pitching prospects in all of baseball. Owens blasted by announcers for diving for a "marginal" flyball that allowed the typing run to score and letting and ball get past him all the way to the wall. UGH. Well, this is the only time some of us can get away with rooting AGAINST the White Sox and not feel TOO guilty. I'm marking that as an unearned run in my scorebook, lol....Gavin had a ton of those last year where the defense didn't pick him up like it should have.

Well, at least our two big offensive threats in this particular line-up came through. Fields is fouling some balls off and making better contact. Anderson advances the runner to 3rd...productive out. Lillibridge doesn't get the runner in, comebacker to the mound, Fields still at 3B. Owens' reputed speed doesn't come through as he fails to pick up Lillbridge on a MEHHHHHHH grounder up the middle and is thrown out at first.

You know you're in trouble when the hitter you're most looking forward to is the pitcher....I could see if it was Rick Rhoden, Dontrelle Willis, Tom Glavine, Rick Ankiel, Brooks Kieschnick, Jason Dellaero, Carlos Zambrano, etc.