caulfield12

I don't think the odds are very high of getting Rasmus at all (0.005% chance). Ankiel and Ludwick are the ones being shopped...

Has anyone seen any updates on the Viciedo "sweepstakes," quotes from Torres or other teams about the workouts, etc.? I was thinking there might be something in the Dominican press, but I haven't taken the time to search for it on the net.

Someone might want to try to get Phil Rogers or Mark Gonzalez to investigate this. I know the times in the past I've sent them e-mails, they've usually responded....I think Rogers' is "[email protected]" if I'm not mistaken. It would make a huge difference to the team to be getting an additional $5-6 million back on Contreras (assuming he doesn't make it back this season).

Don't know what's going on. Braves' GM Frank Wren claimed the offer is tabled and that they are targeting other rotation possibilities, most likely Ryan Dempster. Yet the Braves had the best "talent match" on paper. Wonder if the Cards pick up their efforts to center a deal around Ludwick/Ankiel with some other sweeteners involved. It would be funny if the Cubs lost out on Peavy, Dempster and Wood. You have to think they'll take a run at AJ Burnett, Lowe, etc. I doubt they get involved with Sabathia, whose first offer from the Yankees is in the $140-142 million dollar range. With the Soriano and Fukudome deals looking less and less attractive going forward, we'll see if they show some financial restraint.

San Diego pitcher Jake Peavy, the Cy Young Award winner currently being dangled in trade talks, initially indicated to the Padres that he would prefer a deal to one of five teams -- Atlanta, St. Louis, the Chicago Cubs, the Los Angeles Dodgers and Houston Astros. from yahoosports

It will be interesting if they do trade Fields before the 2009 season starts...do other teams perceive his value to be higher than Nick Swisher, and by how much? I think it's got to be pretty close...with a slight edge to Fields. Although certainly debate-worthy.

QUOTE (WHITESOXRANDY @ Nov 14, 2008 -> 01:16 AM) There's no way that I believe that Kenny could not have gotten 1 good player back for Swisher from any team. Not one team would offer a solid regular thirdbaseman, secondbaseman, starting picther, relief pitcher, outfielder or B prospect? I don't believe it. The Yankees wouldn't have offered Ian Kennedy straight up for him? Or any of their top 10 prospects? I don't believe it. And, and, and the Sox throw in a solid pitching prospect, too? I'm sorry but I think this trade will go down with the Todd Ritchie trade. I know that Kenny has proven himself to be an excellent GM to me and I want to give every deal the benefit of the doubt. But, I can't with this one. There's no way that Swisher is going to suck for the rest of his career. And, more importantly, other teams such as the Yankees don't believe that. He had to be worth something and he gave him away for nothing. I'll go on record right now as saying that none of these 3 players will amount to anything for the White Sox - next year or ever. Unbelievable. If I'm wrong on this one then Kenny is a magician and I'll never question him again. But, I still say this is Todd Ritchie part 2. Yes, I am sure the final offers were Kershaw, Price/Garza, Kennedy/Hughes and Homer Bailey all on the table for Swisher, but KW went with his scouts instead and chose this offer over all those exceedingly logical ones. By the way, isn't Pods/Vizcaino for Carlos Lee actually Todd Ritchie II? Or Durham for Jon Adkins? Ah...the Pods trade worked out in a way, didn't it? You also have to look at who KW uses that money on...like when we let Maggs/Lee/Valentin go and brought in El Duque, AJ, Hermanson, Pods, Iguchi, Vizcaino, etc.

QUOTE (WHITESOXRANDY @ Nov 14, 2008 -> 01:16 AM) There's no way that I believe that Kenny could not have gotten 1 good player back for Swisher from any team. Not one team would offer a solid regular thirdbaseman, secondbaseman, starting picther, relief pitcher, outfielder or B prospect? I don't believe it. The Yankees wouldn't have offered Ian Kennedy straight up for him? Or any of their top 10 prospects? I don't believe it. And, and, and the Sox throw in a solid pitching prospect, too? I'm sorry but I think this trade will go down with the Todd Ritchie trade. I know that Kenny has proven himself to be an excellent GM to me and I want to give every deal the benefit of the doubt. But, I can't with this one. There's no way that Swisher is going to suck for the rest of his career. And, more importantly, other teams such as the Yankees don't believe that. He had to be worth something and he gave him away for nothing. I'll go on record right now as saying that none of these 3 players will amount to anything for the White Sox - next year or ever. Unbelievable. If I'm wrong on this one then Kenny is a magician and I'll never question him again. But, I still say this is Todd Ritchie part 2. And you've seen how many of those three guys....maybe Betemit...play how much? What did you say on the day we acquired the following players: Marte Contreras Jenks Thornton Ramirez Quentin Floyd Olivo (BB really suckered KW, right!?) Dye Garcia Danks Pods Iguchi Takatsu Hermanson Cotts Politte El Duque etc. Comparing this to Ritchie is crazy. Ritchie was going to be a frontline starter, maybe a 3, no worse than a 4. Swisher didn't have a position on this team going forward, with the presence of Dye/Quentin/Thome/Konerko. To compare the desperation of the Ritchie move (with a very solid prospect in K. Wells and a back of the rotation guy in Fogg) with dumping Swisher's contract on another team, well, there's no comparison here.

http://blogs.chicagosports.chicagotribune....rs-and-sen.html KW on the trade, some interesting/telling quotes.

With Uribe getting further decreased playing time in 09, I don't think it would make any sense to keep him around hoping to get a compensation pick. Thanks for the memories, Juan. I never missed Aaron Miles like some of his grinder groupies.

QUOTE (thomsonmi @ Nov 14, 2008 -> 12:33 AM) A whole bunch of them were acquired with players whom KW did draft. Criticizing KW because we don't have enough homegrown Credes/Rowands/Buehrle's to cheer on for ten years or so as they develop in our system is kind of getting a little bit nitpicky. Sure, I'd like to have Chris Young patrolling CF as much as the next person...but KW has always done a very good job of realistically appraising what he has on his 25 man, 40 man and minor league depth charts (the Big Board) and using those chess pieces to help him put together the most competitive team each season. When it looked like he needed to rebuild, he kept Dye/Buehrle and had the magic touch with bringing in four incredibly talented young players to revitalize our core. Turning Borchard into Thornton, getting Jenks for nothing, Ramirez for nothing (when all the other teams were laughing at us behind our backs....we'll see the laughing now about Viciedo, NOT!)...Garcia for Morse/Reed/Olivo, he's just been very, very efficient at identifying the players he likes and going out to acquire them. Perhaps, in my opinion, the most important move of his GM career was bringing over Contreras, because he was the horse/ace that this team has very rarely had in the last decade. Contreras, for a 4-5 month stretch of 05/06, was undoubtedly the best pitcher in baseball. Whether it has worked (Marte for Guerrier) or not (David Wells, Colon, Ritchie, Swisher, Cabrera, Alex Cintron, Mackowiak), he always is thinking almost like a fan and less of a GM. That can be a weakness, but I see it as a strength as well. He's also learned the importance of pitching depth and balance (speed/defense), and you'll see him correct the 06-07 errors going forward...

I have changed over the years from KW skeptic to supporter. The 2005 WS championship had something to do with it, of course, but he's also gotten better as time as gone by...not shaking up things or making trades just to be aggressive, but thinking strategically and more long-term, rather than just putting the best possible team together to win the World Series each season (he's also learned that for every Ramirez/Quentin, there are many more Julio Ramirezes, D'Angelo Jimenezes, Royce Clayton's or Kenny Lofton's that can seriously mess up your clubhouse chemistry...you can add O-Cab and Swisher to that list as well). If I wasn't convinced before, the transition from 07 to 08 really did the trick. He's earned our respect and patience/confidence. We have to sit back and see what happens before Spring Training...but, as always, a premature rush to conclusions does no good. In the early years, he had some bad trades like the Ritchie one, Adkins for Durham, Berry/Barry disaster with the LA Dodgers...but he's gotten better and better. If you look at all the players we've jettisoned over the years, which ones would definitely make our ballclub in 2009? I can think of only a couple...Frank Francisco out of the bullpen as a set-up guy (potential closer) and Ryan Sweeney, who I'd take over Anderson/Wise, etc., as the fourth outfielder, but not as the starter in CF. Other than those two names...and Chris B. Young (that trade has been argued to death, I've always been on the side of Chris Young over Javy)...who have we actually lost? Rauch? Well, he was a failed starter, and there were a lot of chemistry/personality issues with the front office behind the scenes...the return from his labrum injury (he didn't work with Sox staff/trainers like he was expected to), his "overconfidence" when he was barely touching 90 MPH yet thinking he should have a spot in the rotation. McCarthy? Besides that, you have Rowand/Thome, but I think we're better off with Jim's big LH bat...and that homer against the Twinkies will always hold a special place in our hearts now.

QUOTE (winninguglyin83 @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 09:36 PM) like Floyd, Marquez has been pitching in the Arizona Fall League. Kenny Williams and his top scouts are out there watching. I'm sure they had Coop or Kirk Champion take a look. they must see something they like. And they must be convinced Swish can't cut it no mo. Kenny laid it on pretty thick about how he expects Swishy to bounce back. I just hope this doesn't trumpet the arrival of the Jerry Owens Era in CF. Not when Taveras is out there for Broadway or Adam Russell and CoCo Crisp (who KW has always liked) is available.

QUOTE (winninguglyin83 @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 09:20 PM) how about this from the New York Daily News: "The Yankees believe Swisher’s poor average was a function of a strained relationship with Chisox manager Ozzie Guillen, major-league sources said." Swishy no likey Ozzie. If true, we'll hear more because Swish likes to talk. But that must be the buzz among scouts. No secret that O-Cabrera and Swisher weren't great fans of Ozzie. Well, duh. But here's the thing, what does it tell you that Ozzie was starting DeWayne Wise over you in the most important games of the season? Ozzie will always have his detractors...but, when it comes down to it...he's managed to push the 2005 and 2008 teams over the hump when their backs were against the wall and many skeptical fans were giving them up for dead. Swisher, in many ways, his actions in the clubhouse and on the bench, acted like he had quit when he stopped playing everyday, and more like someone trying out for the daytime Emmy's or SNL. I don't think it's any surprise Hall is also out the door...there's a few things I'm sure we're not privy to (besides the reaction of Dye to the pie in the face one too many times)...but KW seems to be cleaning house and trying to get rid of the round pegs that don't fit into the square holes. Good luck in NY Nick, you'll need it.

QUOTE (nitetrain8601 @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 08:56 PM) Kazmir has been doing the same. Gimme a young Kazmir any day of the week. Are you really comparing Kazmir's stuff/ability with Gio Gonzalez? I think that Gio is closer to Arnie Munoz/Mike Porzio/Josh Stewart right now than Kazmir. He has a pretty good hook, but the Zito hype was a bit much. It's not as good as Gavin's when he is on...and his fastball tends to be pretty flat, and the velocity isn't all that overwhelming either.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 09:05 PM) Its a scouting report from 2005. It has his ETA as 2007. I'm thinking he hasn't lived up to the report. KW has hit the jackpot on a few pitchers, he's also crapped out on several. I think expecting either of the 2 guys acquired today to be contributors in 2009 is a reach. Nunez >>> Adam Russell for sure We'll see Nunez worked slowly into the bullpen, with the eventually idea that he becomes a replacement for Dotel. The White Sox can either sit on Dotel's contract and hope he doesn't hurt and we can get Type A compensation down the line...or we deal his salary, which is quite high for a set-up man, and trade him to a team desperate for a closer at below $10 million per season. Marquez will be given an opportunity to compete with Richard, Broadway, Carrasco, Egbert, etc., coming into ST. I mean, how many here really expected Gavin Floyd to explode on the scene after the way he ended up mentally a basket case in PHILLY? If you also thought Ramirez and Quentin would be ROY, All-Star, MVP caliber players for the Sox from the day we acquired them...well, there aren't very many posts to back that up. With Quentin and Danks, you knew the talent was there. Look at it this way...we have another arm (a former first rounder, just like Broadway or McCulloch) that another team was once really high on, in fact, he was considered a Top 10 prospect as little as one season ago. As BA noted, Nunez has the most upside. And Betemit might end up surprising a few people...it's not the like the guy's on the wrong side of 30, he's around Alexei's age, although he seems older because he's been a prospect for so long.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 08:47 PM) I'm telling you guys, Sweeney's gonna break out next year with a full year of pro-ball under his belt. He might not be some super star, but he'd be a solid piece on any team. I think he'd play great D in LF for us (He could play RF with his arm, but I like my LF's to throw lefty, and my RF's to throw righty), hit around .290 or higher, not K a ton, get a lot of doubles, hit at least 15 homers (if not in the 20's), and be a very solid run producer. Well, I guess it will be interesting to see who has more impact next season at the MLB level...Betemit, Nunez and Marquez, or Ryan Sweeney? I don't think we'll see Gio Gonzalez again as a starter again with the A's, maybe out of the bullpen. He didn't have one quality start. He did have a couple of nice outings, but his ERA reached almost 10 at one point. 6 IP, 4 ER (TOR) 5 IP, 1 ER (against TB, that's more impressive) 5 IP, 2 ER/4 R (at Seattle) But he really got his pitch count up...he just couldn't go deep into any of his starts, past 6.0 IP.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 07:49 PM) Well if this guy is supposed to be MLB ready and play 3B next season, KW just said Betimet and Fields are his thirdbasemen. They said some teams were looking at him as a RF, and Dye is supposedly being shopped. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.............................. Yeah, that's one of the intriguing things about this kid, he's SUPPOSED to have a great arm. Maybe Cubano has more insight, but some of the reports have said he was a pitcher previously and threw upper 80's/low 90's but has given that up a long time ago. That said, in current condition, Jermaine Dye would look like Roberto Clemente compared to this kid lumbering around out there.

QUOTE (nitetrain8601 @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 08:11 PM) No, the sources for PED's is Soxtalk posters. There is nothing credible that links Swisher and PED's. As far as the coaching staff, they jacked him up a bit, especially Walker from what KW said. As for his off the field issues, I cannot defend that, even though I really don't know of any. I mean, I he sulked at himself when he was doing terrible, but at least he held himself accountable. I'm not a huge Swisher fan like a ton of people here, nor do I hate the guy either. But you are bringing up allegations brought forth by a message board who had their own ideas. Innocent until proven guilty. I haven't heard anything other than Soxtalk even say anything about the coaching staff hating him. They benched him when he should've been benched. I never heard anyone and I mean anyone link him to PED's besides the wonderful posters of Soxtalk. I'm not saying it isn't possible for all of this to be true, but I have a hard time believing it when the best source provided is a few guys from Soxtalk say, "He was probably on 'roids" when he was sucking and then running with that. And I also don't think Swisher will have as terrible of a year as he did. I would be shocked. As for the rest of it, I didn't like giving up Gio much less DLS and Sweeney for Swisher at all. Gio > Swisher. You STILL feel that way about Gio after this year, or did at THAT time? Sweeney never was a good fit playing in a stadium like USCF as a corner outfielder...like Swisher, he's just not an everyday CFer on a championship-caliber team. A nice piece to have, maybe, upside is a poor man's David DeJesus, but not an impact player. Everyone keeps on waiting for that 15-18 homer power to develop and they're still waiting.

They had it for David Wells back in 2001. Maybe it has become prohibitively expensive...with all the losses at places like AIG, lol. Funny, the insurance companies were also so greedy, they didn't understand the inherent risks in the debt instruments any better than the banks...probably had less knowledge, in fact, of how they might blow up in their faces. Actually, though, I thought it was Lloyd's of London that issued that policy for Wells. Not 100% sure. But it did give us back about 55-60% of his salary for that one season.

QUOTE (Kenny Hates Prospects @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 04:54 PM) I'd have no problem with Murphy, but if it's Jenks we're dealing I'd like to see Kenny aim a little higher, like Fernando Martinez + Jon Niese or something. I just really don't want to see Kenny sell low on Jenks or settle for a "good deal" on Jenks. I want Kenny to start asking for these ridiculous packages that teams like the Orioles ask for their complimentary players. Jenks is a guy that actually is worth a ton. For Dye or Vazquez I think Murphy could be a nice centerpiece, although I'd prefer a CF prospect if at all possible since those are so hard to come by. Texas has a buttload of those, if they'd be interested in any of our guys. Atlanta has a couple, although they're rumored to be dealing my favorite one (Gorkys) for Peavy, plus Schafer is coming off a suspension for roids and Heyward is supposed to be untouchable. TEX has been linked often to the K-Rod sweepstakes, so I can see them also being willing to look at Jenks, because of the salary being so much lower, even in his arbitration years. As far as Price goes, another LH pitcher I remember being overhyped was the Tigers' Andrew Miller. The first time I saw him, I was like, this is the "power pitcher the Sox are supposed to be cowering in front of...???" I haven't seen Price pitch, so I'll defer to those who have, as some here are relying more on scouting reports, others on seeing him pitch at Vandy, others on what he did in the playoffs (or didn't do).

As far as offering Uribe arbitration, that could be dangerous. The whole reason we're making these moves is to clear some salary space and become more flexible and younger (although Swisher was in the prime of his career, SUPPOSEDLY). Uribe's Type B, correct? I think the risk is too high he accepts and ends up returning...and we end up paying him $4-5 million like we have the last couple of seasons, as if he's a starter. Betemit will be on our roster...90% chance that it's as the utility/supersub spot once occupied by Ozuna. If we did bring back Uribe, we might have Fields, Viciedo (if he signs), Betemit, Ramirez, Getz, Beckham, Nix and Uribe...I just think he's a little redundant at this point. Maybe KW is thinking differently, but I doubt it. BUT things can and will change by the minute with KW at the helm. Nunez, 22, has the best arm and upside of any prospect in the deal. The Yankees landed him earlier this year from the Nationals in the Alberto Gonzalez deal, and moved him from the rotation to the bullpen. He originally signed with the Dodgers in 2003 out of the Dominican Republic and came to the Nationals in a 2006 trade for Marlon Anderson. Nunez has a live arm and shows two plus pitches at times—a fastball that sits at 92-94 mph, touching 95, and a slider that he throws with some power that has inconsistent tilt. He throws from a low arm slot and was outstanding after the Yankees made what one club official termed "mechanical bad habits . . . he has much better balance now." He was 2-8, 5.22 as a starter at high Class A Potomac, but as a reliever in the Double-A Eastern League, with Harrisburg and then Trenton, he went 1-0, 1.65 in 27 innings, striking out 34, and had 116 whiffs in 108 innings overall. He had three saves and seven strikeouts in five scoreless innings in the EL playoffs. Marquez, 24, endured a difficult season, getting knocked around in Triple-A before being sent back to Trenton in the second half. A 2004 supplemental first-round pick, he entered 2008 as the Yankees' No. 7 prospect but would have ranked in the 21-30 range this season had he remained a Yankee. Marquez made progress with his changeup and curve in 2007 but was back to relying almost exclusively on his 88-92 mph sinker (which can reach a bit higher) and adding a slider in '08. He's a defense-dependent, early-contact kind of pitcher who lacks a strikeout pitch. Overall, he was 8-8, 4.47 with just 51 strikeouts in 102 2/3 innings. He finished strong, pitching well during Trenton's Eastern League title run, and is pitching for Peoria in the Arizona Fall League (1-2, 4.50). Betemit, 27, was the Braves' top prospect in 2001-2002 but has yet to establish himself as more than a solid role player due to poor plate discipline. He played all four infield spots for the Yankees this year, hitting .265/.289/.429 with six home runs and an ugly 6-56 walk-strikeout ratio. His career ratio is 108-314 with a .260/.325/.437 line. He's a switch-hitting option at third base for the White Sox if they do not re-sign free agent Joe Crede. Swisher's success in New York will be the key to the deal from New York's standpoint; Texeira is redundant in a system full of similar fastball-slider relief pitchers, such as Anthony Claggett. The White Sox hope pitching coach Don Cooper and pitching coordinator Kirk Champion can work the same magic with Marquez that they have for the likes of Gavin Floyd and John Danks and pick up a potential power arm for the '09 bullpen in Nunez.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/major...008/267179.html My thoughts, waking up at 904 am in Thailand and missing all the excitement. Nunez, as mentioned in the article, will be a key part of the bullpen and could be seen as a replacement for Dotel (if KW deals him) and insurance for Linebrink... Marquez will join the likes of Richard, Poreda, DJ Carrasco, Egbert, Broadway (if not traded) in the battle for the 5th starter's job. From everything I've read, he's sort of like a cross between Slowey and Jon Garland, but we shouldn't expect too many miracles with him. It does seem like Poreda will start off in the pen, although ST could be the determining factor. Betemit is two things, insurance for Fields and not signing Viciedo at 3B, insurance at SS for Ramirez (who could move back to 2B or to CF as well) and another warm body to compete with Getz/Nix at 2B, who are all basically holding the fort down while Beckham theoretically tears through the minors on the way to an August recall, or possibly earlier depending on what happens in ST. He's obviously very comfortable in AZ. Looking at the article, you get the sense that KW's scouts have been waiting in the weeds to pounce on Marquez and Nunez...and here's yet another chance for Don Cooper to earn his money with both these young guys. I'm not going to write off any KW trade when he acquires young pitchers with potential who are close to big league ready...it could go the way of Aardsma/Sisco or the success they've had with Matty Thornton. KW does like his former first rounders though...I think at one point, we had the most in the major leagues (Floyd and Danks are part of that group as well). I'm not expecting Nunez to be like Jenks or anything like that...but let's just sit back, strap it on, and wait to see how it all plays out. Obviously, this is the official death knell of the Juan Uribe years...thanks for that .400 average for 2 months when your first season, 2005 and the final two months of 2008. You won't be forgotten, Lizard. Now KW goes out and brings in Taveras, CoCo Crisp, etc., to be the starting CF. I saw the name Dickerson mentioned...he also could be one to watch, although KW will want a more proven player IMO.

If I was Friedman, I wouldn't dare take on Octavio Dotel OR his contract. I wouldn't feel very confident about acquiring Wasserman, who wasn't good enough to pitch for the White Sox...a team with multiple issues in its bullpen down the stretch who essentially relied on DJ Carrasco, a Japanese castoff, for much of a 3-4 week stretch when the likes of Wasserman, MacDougal, Russell, etc., could NOT be counted on. I understand dumping salary...but getting rid of Wheeler and Bradford for about the same amount as Dotel...well, I wouldn't do that. Neither Wheeler nor Bradford are capable of being closers, but I don't think Dotel is either, based on his career track record (before injuries) and how he did in the majority of high pressure situations in July/August/September of 2008. I also can't imagine they would give up their #3 RHSP prospect in this deal at all...sure, Niemann's available, maybe even McGee, but Davis isn't going anywhere unless we significantly sweeten the pot. Just because they have a lot of depth right now doesn't guarantee there won't be injuries or performance issues...look at the depth we had in 2000-2001 ("waves and waves" of pitching were on the horizon, a Braves-like dynasty was a common description) and how quickly all of it went south. Just sit on that depth until someone gets REALLY desperate and they make an offer you can't refuse. There's nothing FORCING the Rays to move their depth yet...they have plenty of time to wait for the best offer/s.

I want O-Cabrera with the Twins... 1) To see how poor his range looks on turf (they could have kept a younger/better version in Bartlett at 1/15th the cost), 2) To see the White Sox take Twins' draft picks for compensation, 3) To see us beat the Twins again and O-Cabrera finally miss out on the playoffs 4) Maybe to see Balfour taunt him again...that was good stuff, like K-G and Jose Calderon (Raptors)